Posted on 08/10/2008 2:21:32 PM PDT by pissant
Since the story broke late Saturday that Barack Obama’s real Birth Certificate, now in Republican hands, has the name Barry Soetoro and not Barack Obama, as we predicted a couple of weeks ago, I notice that many people are still confused about the implications of dual citizenship for Obama.
The matter is somewhat complex, so I’ve decided to try to provide a summary, with the help of resident expert ”Judah Benjamin.”
Indonesian Connection
Soetoro is the name on Obama’s Birth Certificate (BC) because a new BC was issued when he was adopted by Lolo Soetoro, his step-father. His original BC, which we assume was issued for Barack Hussein Obama at birth, would have been sealed at the time of the adoption.
Barry Soetoro probably acquired Indonesian citizenship in approximately 1965-1966, and may still hold it. He possibly changed his legal name back to Barack Hussein Obama as an older child, teenager, or adult, possibly never did — but even if he did, this procedure would not result in a change to the BC. (If he never legally changed his name back, I imagine his current name on the Presidential ballot would be invalid.)
The Birth Certificate published by Obama on his campaign website (still there, by the way) and distributed to the media was forged because the real BC on file is in the name Soetoro, an identity he apparently wanted to hide from the American people.
I am getting reports from different sources that Obama traveled to Pakistan in ‘81 with an Indonesian passport.
Prior to 2007 (and possibly earlier), Indonesian law did not permit dual citizenship. Thus, if Obama actively kept his Indonesian citizenship, his US citizenship could be challenged.
I suspect that Obama may have dumped his Indonesian citizenship at some point along the way, to advance his political career. But I would not be shocked if he still holds it. This question, however, should not overshadow the serious problem of hiding his Indonesian identity from the electorate.
Kenyan Citizenship
I personally doubt that Obama holds Kenyan citizenship. If he did, he could be stripped of his US citizenship under US law.
Barack Hussein Obama probably was a citizen of the British Crown (first two years of his life) and, effective 1963, a citizen of Kenya by virtue of his father’s nationality.
Under the Constitution of Kenya, he would have automatically forfeited his citizenship at the age of 21 unless he affirmatively “claimed” it. If he took some action to keep his citizenship, that’s a big problem because 1) Kenya prohibits dual citizenship and 2) the US does not recognize dual citizenship with Kenya. Further under the Kenyan Constitution, given his circumstances, he could only have kept Kenyan Citizenship, if he had it, by means of a Ministerial, Prime Ministerial, or Presidential Decree. (Of course, Raila Odinga is Prime Minister of Kenya and Odinga’s father, Oginga Odinga, was Vice President of Kenya and Barack Hussein Obama, Sr, was a close ally of the older Odinga.)
If Obama retained his Kenyan citizenship and helped campaign for his cousin Odinga, that is especially problematic under Title 8 of the U.S. Code, the relevant language of which is:
a) A person who is a national of the United States whether by birth or naturalization, shall lose his nationality by voluntarily performing any of the following acts with the intention of relinquishing United States nationality—
(2) taking an oath or making an affirmation or other formal declaration of allegiance to a foreign state or a political subdivision thereof, after having attained the age of eighteen years…
Again, I don’t think that Obama has Kenyan citizenship. I think that the Rocky Mountain report and Andy Martin’s work are poorly sourced on this point. I sometimes get the impression that Kenya serves as a diversion from the REAL PROBLEM, which is his Indonesian connection. It would be shocking to get actual confirmation of current Kenyan citizenship.
Electability & Eligibility Issues
These revelations raise several troubling issues for Obama’s electability and eligibility.
Foremost, there is the concerted attempt to cover up his Indonesian background and dual citizenship/identity from the electorate.
Secondly, there is a potential Constitutional problem with a POTUS having held dual citizenship, and Obama knows it; thus, the deception.
The “natural-born” clause of Article II is commonly understood to relate to the place of birth, but more accurately relates to loyalty to country as Commander in Chief. That was the original intent of the founding fathers. In McCain’s case, there is no question because of his circumstances (born on military base to 2 US citizens, later joined the military, never had anything to do with Panama, etc.). In Obama’s case, it’s not nearly so clear, especially given his travels, relatives, and associations in some of these other countries.
In my mind, however, the biggest problem is that Sen. Obama has intentionally concealed his background, Indonesian identity, citizenship, and the fact that he was at one time Muslim.
What else is he hiding? Credit must be given to Judah Benjamin, historian and former journalist, who has provided ground-breaking research on the factual and legal issues related to Obama’s Indonesian connection and dual citizenship; to Polarik for breaking the story of the COLB forgery; to Techdude for his analysis of the COLB forgery; to Dr. Kate for her tireless research efforts; to Michele, for bringing us a new COLB; to the No Quarter team for endless support; and to all the other writers and readers dedicated to the truth.
Provide evidence that he was born outside the United States, then the law you cite applies. But I repeat, no one has ever provided evidence that he was born any place other than Hawaii.
In my opinion he should NOT ever be President of the United States, but that is a decision for the American people to make in November. Assuming he actually is nominated by the Democratic Party.
ping
It depends on if they were faxed from a Kinkos in Abilene.
