Posted on 12/09/2008 3:27:19 PM PST by Righting
First, the fact is the EU constitution, EU membership in general, was never put to a referendum in other nations as the Irish have done with their own people. This reminds me of the Soviet Union and how it was assembled. Everyone was appointed, no votes were cast, no legal structure or balance of powers to reduce corruption was established.
Greece will be forced by the EU to embrace the Muslims who are coming in like a high tide. They will not be able to arrest them because of how the EU defines racism and intolerance.
Well, I agree with Italy. Enough is enough. They are shutting down the amount of Mosques being built and the amount of Arabs coming into Italy. No more open boarders.
The communists on the other hand are being used. The Greek communist movements have been quiet over the years but now are being used so it doesn't look like a Jihad all over again.
Here in Chicago when the Mexicans were marching down the streets during their immigration rallies who was there handing out anti American pamphlets? Muslims and Communist labor groups.
EU will fail and there will be another Euro war as long as the EU keeps on it's current course.
Kai gia istoria, tin ksero pio kala kai apo kapious pou mas pezoune tous eksipnous, thank you very much.
Like I said, its nice to blame everything on the muzzies but this time they have less to do with what's going on in Greece. Some of them might have taken advantage of the situation during the rioting but what is at the heart of the matter and issues are more native Greek related then migrant and muzzie related.
The history of these organized and violent groups in Greece go back to the 1970s. This has nothing to do with the EU, this kind of rioting has been going on in Greece long before Greece even became part of the EU. The riots in Greece have nothing to do with economic inequality, most those rioting come from well off families, the kid who was killed went to one of the most prestigious private schools in Greece. Unlike the riots of Los Angeles 1992 and France 2005 the ones in Greece today do not have anything to do with race and immigration; the majority of the rioters were ethnic Greeks. The anarchy rioters have an ideologically motivated method of getting their 'message' out, whatever that might be, by destroying facilities like banks, stores, public buildings and other symbols that basically any society does need to function properly in todays world. The rioters actions testify that their aim is to create havoc without bothering to propose an alternative plan for governance and these kind of actions do not drive social change. Apart from the protesting students and the rioting self-styled anarchists no other segments of Greek society have taken part in a large scale in the incidents. A significant contrast with the 1992 Los Angeles riots in where they did involve race-based militias that escalated into fighting between criminal gangs whose members took the opportunity to settle their differences. The shooting of the teenager in Athens has not turned into a flag of convenience for disparate social groups (muslims, immigrants, etc.) who might have grievances against the government so they are rioting in the streets.
After the events at the Technical University of Athens in November of 1973 - when the military junta's forces brutally suppressed a student protest killing over 40 students, any violence by the state towards the civilian population has not been tolerated in Greece. Again Greece joined the EU in 1981, violent protests such as these existed in Greece since the 1970s when the EU had no say in Greek domestic politics....not that they really do now. The result of the 1973 violent student/military protest was the Greek constitution being changed in 1974 to outlaw LEOs and military authorities from storming universities and schools. This is one of the reason why such groups are able to regroup so quickly in the country is because the reasoning that was behind the constitution change in 1974 was a way of trying to underwrite academic freedom unfortunately this has been exploited by certain student groups, i.e. anarchists, who turn universities into havens for the kind of groups who have been rioting in the streets today....again Greece wasn't part of the EU back then in 1974 when it changed its constitution.
Another part of the reason these organizations have been tolerated, even romanticized, or at least not explicitly condemned can be laid at the feet of journalists as well as politicians of establishment parties who support such groups by not outwardly condeming them as strongly as they should be.
