Posted on 08/13/2008 2:20:26 PM PDT by pissant
By Judah Benjamin, Guest Author
Introduction by TexasDarlin
Let us state, unequivocally at the outset of this article, that we have NO bias against Islam and nothing against Islamic people of any sect.
We are not the ones insulting Muslims. In fact, we feel badly that one of the largest religions in the world is being insulted by a leading contender for the US Presidency. So much for unity.
Barack Obama has made it very clear that he considers it a smear to be Muslim, or to be labeled a Muslim.
The proof of that is right out in the open, on his campaigns Fight The Smears webpage, where he fights the smear:
I have never been a Muslim.
In a private meeting with Jewish leaders in February, Obama emphatically re-stated the claim. He said:
I AM NOT, NOR HAVE I EVER BEEN, A MUSLIM (ESPECIALLY AN ANTI-AMERICAN ONE)
(All-caps courtesy of JTA, which published the story, Obama Reaches Out to Jewish Leaders.)
Clearly, then, Obama believes its a smear to be accused of being Muslim.
But does anyone else notice that the Feb. 2008 statement to the JTA incorporates a bit of lawyerly double-speak: Especially an anti-American one? Does that mean that Obama does not as emphatically deny that he was some other kind of Muslim?
We think so. Just to clarify, we believe Obama when he says that hes never been an anti-American Muslim. No doubt in our minds about that.
We assert that he was a Muslim, based primarily on his own memoirs and his own sisters statements, as well as documentation from Indonesia. But now he wants that part of his life to go missing, like so many state senate records. He desperately wants you to believe that he was NEVER A MUSLIM because he believes it to be a smear to be Muslim.
But that anti-smear claim does not match the facts of his life. And much as he might wish to, the facts of his life cannot be re-written. And as Judah Benjamin asks: How can the truth be a smear?
That same campaign web page says this:
this myth perpetuates unfortunate falsehoods about the Muslim-American community that are offensive to people of all faiths.
What are the unfortunate falsehoods that are being perpetuated by truthfully pointing out that Sen. Obama was once Muslim? It strikes me that it is Obama who is perpetuating negative connotations by denying his connection to Islam and thereby smearing Islam in the process.
[Judah Benjamin's previous stories are listed at the end. In particular, The Paper Trail: Obama's Indonesian Background, provides context.] By Judah Benjamin, Guest Author
I have no doubt that Obama has never been an anti-American Muslim, though I doubt he could be said not to have been an anti-American Christian since his Conversion.
Obama was a Muslim, not a very good one, not a very pious one, and probably only for forms sake, but he was one in childhood.
Let me say at this point, again, that I have nothing whatever against Islam, or Islamic people of whatever Sect. There are many Loyal Americans who are Muslims, many Muslims who are pro-American around the world and a lot of decent pleasant people who follow the Prophet Mohammed. If you think all Muslims are sinister terrorists bent on conquering the world and reducing every non-Muslim to subjection under the Caliphate, if not destroying all non-Muslims, you are probably someone who has never lived, or worked, alongside Muslims during your daily life. Those who do wish to do that are a dangerous minority in Islam, albeit a powerful one.
I repeat the Senators own statement: I am not, nor have I ever been, a Muslim, particularly an anti-American one!
I am quite sure that he was not anti-American and I have known plenty of Muslims who certainly could not be accused of being anti-American. Lolo Soetoro certainly wasnt and that caused friction between him and the Senators mother, according to a number of sources.
There is abundant evidence that Barack Obama was a Muslim when he was living in Indonesia and it is a necessary corollary to believing the Indonesian Records.
There isnt any good evidence that he was a devout Muslim, or a zealot, there isnt even any direct evidence as to which Sect he belonged, there are over 250 different Islamic Sects in Indonesia.
[Side Note: There is no evidence his mother was ever Christian and his grandparents were Baptists who converted to Unitarianism, the only Christian Denomination Muslims accept actually follows the Teachings of Christ. Ann Dunham, on her daughter's testimony disapproved of most Christians.]
To say that one is not a Muslim simply because one does not attend a Mosque every Friday, or because one drinks alcohol, or occasionally eats bacon, is exactly the same as saying one is not Christian because one does not go to Church every Sunday, doesnt tithe, or works on a Sunday.
