When Two Tribes Go To War

When Two Tribes Go To War
FRIDAY, AUGUST 5, 2011
In case you didn't know, World War 3 started this year.

Not China and America, but 2 much bigger foes who wouldn't last 2 seconds in a lift together without handbagging each other to death for simply exchanging glances. Yes, we are talking about the "special" relationship between New Energy Times's Steven B Krivit and Italian Cold Fusion supremo, Andrea Rossi.

Last week in the third episode of Shock and Awe, Krivit fired his latest salvo of tactical nukes at a defiant Rossi. With all the anticipation of waiting for Duke Nukem Forever (It'll be ready when it's ready) I waited to see what delights it would contain.

When Krivit's imaginatively titled Report No.3 was released, the laser guided information bomb the size of War and Peace with a total of 37 (yes, thirty-seven) appendices strapped to it (I'm still only on number 8) made it's way to Rossi's Florida home where I'm told a mushroom cloud could still be seen days later.

But in the end, did Krivit deliver an ICBM that Rummy would be proud of, or was it just a damp firework stuck fizzing in the ground at the local park? To be honest, I got bored by page 3 of appendix 1. Had I not been researching it in order to write about it, I would have maybe printed it off and simply used it to jam under shortest leg of my Chinese made (authentic mahogany) coffee table.

Looking at the report, all the same vaguely scientific arguments are in there from episode 2. There are also a total of 11 separate reports on "steam analysis" by experts in the field of youtuberoscopy. To top it all off there is another stomach churning regurgitation of Rossi's less than saint like past which (not for the first time) looks like a cheap shot and nothing more. (Need we talk about the Pope's chequered past again?) Ed.

I wondered what the great unwashed had thought of Krivit's blockbuster sized epic, so I took a glance at the comments section underneath hoping to find the answer. It was just as I had feared, a cacophany of sycophantic praise from the Krivit choirboys liberally sprinked with some Rossi bashing and finished off with a caremelised jous of token pro Rossi crapola to make it "fair and balanced".

With all the charm and neocon grace of Bill O'Reilly there seemed to be no end to the Rossi condemnation and "scammer" talk, which in the end prompted me to write my OWN comment and perhaps introduce some other alternative theories that were simply not being discussed (even as a possibility).

Anywho - here's my comment and subsequent response I recieved.

Steven,

I don’t believe the “scam” hypothesis one tiny bit and I’ll explain why.

If he’s out to scam someone, then it’s not clear how this would be played out. You said yourself that no-one has seen “verifiable evidence of this “couple of hundred million Euros of investment?”.
Scammers will let the scenario play out for as long as possible, creaming as much money as they can from gullible people and this does NOT sit comfortably with the fact that Rossi has given HIMSELF a self-imposed deadline of end of October. There are a lot of high profile people who were at the Defkalion presentation and I don’t think they would take kindly to being scammed. And if Rossi is a scammer, then he should be getting an Oscar for his performance, as he has maintained a perfect performance which would be nothing short of miraculous.

Assuming for a minute that it is a “scam” leaves us with further problems where the logic does not fit the hypothesis. Prof Giuseppe Levi would have to be “in on it”, and as a respected phycisist at a very prestigious university with EVERYTHING to lose, it’s highly unlikely.

A scammer would certainly not agree to let ANYONE test ANY aspect of their device, let alone allowing one go to University of Upssala and Bologna and then PAYING THEM 500,000 Euros out of his own pocket for the privilege.

Rossi is not exactly hard-up for cash since he owns a few companies. He’s spent an awful lot of his OWN money, so money as a motivation seems absurd.

I think at worst, the eCat doesn’t produce as much power as is being touted. I think it’s easily possible that the eCat was not operating at “full steam” (if you pardon the pun) when you observed it, or that Rossi misconfigured it on the day, or that he was nervous of showing much for patent reasons, or any number of other technical issues that he’d rather not admit to.

Rossi may not have wanted to portray the eCat as unreliable and so the simple answer may be that he was simply embarrassed. Have you considered those possibilities instead of complex and highly unbelievable conspiracy scenarios?
Craig

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My comment did not make it past the Chinese firewall, but generated this response instead.

Sent to Craig via e-mail
July 8, 2011
Hi Craig, I’m considering publishing your post

I certainly don’t want to perpetuate any myths and I’m sure you don’t either.
Before I publish your post, I want to invite you support the following statements you made with your best factual evidence:

1. One of Rossi’s devices has gone to the University of Uppsala for testing. 2. One of Rossi’s devices has gone to the University of Bologna for testing. 3. Rossi has paid either of those institutions a single Euro. 4. Rossi is not hard-up for cash.
5. Rossi spent an awful lot of his OWN money.
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All the Rossi bashing posts and congratulatory back patting on a"job well done" seemed to make their way past the censors with unbridled ease. However, my own post was stopped at the border and asked to explain itself.

Now I don't pretend to know exactly what the heck is going on with this whole eCat thing. It's a mystery wrapped in an enigma and dropped into a deep well full of confusion, but I DO know that the discussion needs to move beyond the confines of world championship steam debating and the Petroldragon saga.

And since I'm down under, my responses to comments and emails have their own unique form of jet-lag which results from the fact that I'm usually sleeping when the rest of the world is up and about. Anyone who knows me will tell you that I reply to emails the way a sloth does the 100 metres. And besides - last night was the third last night of MasterChef; Smoke bellowing down the hallway and the fire alarm shrieking itself to death would not have shifted my arse from the couch.