For those not familiar with what eleni and I are talking about: Greece's overall recognition rate for immigrants is very low, hovering for years at roughly 1 percent. That compares with 45 percent in Italy last year and 19 percent in Spain. About 3,500 Iraqis requested asylum in Greece in the first half of 2007. Yet a study comparing decisions on asylum claims in five EU countries published by the UN refugee agency in November, found that the chance of an Iraqi refugee's receiving immigration status and protection in Greece stood at zero. In Sweden, it was 75 percent. In its zeal to secure its borders, since the EU does nothing to help out, Greece is being accused of serious lapses in human rights and ignoring treaty pledges that bind it to give haven to immigrants claiming protection - rights established under international conventions. Refugees' lawyers say many migrants are secretly forced back. The EU makes a lot of noise to Greece about immigration issues that Greece turns a deaf ear to. Greece's stand on all this is: "if the EU doesn't offer to help to us out to handle the illegal immigration issues that our country faces, then we will handle it our own way." Some of Greece's solutions is using tactics that unofficially are not sponsore by the state although officials looks the other way and don't do anything to correct this "issues" raised by the EU. Common among Greek officials is a sense that faraway Brussels requires them to be gatekeepers for migrants entering the Europe's borders without having to deal with the stresses or offering much support. Greek officials say the EU could start to help out by urging Turkey to work with the Greek boarder patrol to actively stop illegal immigrants at the Greek/Turkish borders but the EU doesn't even do that, so Greek officials are forced to take things into their own hands, i.e. Eastern Greek border crossing for migrants is studded with land mines, the EU has been harassing Greece to get rid of them but Greece just turns a deaf ear to. EU Rights of Refugees and Migrants groups have been making accusation that the Greek Coast Guard was pushing back migrants' boats at sea. A number of lawyers for migrants say that the Greek police and army are secretly and illegally expelling migrants in very large numbers, they say that these deportations take place at night. Migrants lawyers in Athens, said that illicit deportations are an open secret and had been going on for a decade, indications are that people are being made to return by unofficial means in a very short period of time, some without being given the chance to request asylum, which is pretty sad cause some of them probably do have legitimate asylum claims but if the EU doesn't offer any help what are countries like Greece and Italy to do but take things in their own hands.
One million illegals “migrants” out fo a population of 10 million. No you are the one who is hoddwinked and too fearful perhaps to believe the tragedy of invasion from the East.
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5hH1p5EUGNja3qTzOiRZVO6qY3uAA
The sacred island of Patmos has more illegals than native born Greeks living on it. Finally the island officals said enough us anough and refused another boatload of scum to land there..forcing them to another island - Syros I think.
Man - wake up!
Muslims are not the only migrant community in Greece. There is not a serious demographic threat of muzzies in Greece because the Muslim population is less then ~1.3%, that is among the LOWEST of any EU country. As you very well know Greeks are very much aware of the consequences of Islam taking root in the nation which is WHY 99% of the general population doesn't complain when migrants are harassed by the cops...especially those who are not of European origins. Greeks have not gotten to the point that the French or Dutch are at, with 5-10% of the population of Muslim background and that figure will not rise since Greece supports the stricter line on immigration being promoted by the French presidency meaning there will not be another wave of allowing immigrants in Greece to stay.
LOL-—DUH! Yes but 90% are Muzzies.
Listen up -—After your Christmas trip to Greece - and after you take the excursions I suggested to you - we can chat. Until then - you have no credibility at all in this matter.
I will agree that Sarkozy’s stricter policy may help - (they got a lesson fast after the riots of the last few years) but I fear it won't help Greece. Greece has the parastate of Turkey on its border and Turkey allows millions of illegals from muslim hellholes to cross into Europe.
No unlike you I am living in the real world and not spreading misinformation. The Muslim population is among the lowest of any EU country in Greece. Greeks and their neighbors are the least likely people to allow the propagation of the myth of Islamic tolerance, and as a fellow Greek I would think you out of all people would be aware of this. Outside of Thrace there are no official mosques or clerics. The fact is Greece has come under whithering attack from all quarters, not just the vermit of the UN, EU and Human rights groups, but also and INCLUDING the US government for its low percantage of allowing migrants to stay in the country and not expediting the buliding of mosques outside of the Thraki. Never the less, your comment above confirms what I said in a pervious post about Greek officials basically taking matters into their own hands when it comes to illigals, i.e. pushing back migrants' boats into the sea, ect. I already stated such basic facts in another post regarding Greek border patrol tactics that are not approved by the EU but they are tolerated by the Greek state unofficially including the mass deportation of migrants under cover of night.
