Posted on 08/11/2011 1:48:27 PM PDT by Celerity
Thank you for taking the time to read my Vanity post.
A lot of people here, and in my face-to-face world, have mentioned that the mobs, riots and looting that is occuring around the world would take a different path here in the US, in areas where people are allowed to carry firearms, and use them in accordance with both laws and sensibility.
And it's the Sensibility portion of that I would like to discuss.
Everytime I measure and imagine (Simulations!) my response to violent flash mobs or rioters, I come up snake eyes. Here are two of such scenarios that I play out in my mind:
#1 I'm in my local convenience store, buying .. i dunno.. Porn mags and stale cigarettes and gasoline. Suddenly the front door swings open and the place is rushed by 10 or more teens who are screaming, destroying the store and running out with items.
#2 I'm dropping off some things at the post office to mail out. Say, I dunno.. Porn mags and stale cigarettes. An orchestrated attacks begins throughout my downtown area. 50, 100, 200 people start throwing rocks through windows, molotov cocktails, bricks, porn mags or stale cigarettes through store windows, setting fires or what-have-you.
We have heard around these parts how the outcome would be different were an armed populace involved. Well, "Here I am" . Now what ?
At what point in these events will it be both legal, and importantly: Prudent to present a firearm ? In the convenience store example, I have seen as few as 3 people cause so much ruckus that a knife was drawn and a kid was stabbed almost instantly. The kid didn't even know he was stabbed in the chaos. In the riot situation, Hiding or just leaving is the important decision, but are there scenarios that change that play ?
I see innocent people being hurt in riots all the time. But when is it time to draw a firearm and use it? I don't see the immediate danger to myself (Unless I'm the target of the protest, such as at a Union rally).
Help me connect some dots and make a correct decision.
Thanks !
-> Steve
“I was in fear for my life and felt I had no other choice, officer.”
Ask Jerome Ersland.
Interesting question. Legally what rights to we have in defending our homes and property against people with Molotov Cocktails for instance. Is shooting someone legal? I live in California and the laws may be different.
“IT’S COMIN’ STRAIGHT FOR US!”
Throwing Molotov Cocktails into homes? How dangerous!
This needs to be stopped before it grows!
That’s attempted murder in my opinion.
In both situations, just the sight of a gun would make most of the mobbers turn tail and run. You might not have to fire, and if you do have to fire, there will suddenly be fewer potential targets.
I wouldnt bother calling any “officer”. They only make a bad situation worse.
It needs to be stopped by authorities before it ever gets to that point.
If you have elderly parents sleeping in their own home when it happens.
Or you are away and your children or grandchildren are home sleeping when they come breaking through the window.
Or if nobody’s home but your helpless pets are there when the house starts burning.
It needs to be stopped or we will be seeing worse then London.
The smartest thing to do would be to evade and get the hell out of the danger area without even brandishing a firearm.
The next smartest thing would be to brandish it and not use it.
The last resort would be to shoot someone with it, you would have to be defending someone who’s life you believe is in danger.
There would still be a very costly and lengthy court process to go through to prove that you acted legally.
What might be all right in one state might land you in jail in another, I’ve read several posters here on FR state how they would start shooting, that would be a very unwise thing to do, don’t expect the law to be on your side if you do that.
The worst feeling is when you need x and don't have it. That's why I started carrying a BOB long before I knew that they had a name. And having them doesn't mean that you must use them, but it certainly expands your options.
You can survive an attack without weapons, tactics and strategies, but you'll fare better with them ;-)
I’m glad you have asked, because I have been running these things in my head as well. I have my concealed permit, and have finally found a firearm I feel happy with. Now I need to know exactly when to shoot! I will be checking back to see what everyone says. If someone told me 5 years ago that this was going to be something I would dwell on...
During any neighborhood riot, me and my neighbor will put out lawn chairs and sit out front with our shotguns in plain view.
I live in california also and if they are trying to hurt you, you can shoot. If they break into your house you can shoot. I Have a CCW(Amador county gives them out)and if your life is threatened, in your house or out, you can shoot. Better to shoot anyway if you are in doubt. The rule is, "Better to be tried by 12 then be carried by 6". This holds true. Rioters in the USA better be f***ing aware, their a** is in danger of being shot full of holes.
Well I searched the net to find out what a BOB was. The closest I could find was Battery Operated Boyfriend.
So you pull out the BOB and everybody falls on the floor laughing? Do you think that will work?
Thank God I am moving to Texas.
Here in Minnesota one would likely get charged with violating the criminals civil rights. Even though Minnesota has concealed carry. Euphorians here freak at the mere word “gun”.
Flash mob meets flash BANG!
I don’t care what the laws are, if someone is about to toss a Molotov at myself, my family, my car, my house they’ll get shot. No matter what state I lived in. Here in Washington state it would be legal as you are stopping a felony.
Not sure if the looting of a store is a felony or not. A felony robbery is over $750 in Washington. So a convienence store probably not. The local video store yes. However, if a rabble of “youts” are running all over the place it would seem to be likely to be “in fear for your life”. However, while those security cameras are always blurry in trying to catch the young punk robber, I’m sure it would capture in full clarity some older white guy putting a stop to a flash mob. Of course if they came after me directly that would be a different matter.
“Brandishing” a weapon during a flash mob may or may not be legal - I’m not sure. Probably not.
I think you just answered your own question.........Destruction of property does not allow for use of deadly force because property can be either repaired or replaced.......
Personally, if I'm caught in the midst of a riot situation, I'm getting the hell out of there because if I were to brandish my firearm there is a good chance that I could be mistaken for an armed rioter..........
I live in CA and if a saw a piece of human vermin standing outside my home, about to throw a Molotov Cocktail through my front window, I would blast him with my 38 police special, no questions asked.
As the saying goes, better to be judged by 12, then carried away by six.
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