And what was my pennance for not being glued to the Rossi debate 24/7 ? See below.

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[Brown did not reply.]
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Yes, I would have replied, but was not given much time to do so. Apart from sleeping while most bloggers are active and taking my coffee table back to the shop because one of the authentic mahogany plastic legs fell off, I have a life outside engaging in late-night discussions about steam. I can think of 437 better things I could be doing.

Now the questions I've been asked are lawyer's questions. Krivit knows fine well I cannot prove any of these things about Rossi (yet), but to be honest people, it's only a comment on a blog, it's only a comment. No one's life depends on it. Do all comments on blogs now need to have accompanying documentation?

I can't prove that any eCats have been sent to any University yet, but what DOES exist is a written agreement on the University of Bologna's website (so are we to assume that the University of Bologna is in on the conspiracy)? I think not.

I'm not Rossi's accountant so I couldn't tell you if he's paid the University of Bologna yet, or even if he's paid his subscription to Cold Fusion Weekly, but publicly he has comitted himself to these things - and why would you do that if you really don't need to?
As for being cashed up, I'm sure the fact that he owns several companies must mean that he's not exactly down the dole office every week with the arse hanging out of his trousers. Do I need proof for that too?

And a blind, deaf and dumb dung beetle can see that Rossi has spent an incredible amount of his own time and money over the years on getting this to a commercial stage - this is supported by countless others testimony and documentation.

But what really takes the biscuit is that my comment has to jump through more hoops than a nervous springel spaniel at Crufts while the the Krivit choirboys can make speculative and wild accusations WITHOUT backing up THEIR own comments.

The people shouting "scam" seem to have forgotten that Rossi did not instigate the public demonstration and attention. That particular request came from Prof Sergio Focardi who urged Rossi to do so. If Rossi wanted to pull a scam and disappear with money, then it seems a crazy thing to start attracting attention to himself when he was ALREADY in talks with Ampenergo and Defkalion.

When people accuse Rossi of scam they don't realise that to do so also implicates Prof Giuseppe Levi, Prof Sergio Focardi, and Prof Christos Stremmenos and involves the duping of NASA, the Greek Deputy Minister for Industry & Energy, Defkalion, Ampenergo and the fooling of 2 world-class scientists, one of which decides Nobel Physics prizes. Not to mention another dozen or so dignitaries who attended the Defkalion announcement. I simply don't believe that this is a logical hypothesis and that not one, but THREE well respected scientists are part of a conspiracy to scam.

I'd sooner believe my Chinese slave goods table was made of mahogany.

<

I worked my way through the whole steaming pile that is “Report #3” a couple of days back.

As with “Report #1” and “Report #2”, there is ZERO new information to be found in it. The “Appendices” are just summaries of comment threads from “Vortex-L”. Also Krivit makes several assertions that directly contradict other testimony.

In particular, Krivit claims that Levi has privately “disavowed” to him the “18=hour no-steam” test, as “having problems”. I have seen this assertion nowhere else, and certainly not from Dr. Levi.

The data from the “18-hour” test is summarized here:

http://www.lenr-canr.org/News.htm

Of course, Krivit would REALLY, REALLY like for that test to disappear, because it completely disproves his “wet steam” theory.

Of course, that 18-hour test was run specifically to investigate whether there “was” a “wet-steam problem” due to Dr. Celani having raised that question in the first demonstration.

So here we have Dr. Celani and Dr. Levi having gone through a REAL scientific “debate” with one of them raising an objection, and the other actually PERFORMING AN EXPERMENT and GENERATING DATA that addresses the question specifically.

I don’t ‘get’ Krivit. Why does he care whether the E-cat works or not? What’s in it for him? Personal publicity for him and his New Energy Times’s website? We are all going to find out soon enough.

I have ‘seen’ enough to convince me that at the least Rossi believes in his invention. There seems to be plenty of others that believe as well.

The developer who tried to scale up and commercialize the TDP process was similarily sincere, I believe, but unfortunately at industrial sacle it did not work as well as he hoped. I hope this same failure of testing a real-world sized device does not plague Rossi’s 1MW plant.

Thermal depolymerization (TDP) is a depolymerization process using hydrous pyrolysis for the reduction of complex organic materials (usually waste products of various sorts, often biomass and plastic) into light crude oil. It mimics the natural geological processes thought to be involved in the production of fossil fuels. Under pressure and heat, long chain polymers of hydrogen, oxygen, and carbon decompose into short-chain petroleum hydrocarbons with a maximum length of around 18 carbons.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_depolymerization

...The technology was finally developed for commercial use in 1996 by Changing World Technologies (CWT). Brian S. Appel (CEO of CWT) took the technology in 2001 and expanded and changed it into what is now referred to as TCP (Thermal Conversion Process), and has applied for several patents (see, for example, published patent application US 2004/0192980). A Thermal Depolymerization demonstration plant was completed in 1999 in Philadelphia by Thermal Depolymerization, LLC, and the first full-scale commercial plant was constructed in Carthage, Missouri, about 100 yards (91m) from ConAgra Foods’ massive Butterball turkey plant, where it is expected to process about 200 tons of turkey waste into 500 barrels (21,000 US gallons or 80 m³) of oil per day...

One of our E-cat posters says relatives in the area say the Carthage plant is set to soon begin production again.

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