It is nonsensical, not everybody observes their Religion strictly. Can my Christian readers all recite either The Apostles Creed or The Athanasian Creed, are Unitarians Christian when they reject the Doctrine of the Trinity? Which person is Jewish, a Hasid, a Conservative Jew, a Reformed Jew, or a Liberal Jew. Is only one of these groups Jewish?
Clearly the answer to these questions is, no. Visit, or live in any Islamic country, or predominantly Islamic area and you will speedily discover that Muslims are as likely to ignore large sections of the teachings of their Religion as are Christians or Jews.
Speaking of her childhood in Indonesia Maya Soetoro-Ng has said: My father never went to prayer services except for big communal events. I am absolutely certain that he did not go to services every Friday.
She has also stated: My whole family was Muslim, and most of the people I knew were Muslim.
This is a very interesting statement; think hard about it. It can be found in Jodi Kantors article in The International Herald Tribune for April 30th, 2007. Consider what it says about Stanley Ann Dunham and her children.
Fermina Katarina Sinaga, Obamas 3rd-grade teacher at SD Asisi, and a neighbor, stated: Sometimes Lolo went to the mosque to pray, but he rarely socialized with people. Rarely, Barry went to the mosque with Lolo.
These are straightforward statements that allow no misinterpretation and they wholly belie either the LA Times:
He has never been a practicing Muslim. [Incidentally what exactly is a "non-practicing Muslim", if not a Muslim?]
or their earlier Statement (from Obama08):
Senator Obama has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim and is a committed Christian who attends church in Chicago.
However, Maya Soetoro-Ngs statement and that of Fermina Katarina Sinaga certainly match the fact that in his autobiography, Dreams From My Father, in which the Senator relates that he got into trouble for making faces during Koranic studies. In Indonesia only Islamic Students attend classes of Koranic Instruction. Under Indonesian Law no non-Muslim could possibly attend these classes. This in turn shows that any hedging statements made by his former teachers, or suggestions that he may have been wrongly registered cannot be true.
The Ministry of Religious Affairs would, almost certainly, have had any teacher who allowed that to happen fired, and might have closed down the school. According to Nicholas D Kristof, of The New York Times the Senator can still recite the Muslim call to prayer in Arabic. This proves nothing of itself, because I used to be able to do that and I am most definitely not Muslim, but it suggests he was paying some attention to the Muezzin, at least.
The Senators statement: My grandfather who was Kenyan converted to Christianity then converted to Islam, my father never practiced. He was basically agnostic and so other than my name and the fact that I lived in a populous Muslim country for 4 years when I was a child I have very little connection to the Islamic religion, is a provable flat out lie, because his step-father was a Muslim, his half-sister admits to having been a Muslim and says that he was, his birth-father was buried in a Muslim ceremony, in accord with his expressed wishes, and the Senator attended Koranic Classes mandated for Islamic students only by Law.
Again I ask, what is a practicing Muslim? If one were to say I am not a practicing Christian, it would mean that one was a member of a Christian Denomination but did not attend Church. It would not mean that one wasnt a Christian at all, or that one didnt consider oneself to be one, it would in fact mean that one did consider oneself to be one, although lax. A lapsed Catholic is still a Catholic and a non-practicing Muslim is still a Muslim. His own statements prove he is not telling the truth.
One may add this paragraph:
Obamas Step-Father Saw Religion As Not Particularly Useful, But Followed A Brand of Islam That Made Room for Animist and Hindu Faiths.
Obama wrote in the Audacity of Hope, When my mother remarried, it was to an Indonesian with an equally skeptical bent, a man who saw religion as not particularly useful in the practical business of making ones way in the world, and who had grown up in a country that easily blended its Islamic faith with remnants of Hinduism, Buddhism, and ancient animist traditions. Obama wrote in Dreams from My Father, Like many Indonesians, Lolo followed a brand of Islam that could make room for the remnants of more ancient animist and Hindu faiths. ["Audacity of Hope", p 204; "Dreams From My Father", p 37] Text taken from Obama08.
and this one:
Obama Spokesman Robert Gibbs Issued A Statement Explaining That Senator Obama Has Never Been A Muslim, Was Not Raised As A Muslim, And Is A Committed Christian. Obamas campaign aides have emphasized his strong Christian beliefs and downplayed any Islamic connection. The Illinois senator was raised in a secular household in Indonesia by his stepfather and mother, his chief spokesman, Robert Gibbs, said in a statement in January after false reports began circulating that Obama had attended a radical madrasa, or Koranic school, as a child. To be clear, Senator Obama has never been a Muslim, was not raised a Muslim, and is a committed Christian who attends the United Church of Christ in Chicago, Gibbs Jan. 24 statement said. [Los Angeles Times, 3/16/07] Text taken from Obama08.
