JUST CAN'T WAIT TO GET THAT NATIONALIZED HEALTH CARE

Oh yes .. this is going to be so wonderful. What a thrill. But ... the people demand that the government take care of them, and the politicians are only thrilled to respond if it means they can keep their precious positions of power.

Three stores came our way in just the last two days. The first was of a woman in Britain who was diagnosed with a small melanoma – skin cancer. Just a small spot. Problem was, it took her a few months to see a specialist to get it removed. By then it had spread and now she's going through the chemotherapy thing. May not survive. My own experience in this country – you know, the country with the hideous health care system – was somewhat different.

The lady what cuts my hairs told me she saw a spot on my noggin that she didn't like. Within one hour I was being looked at by a specialist. But then again, we don't have that wonderful national health care scheme they have in the UK.

Then there a story I saw last night on Fox News. This time it is Canada. You know how much liberals love to brag about Canada. Preliminary tests show that this young teenage girl has a budding tumor in her brain. She's now waiting for an MRI. Can't get an appointment for five weeks. Then, after the MRI, it is going to take another four to five months to get an appointment with a specialist to read the MRI an recommend a course of action. In the meantime this girl is suffering blackouts and cannot go to school. We just don't know what we're missing down here without this wonderful Canadian health care system looking over us.

Back to the UK. Another woman diagnosed with cancer. Her problem isn't a wait. Her problem is that she just flat can't get the operation. They're telling her that at 61 she's just too old. The health care services she seeks will be better spent on someone with longer to live.

But you folks pay no attention to these stores. Rationing won't happen here. There will be no months-long waits to have a melanoma removed. You'll be able to get an MRI within hours, or at least by the next day, if needed. After all .. this is the U.S. government we're talking about. A model of efficiency. Our national health care is just going to be paradise on earth. If you don't believe me you just go check out the emergency room of your local charity hospital. Look at all of the people there waiting to be treated for something that a spoonful of cough medicine or a squirt of Neosporin could cure. That ought to convince you.

Seems to me that McCain's program, when you add in the key feature of insurance across state lines, will make for a much greater choice of private health care insurance alternatives, including high deductible plans - with or without health savings accounts - for those who want that type of coverage.

This will not be government insurance, and it would not apply to folks who wish to go on and qualify for Medicare. No, it won't help to stabilize Medicare, but it will reduce the total number of uninsured and improve the economy with more disposable income.

Yes, the problems with illegal aliens' getting government-paid medical care would have to be addressed separately.

It's coming, you better believe it. It doesn't matter how bad an idea it is.

Wow, I'd suppose you are very much a pessimist by nature.

I would be willing to fight a war to prevent a bad idea like that from destroying the fabric of a great republic. Nothing wrong with the US being different and better than Canada and Europe.

So, do you have anything substantive to add to the subject of the thread, other than your willingness to “fight a war”?

“Nothing wrong with the US being different and better than Canada and Europe.”

Do you really think this is the goal, or are you taking a page from the Obama campaign to come up with this little ditty?

When I said “Socialized Medicine is coming” I was wrong - it is already here in medicare/medicaid. So you better lock-and-load. People are going to vote for/support socialized medicine, because they think they want it.

I need to ask you, do you have a government health plan, or a large-corporate group health plan? It certainly seems so. You should consider how much you are going to have to pay on an individual plan with the present system? Maybe you have a pre-existing condition? Maybe you are on medication?

It’s easy for everyone to say how much they are against socialized medicine when someone else is paying the bill for them. It is equally easy for someone to say they are for socialized medicine if they have to actually pay for their own insurance, or they have to go financially naked to an emergency room.

You doubt that we will get full-blown socialized medicine? Why?

...are you taking a page from the Obama campaign...

Heck, no. Obama and his buddies on the left wish to Europeanize America. On the other hand, I wish to perpetuate the great uniqueness of the greatest nation on earth, which is based on a system of law - at least on paper - where individuals have natural rights which government can't infringe upon (although admittedly, government doesn't always respect those rights). Mandating one-size-fits-all health coverage from government would violate those natural rights as American citizens to take care of our health as we choose. On the other hand, some of McCain's ideas on health insurance will, at least theoretically, move us in the traditional American direction of greater individual freedom in this area. Notice that, unlike the other side, I'm not calling McCain's ideas a complete panacea, but at least his program is much more compatible with traditional American values and law.

