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To: curiosity

I find nothing beyond possibility in this matter, no story line yet stands out as “plausible”, it is a battle between implausible stories!

The lack of witnesses today and witness reports, printed announcements, official records from 1961 to the marriage — the wedding — of Senior to Stanley Ann cast major doubts that there was an make actual marriage.

The two Hawaiian friends of Senior took a trip to visit him in Kenya a few years later. While speaking of their visit and communication With Senior there was no mention of Stanley Ann nor of Junior, only of another wife in Nairobi. That also speaks against an actual marriage.

What speaks for a marriage? A 1964 divorce decree, with the receipt of service to Senior, signed and hand dated in American date format. The modern recollections of friends in Seattle of 1961 letters that Stanley Ann had written them saying she had married the Kenyan. Obama’s own “auto” biographies. I say “auto” because the first one seems a blend of the life histories of William Ayers, the ghostwriter, and Obama.

Photos of Senior in Hawaii in 1961 ALSO speak against a marriage, as photos of the couple in social settings are not to be found, as far as I know. There are a few photos of Stanley Ann, Senior and Junior, but those seem staged, perhaps even edited.

And there have been claims by Kenyan officials, American and African reporters, and perhaps informal setting statements reported of Michelle Obama, Obama’s Kenyan “aunt” and maybe Obama himself, that make claims of his being born in Africa either directly or by reasonable inference in context.

The short length of the supposed marriage weights to its non-existence, as does Stanley Ann’s late August 1961 appearance in Seattle while Senior remained studying and partying in Hawaii. The photos from that period testify as to his charms on women, which also weighs against a marriage.

Where are the photos of a pregnant wife? Aren’t alpha-males like Senior proud in their ability to procreate? Where is a new father’s pride in showing and telling. Silence. Nothing chirps.

When exactly DID Stanley Ann arrive on the west coast, either in Seattle US, or Vancouver Canada? Where’s the evidence of her being in Hawaii anytime during the summer or spring of 1961? As far as I know, nothing.

To be most judicious to the evidences and statements (none under oath) we have on the matter of Obama’s birth and first few months of life: We do not know where Obama was born. We do not know if his mom was really married, or just inventive of being so. We do not know where Stanley Ann was in the spring and summer of 1961.

The determination of the facts of those circumstances simply cannot be honestly said to be able to make. It’s not even because of unknowns, it is because the knowns do not make enough sense to give any theory adequate credit.


230 posted on 01/05/2011 12:05:58 PM PST by bvw
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To: bvw
first typo fix for above: "cast major doubts that there was an [strike out: make] actual marriage"
231 posted on 01/05/2011 12:08:20 PM PST by bvw
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To: bvw

Great summary of all that we do NOT know!

You wrote:

“...The two Hawaiian friends of Senior took a trip to visit him in Kenya a few years later. While speaking of their visit and communication With Senior there was no mention of Stanley Ann nor of Junior, only of another wife in Nairobi. That also speaks against an actual marriage...”

Did you know that the ‘two Hawaiian friends’ were NEIL ABERCROMBIE AND HIS BUDDY PAK ZANE?

“...Years later, Abercrombie and another grad school friend looked up their old pal during a trip through Africa.

“At that point, the senior Obama was a bitter man, according to the congressman, feeling that he had been denied due opportunities to influence the running of his country. “He was drinking too much; his frustration was apparent,” Abercrombie said. To Abercrombie’s surprise, Obama never asked about his ex-wife or his son...”

Originally appeared in the Chicago Tribune, link no longer works, found exerpt here:

http://prorev.com/2007/05/why-obama-is-called-black.html


232 posted on 01/05/2011 12:33:47 PM PST by Fred Nerks (fair dinkum)
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To: bvw
What speaks for a marriage? A 1964 divorce decree, with the receipt of service to Senior, signed and hand dated in American date format.

Well, sport, to any rational person, that's definitive. People can't get divorced unless they can prove they were married in the first place.

And there have been claims by Kenyan officials,

Off-the-cuff remarks in political speaches by memebers of parliament who have no special knowledge of the matter don't count as evidence.

American and African reporters,

Reporters get facts wrong, and as far as I know, all of these stories were corrected.

and perhaps informal setting statements reported of Michelle Obama, Obama’s Kenyan “aunt” and maybe Obama himself, that make claims of his being born in Africa

Neither Obama, nor his aunty, nor his wife have ever said anything to this effect. These are all just unsubstantiated birther rumors.

The short length of the supposed marriage weights to its non-existence,

Why? Most marriages that end in divorce are short, and most marriages end in divorce.

as does Stanley Ann’s late August 1961 appearance in Seattle while Senior remained studying and partying in Hawaii.

Why? Plenty of young brides run away from their husbands after they realize they made a big mistake.

The photos from that period testify as to his charms on women, which also weighs against a marriage.

No it does not. Plenty of womanizers marry and then cheat on their wives.

Where are the photos of a pregnant wife? Aren’t alpha-males like Senior proud in their ability to procreate?

Where are the photos of a pregnant Barbara Bush? Are you now going to suggest she wasn't really married to Bush senior? After all, official documentation of their marriage hasn't been released.

When exactly DID Stanley Ann arrive on the west coast, either in Seattle US, or Vancouver Canada?

Some time in late August.

Where’s the evidence of her being in Hawaii anytime during the summer or spring of 1961? As far as I know, nothing.

Well, for starters there's the certification of live birth, photographs of which have been made public.

To be most judicious to the evidences and statements (none under oath) we have on the matter of Obama’s birth and first few months of life: We do not know where Obama was born.

Yes we do. There's the certification of live birth, which is an official state document that certifies the facts of his birth and is good in any court of law.

We also have statements by Hawaii government officials, while not made under oath, were still made in an official capacity.

We do not know if his mom was really married,

Yes we do. The divorce decree proves it.

We do not know where Stanley Ann was in the spring and summer of 1961.

We know she was in Hawaii in August 1961, from the COLB. We also know her husband was taking classes in Hawaii during the spring.

The determination of the facts of those circumstances simply cannot be honestly said to be able to make.

Yes it can, unless you are a birther determined to ignore all the evidence.

244 posted on 01/06/2011 10:15:19 AM PST by curiosity
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