Posted on 11/13/2011 5:15:53 AM PST by Colonel Kangaroo
Ron Paul, the outspoken libertarian congressman and Republican presidential candidate from Texas, disagreed with his fellow GOP hopefuls on the issue of Iranian nuclear weapons at the CBS/National Journal debate on Saturday.
While Paul refused to rule out the possibility of war with Iran, he insisted a war would not be worthwhile and that the president should go to Congress before launching any military action.
“The only way you would do that is you would have to go to the Congress,” he said. “We as commander in chief aren’t making the decision to go to war. The old fashioned way, the Constitution, you go to the Congress and find out if our national security is threatened and I’m afraid what’s going on right now is similar to the war propaganda that went on against Iraq.”
Paul went on to say that he considered the Iraq War a “tragedy.”
Both former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney and former House Speaker Newt Gingrich were far more hawkish in their assessments of the threat posed by Iranian nuclear weapons program. Romney said “crippling sanctions” should be put into effect. If those fail to halt the nation’s weapons progress, however, Romney said military action should be considered because the idea of a nuclear-armed Iran was “unacceptable.”
“We will not allow Iran to have a nuclear weapon,” he said.
Gingrich said would adopt an “absolute strategic program comparable to what President Reagan, Pope John Paul II and Margaret Thatcher did to the Soviet Union” utilizing every “possible aspect short of war of breaking the [Iranian] regime and bringing it down.” He said the U.S. should also embrace covert operations “to block and disrupt the Iranian program, including taking out their scientists, including breaking up their systems, all of it covertly, all of it deniable.”
Should covert operations and other activities fail, Gingrich said that military action should be considered. “I agree with Governor Romney,” he said. “If in the end despite all of those things, the dictatorship persists, you have to take whatever steps are necessary to break the capacity to have a nuclear weapon.”
Nothing says “Top Secret Mission” better that 435 members of congress debating it. If we found it necessary to launch a black-ops sortie with a mission to take out a Nuclear Weapons Site, the top priority must be to keep it secret.
If Paul feels this way why hasn’t he tried to impeach Obama?
Ron Paul also believes we should all wear lime jello on our heads and cluck like chickens. Libertarian=Democrat who doesn’t want to pay taxes.
We have been doing things stupid lately, starting wars but never defining or declaring them. It is like girls getting pregnant and then deciding whether they want to get married or not. Well you got the baby now, so you better do something. Starting a war without consulting and receiving the consensus of the full representative government is a formula for stupid. It is a formula for “video game” idea of war - Americans support them as long as they don't seem quite real (no bond rallies, no personal sacrifices).
Going to war without declaration serves to hide the fact that we fight too many wars, that we are like the world of 1984, where we are perpetually at war and therefore perpetually justified in the suppression of native liberties and standards of republican government. 24 x 7 marital law is the inevitable result of the practices of late.
No one is saying otherwise other than Obama.
LMAO! Like i said - you favor obama starting wars all on his own. Got it.
Let me ask you something - if obama orders a draft for you to go fight Iran, will you go?
Hussein doesn’t need no stinkin’ Congress. He’s The Won! He can and does do anything he wants.
We won’t go to war with Iran. A muslim can’t go against another muslim. He won’t tick off his brotherhood buddies.
No. He has nothing of the sort. His DUTY is to uphold his sworn oath and follow Constitutional provisions.
How many times have you heard, "I was for the war before I was against it." It'll be the same old, same old.
Late here & I got to get some sleep. So, I’ll respond briefly.
Sanctions won’t work & won’t change the Iranian people. More importantly, sanctions certainly won’t change the Regime & ‘its behavior’. Regarding Iranian people & their reaction, my concern is *how* an attack on Iran is *managed & executed* - that’s the key. Anyway, even to take out the nuke facilities, Israel won’t be able to manage that alone at all. Like I said in last post, Iran is not Iraq. Iran requires much more planning, know-how & detailed execution (in fact more than US & Israeli involvement). If not properly executed, and I don’t mean just deactivating or bombing nuke sites, it’ll have serious repercussions, unlike Iraq or Libya.
Yes, ideally, the US should stay out of the ME, N. Africa, etc.. and be self-sufficient in energy. Fact is the US is not, and it is not simply a matter of self-sufficiency. Post WWII, the US became a global player & geopolitics changed. Ever since, she has triggered a chain-reaction (thru various foreign & domestic policies) that seems to exacerbate tensions in the long-run, economically & politically. Fact is the US can’t get out of this by quitting now. And, I don’t think she (American gov’t) wants to quit either.
