Posted on 06/14/2009 9:58:45 PM PDT by DavidFarrar
I have recently been bringing this debate over Obama's U.S. citizenship over at Talking Points Memo. Needles to say, I have received some heat for my efforts. But I have received an interesting response. One that I have been unable to get around. I hope I can find some answers here.
(Excerpt) Read more at tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com ...
Yes, please do.
I am like the rest of you here. If we could just go by Barack’s ations, he’d be like another Chester Arthur, only worse. Barack actually made it to the Presidency.
ex animo
davidfarrar
Well, we all know what a “naturalized” citizen is, a citizen by statute. A natural-born citizen is one that is born of both parents being U.S. citizens.
ex animo
davidfarrar
Great job, Red!
God, I feel better. I am going to hit it a few times and head on over to Talking Points Memo and whack ‘um with it in the morning.
Thanks.
ex animo
davidfarrar
Well, there is the issue of Kenya’s independence in, what, 1968? After that point, Obama would have been a U.S citizen. Wouldn’t he?
ex animo
davidfarar
Kenya became independent after he was born. I’m not sure which year, but after 1968.
Of course, this statute would only apply to “foreign born” children. So as long as Obama’s claim to be born in Hawaii, ob Aug. 4, 1961, this statute would have no relevance to the issue at hand.
Thanks again, Red.
ex animo
davidfarrar
Obama did not have to be born on American soil to be considered Natural Born.
Wrong!
Natural Born Citizen — The Law
________________________________________________________
I would be more interested in seeing some legal cites. Based on part of this, John McCain was not a ‘natural born citizen’ since he was born in the Panama Canal Zone, NOT the ‘US Mainland’ as is mentioned several places in the link.
Also, note the quote from the part hilighted in yellow from the First Congress stating that the children of citizens born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the US are natural born citizens.
I pretty sure if you are born to two American citizens on the plane flying between Europe and the US, or on board a ship outside US waters, you are natural born.
I guess thats what you get for not looking, It just seemed like a DU sort of post. I appologize for any transgression. Incidently I posted something here 5 years ago and got flamed as a troll so I should know better
I can certainly fly off the handle myself. No problem.
I sent you a page full and those case law references and legal opinions were crafted by attorneys practicing in the federal courts system.
Two American citizen parents and born in the mainland USA — those are the requirements.
According to those requirements, John McCain is not a natural born citizen. He was not born in the mainland US.
However, McCain's father, a Navy Admiral, serving on active duty, might be considered to fall under the exclusion for “ambassadors,” which is highly likely, making John a natural born citizen.
I have no idea how "in transit" affects natural born status. Unlike yourself, I'm not going to speculate. I will send an email to my consulting attorney's and see what they think.
If he even ever had it, Obama lost natural born citizenship when his citizenship was changed to Indonesia. It had to be changed to Indonesia in order for him to school there.
My Hubby is a U.S. citizen, but he can’t be president. I’m a natural-born U.S. citizen, and I can.
You’re wasting bandwidth with this Needles post.
The supposed docuemtn with seal displayed by factcheck is a forgery because of several items, not the least of which is the forger used the wrong year seal to fabricate the document, so the seal does not agree with the year on the document.
Also, several of the obamnoid apolists keep conflating 'citizen' with 'natural bor citizen'. Frankly, Obama has not proven he is actually a citizen, as you noting in the initial essay! If he used an Inodnesian passport to travel when he was eighteen or nineteen, he displayed dividied loyalties or fraud in doing so or after obtaining the passport since he now tries to proclaim himself a natural birn citizen.
And finally, it is not just the absence of ANY PROOF of his birth location, etc., he has spent more than amillion on an armyu of people tasked with hiding all relevent history of his life! It isn't just his stubbornly not proving that he is a natural born citizen, it is the mountain of deceit and stealth he has to employ to continue the charade of his fabricated life!
Your blogsite has comments from a few professional dissemblers and a few comments from average citizens who want desperately to believe this affirmative action figure liar-in-chief is legitimate.
