Posted on 12/17/2011 9:58:17 PM PST by Seizethecarp
Gutfeld: So, um, do you feel that you have settled that question about the origins of, ah, ah, President Obama's birth certificate?
Trump: Well, yeah, look, look, very simple, and you know I was on Barbara Walters yesterday she asked the question. Unfortunately, she cut the hell out of my answer and left like the last three words and people don't know what it, what it meant. Although I was honored to be on, but, you know, she cut that in, but she asked the same thing. Look, his mother, to the best of everybodies knowledge, was never in that hospital. OK. The document may have been tampered with according to many, many people. OK. You've got grandmothers and you have people in his family who say he wasn't born in this country. OK. Forgetting all of that, do I think he was born here? I have no Idea. I personally cannot say one way or the other. You know that the mother, there are no records. There are no records that the mother was ever in the hospital. With all of that being said, folks, I'd rather focus on the economy and jobs and how to get the country back. But, ah, If you ask me was he born (here?) I really can't tell you.
David wrote:
“... In looking at the hard data time line I posted earlier, you can see that Roman in fact might have arrived as late as February of 1961...”
How about March 11th?
https://m.facebook.com/roman.ekua/about?lst=100001620512614%3A100001127646249%3A1542255855
David wrote:
“... In looking at the hard data time line I posted earlier, you can see that Roman in fact might have arrived as late as February of 1961...”
How about March 11th?
https://m.facebook.com/roman.ekua/about?lst=100001620512614%3A100001127646249%3A1542255855
I have always thought Anna and Roman spent time at Martha Washington; before they moved to Capital Hill. January has always seemed tight.
18 months old would have been 18 months after July of 59 which would have been February; born in the last half of July would not make 19 months until March.
David, WH57 is referring to the birthdate claimed by ‘Roman’ on his facebook page. We had this discussion years ago, when he used the same date on his vanity pages as plain old Roman Obama when he was still in Accra, Ghana. He removed those pages from the web, when he disappeared for a while and turned up with Ekua added to his name, in the US...what we really need to see is a fake birth certificate with that March 11, on it...and a mother’s maiden name for a woman born in 1964.Sarc
It’s possible the gap between that birthdate of January 8 and what tallies with your calculations, was the period during which ANNA was still in Honolulu with her child, Abercrombie wasn’t lying when he said he saw the Kenyan with Ann/Anna on social occasions. He was convinced the girl and child he saw had to be Stanley Ann Dunham and zero, convinced enough to declare I WAS HERE WHEN THAT CHILD WAS BORN and brave enough to attempt to find that birth certificate once and for all.
THERE WAS NOTHING THERE, he said, remember?
If Mary’s recollection was for something that began late in January or early February, her daughter would still be around 18 months of age if born sometime in July 1959.
Just why are splitting hairs to this extent? Charlette Le Fevre came up with February/March 1962, and no one said a word...
ADDITIONAL:
https://www.mylife.com/gabrielle-toutonghi/e303937578426
Gabrielle Toutonghi is 59 years old and was born on 7/6/1959. Currently, she lives in Seattle, WA. Sometimes Gabrielle goes by various nicknames including gabrielle m toutonghi and gabrielle m greene. Her ethnicity is Caucasian, whose political affiliation is currently a registered Republican; and religious views are listed as Christian
~~~
Figures, if that is correct, then the original article by Charlette Le Fevre showed an incorrect birthdate for Gabrielle.
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/seattletimes/obituary.aspx?pid=187624856
He was a gentleman, a Christian and a Republican.
ADDITIONAL; JOSEPH
In all fairness to Joseph, I doubt if he had any idea of what was going on, he and Mary divorced in the seventies iirc. Here’s something Joseph wrote in 2006:
Regardless of what misguided liberals and the Democrat Party thinks ours is a Christian Nation. From its founders to the present. I am an immigrant from a Moslem country and the main reason I am in this country since 1946 is that in the moderate Moslim country I’m from there was no future unless you were Moslem. I don’t think there is any good reason to change what we have done for hundreds of years in our country to accomodate a handful of immigrants Who demand we change our culture for their convenience. If they don’t believe in the Bible that is fine neither does an atheist a Hindu or a criminal and so on…. We should still demand that they take the oath on the Bible as that is meaningful to us. If they violate that oath they should suffer the consequences.
Comment by joseph toutonghi — December 21, 2006 @ 10:36 pm
138 posted on 04/12/2011 6:46:29 PM PDT by Fred Nerks (FAIR DINKUM!)
The only locations I can find for “Martha Washington Home for Unwed Mothers” are in Wisconsin (Milwaukee, Wauwatosa).
Also known as “Booth Unwed Mother’s Home”.
No locations in Washington State.
Wake up, it was 58 or so years ago, in 2008 on their facebook pages, the Toutognhi offspring discussed how they used to go there as children, when it was an abandoned building, and hunt through the broken furniture, looking at names and initials carved in the wood.