BTW, in Indonesia in the 1960s and 70s there was legally no such thing as a secular household. Indonesia recognized neither Agnosticism or Atheism.
Compare these statements with Maya Soetoro-Ng in an interview with The New York Times Magazine for January 20th, 2008 in which she said:
Your mom has been described as an atheist:
I wouldnt have called her an atheist. She was an agnostic. She basically gave us all the good books the Bible, the Hindu Upanishads and the Buddhist scripture, the Tao Te Ching and wanted us to recognize that everyone has something beautiful to contribute.
You didnt mention the Koran in that list, although Indonesia is the most populous Muslim country in the world:
I should have mentioned the Koran. Mom didnt really emphasize the Koran, but we read little parts of it. We did listen to morning prayers in Indonesia.
Are you worried about mentioning Islam because it has already been evoked by negative campaigners trying to tarnish your brother?
Im not worried. I dont want to deny Islam. I think its obviously very important that we have an understanding of Islam, a better understanding. At the same time, it has been erroneously attached to my brother. The man has been a Christian for 20 years.
What religion are you?
Philosophically, I would say that I am Buddhist.
Unless Maya Soetoro-Ng is lying, Barack Obama was previously not a Christian and logically he was a Muslim, as the Indonesian Records say.
You will notice, however, that Maya Soetoro herself tried to avoid mentioning Islam, though when she did she said I dont want to deny Islam. Nor does she say that she is officially a Buddhist, only that she is Philosophically Buddhist, whatever that means. Incidentally, I have heard both Buddhists and Islamic Sufis described, correctly, as Agnostics. They were still Buddhists and Muslims.
I stress again that there is nothing wrong with having been a Muslim, in the past, or being a Muslim now, but the Senator is not telling the truth when he says he wasnt one in his boyhood.
I for one do not believe for one second that he is part of some great Islamic Conspiracy to place the USA under Sharia Law and reduce the Christian population to Dhimmitude; the idea is preposterous. I know there are Muslims who would love to see it but there are Christians who want to see Islam destroyed, so that balances out.
I dont doubt for a second that he has been an active member of Trinity UCC since his mid twenties, or that he considers himself a Christian, even a practicing Christian. I am reasonably sure that he hasnt been any kind of Muslim for many years. Personally, I would hesitate to affirm that he is, or has been, a Christian at any point but that is just my own prejudice, to which I admit. The present Pope, apparently, says that Black Liberation Theology is not Christianity but a Heresy. Im not quite sure what a Heresy is, in Catholic terms, but I assume the Pope does know and pretty well.
In saying that he has never been a Muslim and in claiming that calling him Islamic, or a Muslim is a Smear, Senator Obama, in my view, insults every Muslim on the Earth.
He also insults his biological relatives and his step-fathers family. He insults the memory of both his paternal grandfather and the father he claims was so important in his life. He insults his step-father, the step-siblings he, apparently, has in Indonesia and his stepfathers family.
He insults Indonesia and its people by his very attitude. But worse than all of that, to my mind, he insults the intelligence of the American people and of his own followers. How can the truth be a smear?
Why is the Senator failing to tell the exact truth? Is it the current prevalence of anti-Islamic feeling, indeed bigotry, in the USA, or is it that he fears to admit it because to do so will show that the Indonesian Records are correct and that therefore he previously had Indonesian nationality?
Either way it is cowardice and either way it is a lie. At the most charitable interpretation the Senator is being grossly misleading and his surrogates are lying. That it is a lie seems obvious according to his own books, family friends, and his own sister. A liar and a coward isnt the right person to be POTUS.
More from Judah Benjamin PING
Thank you, pissant.
Ping.
Let me state, unequivocally at the outset of this post, that I see nothing wrong with being biased against a religion founded by a violent, stark-raving mad pedophile.....