Your comment is not only silly and inaccurate but very shallow. Incorrect, 90% of the immigrants ARE NOT muzzies, more then half of them are made up of CHRISTIANS from other European countries. I agree on your comment regarding Turkey, but I believe Sarkozy’s stricter policy will help since as stated before Greeks are the least likely people to allow the propagation of the myth of Islamic tolerance in their nation, this is proven by the fact that the far-right party Laos popularity has jumped to 5.4 percent in opinion polls from 3.5 percent when it entered Parliament a year ago, which is another historic event, it marks the first time an extreme right party gained seats in the Parliament.
Like I stated in my other post international human rights reports, including a report on religious freedom issued by the U.S. State Department under the Bush administration, had criticized Greece for failing to provide an official prayer site for Muslims in Greece. So you can add the State Department in that long list of vermin that include the UN and EU for going after Greece's long stance of intolerance towards the muzzies.
So you can add the State Department in that long list of vermin -—UN and EU
Are you sure you’re in the right place??? this is a conservative forum...in which views and events are discussed in order to reach a conservative consensus....not a fatalistic and defeatist one like yours. We may disagree for example on the role of Russia in world affairs but in the end the orgs you refer to are on most FReepers “vermin” lists.
They are on any conservative’s vermin list already.
The latest in a long list of moral catastrophes is they bombed and then sold out the Serbian Orthodox people to the Shiptar Muslims. Now it appears that they are bound and determined to rid themselves of Karamanlis for signing the pipeline agreement with the Russians....
Mou fainete oti to mialo sou kai mia lira
This isn't my first time posting on these forums, I've had an account for a while now, thank you very much. So I know what kind of forum it is. And being a conservative forum means you don't criticize the State Department when they do something stupid like get on an allied country's case for not given the jihadis more freedom in Greece? Do you want me to produce the State Department document that criticize Greece for not allowing the muzzies to build mosques in Athens? I'd be more then happy to do so.
"The latest in a long list of moral catastrophes is they bombed and then sold out the Serbian Orthodox people to the Shiptar Muslims. Now it appears that they are bound and determined to rid themselves of Karamanlis for signing the pipeline agreement with the Russians....
I'm well aware of Greece's long support with the Serbian Orthodox people and support it 100%. But this thing with Karamanlis and Greece has nothing to do with the Shiptar Muslims and everything to do with governments low ratings since it got re-elected last year. Don't forget Karamanlis barely got the votes to be re-lected last year. As I told you before Greeks and their neighbors are the least likely people to allow the propagation of the myth of Islamic tolerance. A Eurobarometer survey a few years ago showed Greece to have the highest degree of xenophobia in the European Union. Karamanlis own administration said that racism and xenophobia are growing in Greece and you seriously believe the majority of Greeks, over 10 million strong of them will let the muzzies take over the country? Come one, you're Greek, you know when the MAJORITY of Greeks would never sympathize with muslims and when the majority of the public does not agree with Greek domestic issues then they take things into their own hands. No matter how much news outlets sensualize things Greece will never fall victim to the muzzies because of its bitter past with them.
"Mou fainete oti to mialo sou kai mia lira"
Mou fainete pos to diko sou einai ligo travimeno.
In the meantime Muslim Albanians clamor for more territory in the north from one of their associations in the US - “it's a “human rights” issue
“Chameria has become Europe’s Palestinian problem requiring repatriation and/or compensation through negotiations for a mutually agreed upon plan
Chams can go pound sand, as far as I am concerned. They lost any and all rights to anything in Greece when they collaborated with the Nazis against Greece, thousands of Greeks loosing their lives because of these mohamajides.
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