You are a decade late to the party.
David, this might be it?
“Name: Martha Washington School for Girls
Description: Located at 6612 57th Avenue S. Brighton Beach on Lake Washington, the site is now Martha Washington Park, but in the early 1920’s it was a boarding school for delinquent girls. It’s also known as “The Martha Washington School for Insane Girls”. Rumors of violence committed by both the students and the staff surround the school, including multiple suicides and murders. Residents in the area were always uneasy with its presence and continually asked that the school be moved. This along with extreme budget cuts led to the closure of the school in the early 1970s – only to have the abandoned buildings taken over by a satanic group several years later. After over a decade of complaints about vandalism, animal sacrifices, and other strange goings on, the city council finally voted to demolish the historic buildings and turn the site into a park.”
That's silly. The building still exists--I have driven by it recently, I think on NE 50th or 55th. Martha Washington Home for Unwed Mothers. Closed a number of years ago.
When they closed the home, Barrack II's true mother's family made a big deal out of participating in the clean up. They are influential members of the U of W establishment and wanted to be sure there were no loose ends that would tie the Obama name to a resident of the home in 1961.
So it wasn’t the place that was demolished already? That address was shown as:
6612 57th Avenue S. Brighton Beach on Lake Washington
Anyway, I’m fast running out of puff, this nit-picking isn’t making any progress, I do have better things to do than go back ten years over old stuff.
It’s all just too repetitious. Good night.
Fred Nerks wrote:
“Wake up, it was 58 or so years ago, in 2008 on their facebook pages, the Toutognhi offspring discussed how they used to go there as children, when it was an abandoned building, and hunt through the broken furniture, looking at names and initials carved in the wood.
You are a decade late to the party.”
Did anyone get screen caps of those Facebook pages?
David wrote:
“”The only locations I can find for “Martha Washington Home for Unwed Mothers” are in Wisconsin (Milwaukee, Wauwatosa). Also known as “Booth Unwed Mother’s Home”. No locations in Washington State.”
That’s silly. The building still exists—I have driven by it recently, I think on NE 50th or 55th. Martha Washington Home for Unwed Mothers. Closed a number of years ago.
When they closed the home, Barrack II’s true mother’s family made a big deal out of participating in the clean up. They are influential members of the U of W establishment and wanted to be sure there were no loose ends that would tie the Obama name to a resident of the home in 1961.”
OK, if “Barrack II’s true mother” had had him in Washington state, his citizenship/parentage status would have been :
Unmarried non-citizen mom, U.S. citizen dad who didn’t acknowledge paternity, kid born in U.S.
Dual citizenship?; U.S. (born here) and British (mom).
Still disqualifies Barrack II from being President; he’d need —both— parents to be U.S. citizens at the time of his birth and be born on U.S. soil in order to be eligible.
To WH57’s #434:
Let’s get the players straight.
Although we can’t prove all the facts that support the following analysis; we think this is a fair summary that fits many of the facts we do know. Far from conclusive but a reasonable analysis.
Roman was born to Anna Tout originally with the name of Barack Hussein Obama Jr.
Barack II, Barry, nominal President of the US really had nothing to do with Barack Hussein Obama Sr.
Senior first met Stanley Ann Dunham in Boston in 1962 where she was, as Ayers has her saying in Dreams, only acting as a glorified baby sitter Au Paire when she picked up Barry where he was born and took him to Boston to a home owned by the sister of Barry’s true father.
We don’t know for sure where Roman was born. I think the history of the birth at Coast Provincial General Hospital in Mombasa and Barry’s later day claims to have been born there is sufficient smoke coupled with the missionary related mother, to think Roman was born there so he (Roman) arrived by plane with his mother Anna Tout in Vancouver BC and they returned to Seattle in January of 1961.
They originally lived in the Martha Washington Home for Unwed Mothers, a well known established home in North Seattle which has now been closed for maybe thirty years +/-. Presumably for a short time in January of 1961.
When the home closed, a work party including a number of members of the family of the true mother of Barry (Barack II) made a point of participation in clean up at the home for the purpose of being sure there was nothing around the home that might identify the Obama identity to the home.
The true mother was never there—she delivered Barry at a hospital in Canada and immediately returned to her home and place of occupation in another country.
Roman and Anna Tout moved fairly shortly from the Home to a Boarding House on Capital Hill which was operated by Joseph Toutonghi and his wife Mary; we believe that Joseph’s brother John had a relationship with the owner of the house, I think as a partner or managing partner of the partnership that owned it. It doesn’t bother me that Mary might have said she baby sat the boy when her own child was 18 months, having been born in July of 59—in fact her daughter would have been 18 months after January until sometime in February when she became 19 months.
Now you have a woman named Anna Tout moving, in relatively desperate circumstances, a minority with a minority child, to a home operated by some people named Tout. I infer but cannot prove a prior relationship—I don’t think she just picked this boarding house out of a want ad. Others may differ.