I think this is one of the very few issues on which I agree with Obama’s purported postion: as an Orthodox Christian, I would regard it as a smear to be accused of being a Muslim.
Islam, as St. John of Damascus, is a heresy, a false religion derivative from Christianity (asserting as it does that Jesus was a ‘prophet’, accepting His Virgin Birth, while denying His Divinity). St. John was very familiar with Islam, having served as the Grand Vizier of the Caliph of Damascus, during one of periods when pragmatism trumped Islamic dogma in the running of the Caliphate, and wrote the first Christian critique.
I think even identifiably Christian heretics, even of the odd semi-Marxist variety that seemed to inhabit Trinity United Church of Christ, are entitled to feel the same way.
Of course, I characterize this as Obama’s purported position, since if called on it, he will certainly assert the equality of all religions (a vile heresy that), and say that his website treated the assertion of his Muslimness as a ‘smear’ only because the yahoos who cling to guns and religion would interpret it that way. (Though he’ll characterize them differently this time, since now he is consciously tralling for their votes.)
Oh, dear, I really must learn either to type as fast as I think, or proofread better: the word ‘observed’ was omitted between ‘St. John of Damascus’ and the comma.
It’s a smear to me as well. Like being called a scientologist or a Ted Haggard follower.
.
Quote from Barack Obamas book, Dreams Of My Father:
“THE PERSON WHO MADE ME PROUDEST OF ALL, THOUGH, WAS MY [half brother], ROY..HE CONVERTED TO ISLAM”.
From Dreams of my Father, “IN INDONESIA, I SPEND TWO YEARS AT A MUSLIM SCHOOL” “..The teacher wrote to tell my mother that I made faces during Koranic studies..
From Audacity of Hope: “LOLO (Obamas step father) FOLLOWED ISLAM....”I LOOKED TO LOLO FOR GUIDANCE”.
From The Audacity Of Hope, “I WILL STAND WITH THEM (MUSLIMS) SHOULD THE POLITICAL WINDS OF WAR SHIFT IN AN UGLY DIRECTION..”
From The Audacity Of Hope, “WE ARE NO LONGER JUST A CHRISTIAN NATION, we are also a Jewish nation, a MUSLIM NATION, a Buddhist nation, a Hindu nation, and a nation of nonbelievers.”
http://www.examiner.com/a-536474~_Trapped_between_two_worlds_.html
http://www.examiner.com/a-534540~Can_a_past_of_Islam_change_the_path_to_president_for_Obama_.html?cid=dc-article-obama
.
Pissant, ya know I luvs ya, (Don’t get scared- I’m a girl)
but I have to disagree with you here. It just all fits together too perfectly.
OBAMA, THE JIHAD CANDIDATE
.
How long did it take Islam and their oil money to find a candidate for President of the United States ?
As long as it took them to place a Senator from Illinois and Minnesota ?
The same amount of time to create a large Muslim enclave in Detroit ?
The time it took them to build over 2,000 mosques in America ?
The same amount of time required to place radical wahabbist clerics in our military and prisons as chaplains?
Find a candidate who can get away with lying about their father being a freedom fighter when he was actually part of the most corrupt and violent government in Kenya s history.
Find a candidate with close ties to The Nation of Islam and the violent Muslim overthrow in Africa , a candidate who is educated among white infidel Americans but hides his bitterness and anger behind a superficial toothy smile.
Find a candidate who changes his American name of Barry to the Muslim name of Barak Hussein Obama, and dares anyone to question his true ties under the banner of racism.
Nurture this candidate in an atmosphere of anti-white American teaching and surround him with Islamic teachers. Provide him with a bitter, racist, anti-white, anti-American wife, and supply him with Muslim middle east connections and Islamic monies.
Allow him to be clever enough to get away with his anti-white rhetoric and proclaim he will give $834 billion taxpayer dollars to the Muslim controlled United Nations for use in Africa .
Install your candidate in an atmosphere of deception because questioning him on any issue involving Africa or Islam would be seen as bigoted racism; two words too powerful to allow the citizenry to be informed of facts.
Allow your candidate to employ several black racist Nation of Islam Louis Farrakhan followers as members of his Illinois Senatorial and campaign staffs.
Where is the bloodhound American free press who doggedly overturned every stone in the Watergate case?