Could he have “lost” his citizenship, and need(ed) to be renationalized, and whether that makes him natural born or not under the Constitution? Dunno. That's a tough one. If he's elected, and there's a court challenge to that his election, I'd hate to think the Courts would void the decision of the electorate over a convoluted citizenship issue (I also doubt it will matter what the laws of these other countries say, unless the had Obama send a letter to Dept. of State renouncing his citizenship). Best case scenario, the challenge get’s dismissed. Worst case scenario, you have a decision that does whatever it takes to have Obama declared a natural born citizen (such as if you are natural born, renounce your citizenship, and then get your citizenship back, you are a still natural born; or you had to have been a natural born citizen, but you don't have to be a natural born citizen at the time of election to President). The ruling wouldn't matter, because I think the Presidency and line of succession is the only think that differentiates between natural born and naturalized, so nothing else gets disturbed.
Of course, if he was born in the United States, this does not even apply to him, he already has birthright citizenship, the same as anyone else born in the U.S.. This law would only apply if he had been born outside the U.S.
The 1994 law:
a. As amended by Public Law 103-416 on October 25, 1994, section 301 states as follows with respect to persons born abroad:
b. Sec. 301. The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
...
g. a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such person, was physically present in the United States or its outlying possessions for a period or periods totaling not less than five years, at least two of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years: Provided, That any periods of honorable service in the Armed Forces of the United States, or periods of employment with the United States Government or with an international organization as that term is defined in section 1 of the International Organizations Immunities Act (59 Stat. 669; 22 U.S.C. 288) by such citizen parent, or any periods during which such citizen parent is physically present abroad as the dependent unmarried son or daughter and a member of the household of a person (A) honorably serving with the Armed Forces of the United States, or (B) employed by the United States Government or an international organization as defined in section 1 of the International Organizations Immunities Act, may be included in order to satisfy the physical-presence requirement of this paragraph. This proviso shall be applicable to persons born on or after December 24, 1952, to the same extent as if it had become effective in its present form on that date;
Note that this condition applies retroactively to Obama, as the following condition shows:
l. RETROACTIVE APPLICATION:
(1) Except as provided in paragraph (2), the immigration and nationality laws of the United States shall be applied (to persons born before, on, or after the date of the enactment of this Act) as though the amendment made by subsection (a), and subsection (b), had been in effect as of the date of their birth, except that the retroactive application of the amendment and that subsection shall not affect the validity of citizenship of anyone who has obtained citizenship under section 1993 of the Revised Statutes (as in effect before the enactment of the Act of May 24, 1934 (48 Stat. 797)).
(2) The retroactive application of the amendment made by subsection (a), and subsection (b), shall not confer citizenship on, or affect the validity of any denaturalization, deportation or exclusion action against, any person who is or was excludable from the United States under section 212(a)(3)(E) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (8 U.S.C. 1182 (a)(3)(E)) (or predecessor provision) or who was excluded from, or who would not have been eligible for admission to, the United States under the Displaced Persons 1948 or under section 14 of the Refugee Relief Act of 1953.
This information comes from pp. 15-17 of the following U.S. State Department document:
7 FAM 1130
ACQUISITION OF U.S. CITIZENSHIP BY
BIRTH ABROAD TO U.S. CITIZEN PARENT
which is available in PDF format here:
http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86757.pdf
I hope this makes the matter clear.
Republican hands? Who’s?
You make a lot of blanket statements in here but I don’t see any links or other evidence to back it up.
I’m not saying you’re lying or anything like that. But until I see some solid evidence I am going to take this with a massive dose of salt.
Are you asking me or the author of this piece?
No, I want to know who has the birth certificate, If it’s in Republican hands, let’s see it. Maybe it has been posted somewhere else, but I haven’t seen it yet.
Maybe it’s in the same Republican hands that hold the “whitey” tape.
Or, suppose W had submitted a forged birth certificate in 2004 on his website. Would this not have been wall-to-wall coverage in the old media for two months? Heck, it might have knocked Abu Gahrib out of the top spot for a month.
Hell’s Bells! I can’t get to Texas Darlin’s website anymore! I’m redirected to a logon page. Damn those Obamabots!
Except that you forget that he was born in Hawaii, a US state in 1963. 2 illegal aliens who are 13 can slip across the border, have a baby, and that baby is a US Citizen. If one of the parents is a US citizen, all the better. There is zilch evidence that Obama was born anywhere other than Hawaii.
Now, there are angles on dual citizenship, renunciation of citizenship, travelling to Pakistan on an Indonesian passport, that ought to be fleshed out. They would, however, provide more political embarassment than legal cause to disqualify Obama. He was born a US citizen.
BUMP-TO-THE-TRUTH!
I do know if this the right place, but has anyone noticed that Texasdarlin has gone missing? Poof, gone, as in hacked perhaps? I am a conservative, but one that has come to rely o her blog for a lot of information. I hope she gets her blog up again soon.
Your post is very interesting, but I have a followup for it. Is Obama qualified to be a senator?
I know the requirements are different from the presidency, but I don’t know just what they are. Age requirement is different IIRC.
The only law that applies is the one in effect when he was born. Laws passed afterward do not apply. imho
expo facto I think applies.
Just noticed at hillaryclintonforum.net that they are experiencing the same thing. That is, they can’t get to TD’s site.
The only law that applies is the one in effect when he was born. Laws passed afterward do not apply. imho
expo facto I think applies.
An easy way to read Texasdarlin blog without signing in is to google Texasdarlin and hit the cashed link....
texasdarlin.wordpress.com/ - 4k - Cached - Similar pages
The link below also works
Also welcome to Free Republic
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