It doesn’t have an obvious relationship to the fact that the Tout brothers were also cousin’s of Barack #II (Obama)’s true mother. Again, it is easy to speculate that the cousin relationship had something to do with the final outcome involving substitution of identities—John Toutonghi was a strong guy to whom people might have turned for help in sorting out a couple of unplanned and inconvenient pregnancies.
Gossip at the time of a subsequent John Toutonghi marriage was that he had been previously married to a woman who ran off after bearing him a son, John Jr. who is shown in Ancestry records as without a mother unlike John Sr.’s several later children.
Good question. I’m still kicking myself that I didn’t.
OK, refiguring for Barry/Barrack II
if “Barrack II’s true mother” had had him in Canada, his citizenship/parentage status would have been :
Unmarried non-citizen mom,
U.S. citizen dad who didn’t acknowledge paternity,
kid born in Canada.
Barry would have British (mom) citizenship, since Barry’s real dad didn’t acknowledge paternity, and pass U.S. citizenship to Barry.
This disqualifies Barry/Barrack II from being President; he’d need —both— parents to be U.S. citizens at the time of his birth and be born on U.S. soil in order to be eligible.
And now you know why I call him zero, and keep saying, you don't know who his parents were and you don't know where he was born or his birth-name.
if “Barrack II’s true mother” had had him in Canada, his citizenship/parentage status would have been :
Unmarried non-citizen mom,
U.S. citizen dad who didn’t acknowledge paternity,
kid born in Canada.
Barry would have British (mom) citizenship, since Barry’s real dad didn’t acknowledge paternity, and pass U.S. citizenship to Barry.
This disqualifies Barry/Barrack II from being President; he’d need —both— parents to be U.S. citizens at the time of his birth and be born on U.S. soil in order to be eligible.
That is kind of loose although it is essentially accurate as is your bottom line.
The Natural Born Citizen clause is to some degree uncertain. And there is a good deal of uncertainty here on this board about how it might operate.
Historically, Constitutional Lawyers viewed the clause as requiring birth within the geographical limits of the states. It wasn't much of a move to say Goldwater might have been eligible even though Arizona was not a state when he was born because it was subsequently admitted--the further problem for Goldwater was that he was born in an area of Arizona which was still subject to a claim of jurisdiction by Mexico--which might have rendered the issue uncertain.
But you have to look at these cases from the practical litigator's point of view--in the modern world, the Supreme Court is going to apply a looser standard. Exactly how loose is not clear but no matter how loose, I think you are correct, based on what I know, Barry flunked.
The next level after the "born in the geographical territory of the United States" is "Birthright Citizenship"--a person born outside the territory but who became a citizen when he dropped out of the birth canal maybe is Natural Born.
So you need to look at the citizenship statutes which have been a moving target over the last fifty or sixty years.
All that said, when Barry was born, to a mother who was not a citizen and had no connection to the US; and a father who is the kind of ancestral citizen envisioned by the founders; he isn't a citizen at birth because the Citizenship at Birth outside the US statute at that time provides that a person born under those circumstances is not a citizen.
That case has been specifically litigated to the Supreme Court on the sauce for the gander ought to be the same for the goose argument and the Supreme Court said "no way". 8 to 1 if my memory is correct.
The issue has major consequences today.
Again there is misunderstanding about the law. We have legions of cases where installation in political office is held to involved procedural political questions--once the guy is installed, he is in.
Not the way "qualification to hold office" works. A person who is not eligible to hold an office does not hold it no matter that he or she is procedurally and properly installed. If the analysis set out here is correct, Barry was not and never will be President of the United States. And his claimed acts, to the extent such acts require a "President" to implement, are Void.
The Supreme Court appointments of Kegan and Sotomayor required a "Constitutional President" to make and they didn't have one.
It is generally understood that Barry gave a bunch of pardon's on the way out the door. Those also require a President and he wasn't.
I believe that Joseph Biden has been Acting President for the last eight years under Section 3 of the Twentieth Amendment to the US Constitution which specifically provides that if the President elect fails qualification, the Vice President shall act as president until a qualified person appears as President.
If I had been counsel at the point in time, I would have had Biden sign the pardon's and then although I delivered them to the pardoned party, I would have concealed them. In fact, pardons were delivered and have been concealed--maybe that is why because having Biden sign confirming the pardon is effectively admission that Obama was not qualified.
I don't think they could have done that with the Supreme Court appointments.
Fred Nerks wrote:
“..
She’s photographed in the back row of this group of foreign students in Hawaii, the Kenyan is in the front row with his pipe. ...”
So Julia/Juliana went to school with the Kenyan student Barack 0?
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2278969/posts?page=1155#1155
Article with pic here says :
Barack Obama Senior (seated centre) and a Kenyan colleague, Williamson Gor Obadha (checked coat) with school mates at the University of Hawaii Honolulu. PHOTO| FILE
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