Barry Soetoro, aka Barry Dunham, aka Barry Obama, aka Barack Hussein Obama is not legitimate, not honest, and he will do anything to prevent the truth from being exposed about hima nd his history. He lied on his application to the IL Bar Assoc so we may be absolutely certain he lies boldly. He has lied throughout the life he has maintained with the public. But the democrap party worships this lair-in-chief even more than they worshipped the degenerate sinkEmperor clintoon.
1. Obama admits he was a British citizen at birth on his website.
2. Anne Dunham had not sufficient residency in the U.S. and wasn’t of sufficient age to confer U.S. citizenship on Barack at his birth in 1961.
3. If he was, in fact, born in Hawaii in 1961, he was a British citizen only, and only under British jurisdiction as a visitor to Hawaii.
4. In 1961 the U.S. did not permit dual citizenship. So even had his mother been of sufficient age and U.S. residency, he could not have gained U.S. citizenship by a Hawaiian birth through her. His Certificate of Live Birth could not grant citizenship to a British national.
5. As with any parents who are foreign nationals giving birth in the U.S., and “not under the juridiction thereof”, Obama would have to return to the U.S. and undergo the naturalization process, and sign a written citizenship oath to gain U.S. citizenship for the first time. This is exactly what happens to the children of foreign tourists whose children claim citizenship under the 14th Amendment birthright. Citizenship under these circumstances does not consti tute being “natural born”.
Therefore, Obama was never a U.S. citizen as a minor, could only become one by naturalization, and if he has not done so, he is an illegal alien like his half-aunt from Kenya.
and
From Phil at: http://www.therightsideoflife.com/?p=6358Kerchner et al vs. Obama & Congress et al page 18.
Obama May Be An Illegal Alien
79. There exists a possibility that Obama could be an illegal alien.
80. Obama has yet to adequately prove that he was born in the United States.
81. Obama has publicly conceded that his father was born in Kenya and a British subject/citizen at the time of Obama’s birth which precluded Obama from gaining any U.S. citizenship from his father at the time of his birth.
82. At the time of his birth in 1961, under the applicable statute Obama also could not gain U.S. citizenship from his U.S. citizen mother due to her being only 18 years old at the time of his birth. ENDNOTE 15.
83. There also exists the possibility that if Obama had U.S. citizenship at birth, he lost that citizenship when his mother’s second husband, Lolo Soetoro, an Indonesian citizen, adopted/acknowledged him as his son and along with his mother took him to live in Indonesia and when he later traveled as a foreign citizen with a foreign pas sport to Pakistan after the age of majority (18) when he was approximately 20.
ENDNOTE 15: A child born in wedlock and abroad to one U.S. citizen parent and one alien parent acquires U.S. citizenship at birth under Section 301(g) INA, provided the citizen parent was physically present in the U.S. for the time period required by the law applicable at the time of the childs birth. (For birth on or after November 14, 1986, a period of five years physical presence, two after the age of fourteen is required. For birth between December 24, 1952 and November 13, 1986, a period of ten years, five after the age of fourteen are required for physical presence in the U.S. to transmit U.S. citizenship to the child). http://travel.state.gov/law/info/info_609.html. Obama’s mother, born on November 29, 1942, was 18 years old when she gave birth to Obama on August 4, 1961. She was 117 days short from being 19 years old. But she had to be at least 19 years old (14 years old plus 5 years of U.S. physical presence) to satisfy the legal requirement of Section 301(g). Hence, if Obama was born in Kenya, under the Fourteenth Amendment, he is neither a U.S. citizen by birth on U.S. soil nor one by naturalization. (There is no existing evidence that Obama was ever naturalized.) Nor would he qualify to be a U.S. citizen by any act of Congress by being born abroad to a U.S. citizen parent. If this scenario were proven to be true, it can be reasonably argued that Obama is an illegal alien.
The full docu ment can be viewed at: http://www.scribd.com/doc/11317148/
More at: http://www.reagan.com/forum/view_thread.cfm?forum=38&category=25&postid=1101
See my other response to Mr. Farrar, but to be fair I have been here since 98
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