Rep. Paul is correct. Last night Newt led the way articulating the foreign policy of unconstitutionl hubris. Sadly, this approach is supported by the GOP base.
“His DUTY is to uphold his sworn oath”
Part of his oath is to protect the country.
The President doesn’t have to sit there with his thumb up his butt and wait for congress to give him permission to protect the country.
Thanks for reply. That's probably the understatement of the year. How wars start is a known but how they progress and end is always an unknown. The walk in the park Iraq War turned out to be anything but. Americans are sick of war and as a nation we can't begin to afford another. We can't even take care of our existing vets.
Fact is the US can’t get out of this by quitting now. And, I don’t think she (American gov’t) wants to quit either.
Either we hunker in and rebuild the USA, or we as a nation will have nothing left except a military that we can no longer afford to take care of. The government is supposed to be the people, but instead it has become a separate entity controlled by corrupt officials and global interests with its own agenda. How'd that all come about? Americans want to get back to rebuilding our country and defending our borders and not get involved in another destructive war.
“Glad you like anti-Semitic loons. Ron Paul and his supporters are such an embarrassment.”
Best argument yet. /s
When all else fails, throw in the race/religion card. And, while you are at it, refer to Constitutionalists as loons, anti-Semites, racists, and anarchists.
BTW, there are many high profile Jews, who personally know Dr. Paul, who would strongly disagree with Tzfat’s malicious unfounded label.
While I am supporting Herman Cain for President, I will often take a moment to defend Ron Paul’s Constitutional positions. Our Constitution is not just a *&&%*(%& piece of paper.
Ron Paul’s foreign “aid” position is not anti-Semite. What is anti-Semite is to give foreign “aid” to Israel’s enemies, and ours. Which the US does to the tune of billions. Explain that...
Well stated...
I’m just amazed at how many fellow “conservatives” try to construe the War Powers Act as somehow superceeding the Constitution itself.
If you really believe that, you ain’t a conservative or libertarian...you are something else...
=8-)
You see to have forgotten that part where the President is authorized to call up the militia to repel invasions and supress domestic disturbances...
...launching a war...requires a declaration of war by congress.
Calling something “preemptive” doesn’t change the fact that it is an offensive move and an act of war.
=8-)
Well stated. Sometimes thinking seems to take too much effort. The politicians serve up a round of cherry flavored Kool Aid and everyone drinks and for the moment are merry.
Always remember that politicians and officials always benefit from a dumbed down manipulable society and the ability to act unilaterally....we the people do not. Everything our government does needs more (not less) checks and balances.
Well let Iran touch off a nuke, then we will get congress to vote.
Just curious, just who votes for war if the nuke wipes out congress?
Do we have elections first so we will have a congress to vote for war?
Here's a better one for you.
What is the President suppose to do if members of congress are collaborating with the enemy, and there isn't enough votes to go to war?
Does the President simply allow the country to be attacked in that case?
Quote: Well let Iran touch off a nuke, then we will get congress to vote.
Answer: Where?
Quote: Just curious, just who votes for war if the nuke wipes out congress?
Answer: They will all be there at once? They’ll just sit there waiting for the fireworks when the warning systems kick in? NORAD is asleep at the monitor? Governors and Legislatures are on vacation? Hell, if it’s that bad - why not just declare war on incompetance.
Quote: Do we have elections first so we will have a congress to vote for war?
Answer: Nothing in the USC forbids us from defending ourselves...nothing in the USC forbids our military doing the same.
Quote: Here’s a better one for you. What is the President suppose to do if members of congress are collaborating with the enemy, and there isn’t enough votes to go to war?
Does the President simply allow the country to be attacked in that case?
Answer: Treason, sedition. They’re in the USC. House arrest...etc. Love them or hate them, you really should read up on Jackson, Lincoln and FDR.
This is all besides the point. All the whining and excuses by hawks - yet they can just never seem to put all that energy to amending the constitution. Now why is that?
I’ll answer...as someone suggested earlier - too many people want to have it both ways:
1. “I was for the ______ before I was against the _____.
2. “Defensive preemptive strike.” (contradiction in terms)
=8-)
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