Where are our nations reporters that have placed every Presidential candidate under the microscope of detailed scrutiny; the same press who pursue Bushs Skull and Bones club or ran other candidates off with persistent detective and research work?
Why havent newsmen pursued the 65 blatant lies told by this candidate during the Presidential primaries?
Where are the stories about this candidates cousin and the Muslim butchery in Africa ?
Since when did our national press corps become weak, timid, and silent?
Why havent they regaled us with the long list of socialists and communists who have surrounded this out of nowhere Democrat candidate or that his church re-printed the Hamas Manifesto in their bulletin, and that his close pastor friend and mentor met with Middle East terrorist Moammar Gaddafi, (Guide of the First of September Great Revolution of the Socialist Peoples Libyan Arab Jamahiriya)?
ff0000px;”>Why isnt the American press telling us this candidate is supported by every Muslim organization in the world?
As an ultimate slap in the face, be blatant in the fact your candidate has ZERO interest in traditional American values and has the most liberal voting record in U.S. Senate history.
Why has the American main stream media clammed-up on any negative reporting on Barak Hussein Obama?
Why will they print Hillary Rodham Clintons name but never write his middle name? Is it not his name?
Why, suddenly, is ANY information about this candidate not coming from main stream media, but from the blogosphere by citizens seeking facts and the truth? Why isnt our media connecting the dots with Islam?
Why do they focus on those bad American soldiers while Islam slaughters non Muslims daily in 44 countries around the globe?
Why does our media refer to Darfur as ethnic cleansing instead of what it really is; Muslims killing non Muslims! There is enough strange, anti-American activity surrounding Barak Hussein Obama to peek the curiosity of any reporter.
WHERE IS OUR INVESTIGATIVE MEDIA!?
A formal plan for targeting America was devised three years after the Iranian revolution in 1982. The plan was summarized in a 1991 memorandum by Mohamed Akram, an operative of the global Muslim Brotherhood. The process of settlement of Muslims in America , Akram explained, is a civilization jihad process. This means that members of the Brotherhood must understand that their work in America is a kind of grand jihad in eliminating and destroying the Western civilization from within and sabotaging its miserable house by their hands and the hands of the believers so that it is eliminated and Gods religion is made victorious over all other religions.
There is terrorism we can see, smell and fear, but there is a new kind of terror invading The United States in the form of Sharia law and finance. Condoning it is civilization suicide.
Middle East Muslims are coming to America in record numbers and building hate infidel mosques, buying our corporations, suing us for our traditions, but they and the whole subject of Islam is white noise leaving uninformed Americans about who and what is really peaceful.
Where is our investigative press?
Any criticism of Islam or their intentions, even though Islamic leaders state their intentions daily around the globe, brings-forth a volley of racist from the left-wing Democrat crowd. Lies and deception behind a master plan - the ingredients for The Manchurian Candidate or the placement of an anti-American President in our nations White House?
Is it mere coincidence that an anti-capitalist run for President at the same time Islamic sharia finance and law is trying to make advancing strides into the United States ?
Is it mere coincidence this same candidate wants to dis-arm our nuclear capability at a time when terrorist Muslim nations are expanding their nuclear weapons capability?
Is it mere coincidence this candidate wants to reduce our military at a time of global jihad from Muslim nations? Change for America?
What change? To become another nation of Islam?
Rich Carroll 2008
printed by permission
What are you disagreeing with me on? You replied to a post where I called Obama Obamaramadingdong.
Oh, sorry. I skimmed through a long post. I thought it was you saying you disagreed that Obama could be a Manchurian candidate. (blush) My bad.
Barack Obama has made it very clear that he considers it a "smear" to be Muslim, or to be labeled a Muslim. The proof of that is right out in the open, on his campaign's "Fight The Smears" webpage, where he "fights" the "smear"... "I have never been a Muslim."...and Mohammed wasn't the man Barry Soetero thought he knew. ;') Thanks L.
“[Side Note: There is no evidence his mother was ever Christian and his grandparents were Baptists who converted to Unitarianism, the only Christian Denomination Muslims accept actually follows the Teachings of Christ. Ann Dunham, on her daughter’s testimony disapproved of most Christians.]”
This note does not make sense. For a start, all the Unitarians I’ve seen are so liberal that they aren’t even sure who God is. Like the joke from a few years back, about Liberal/Reform Jews being simply “Democrats with holidays.”
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