“Mandating one-size-fits-all health coverage from government would violate those natural rights as American citizens to take care of our health as we choose.”

Which is, of course, exactly what medicare is.

Since I think it’s coming, I hope that we’ll have something closer to the UK model than the Canadian model when we go to socialized medicine.

It still stinks, but at least there will be some mechanism for care above and beyond the NHS-style care.

But my point is that it is inevitable. If you actually paid the full for your own individual insurance, you would agree with me. If you had a pre-existing condition and tried to buy an individual policy, you would be for socialized medicine.

Businesses want it, more than half of Congress wants it, more than half of the American people want it. Medicare/Medicaid is already in place. When prices skyrocket, year after year, socialized medicine for all is going to come. I think it will come soon.

I don't accept the inevitability of nationalized medicine, and if you do, it would be difficult to call you a "conservative."

BTW, Medicare may be government run, and poorly so, but you (fortunately) will not be locked up for refusing to enroll in it - at least at this time. Plus, even Medicare enrollees have a right to contract privately for medical services rendered if they and their "provider" agree to it and their "provider" is not a "participant" in the program.

“I don’t accept the inevitability of nationalized medicine, and if you do, it would be difficult to call you a “conservative.””

Oh really? Well, if I can’t be a conservative, at least I can still be a republican.

That’s an asinine statement, but you’re entitled to it.

Let’s cut to the chase as to why you are so clueless.....Do you, or do you not pay for your own insurance?

This, of course is a trick question, because if you DID pay for your own insurance you wouldn’t be so self-deluded as to think that socialized medicine is not inevitable, given the cost, the cost growth of actually paying for it yourself. I’m not saying it’s a good thing that we’ll have socialized medicine, I’m just saying it is inevitable because of the expense of healthcare and the inability of average folks to afford insurance premiums.

So, who’s conservative now?

You are correct about "the expense of health care and the inability of average folks to afford insurance premiums." But, because the problem isn't a failure of free market economics but idiotic government policy that grossly distorts the market. That's why moving toward a solution entails a drastic change in the government policies that brought the problem about, rather than the extremist totatalitarian control of one seventh of the American economy by Big Brother!

And if you say you still can be a "republican" (I notice you spelled it with a small "r", but I'll assume you made a typo), that's fine and dandy. But, thank goodness, you won't find acquiescence to the inevitability of nationalized medicine in the GOP platform this year.

“Obama, is that you?”

See, that’s what I get for not using small words for you people.

If you do not pay for your own personal health insurance policy, you are completely out of touch with this issue and cannot possibly understand why socialized medicine is inevitable.

I am totally against it myself, as I have said, but having intimate knowledge how much small business and individual policies cost - I understand that the majority of people will not care about the obvious problems with socialized medicine - they’ll just know that they will get something out of it - more than what they presently have.

If you disagree, by all means say so, but if you want to debate with me, I’m going to ask you uncomfortable questions that will, I think, prove that most conservatives are really liberals on this issue, unless they pay for their own individual insurance. Which are you?

There. Were those words small enough for you?

you people

You people?

Oh, my, how condescending. Why the chip on your shoulder?

Papa told me to never get in a p***** contest with a skunk on a balcony.

However, just so you'll know, I pay for my health insurance, so I'm quite aware of the issue. BTW, in answer to your question to justiceseeker93, he probably won't mind if I tell you he also provides for his own health care.

Why do you NEED a health insurance policy? I don’t understand this. If you make enough money to pay $3000 a year in insurance (or even $2000, or $1000), then you make enough to pay for your own visits to the physician, which would be what? Once a year per person times four in the family? That would work out to what, $400 at most? If you need meds, there are generics and plans available through the pharma companies themselves. And, if anything catastrophic should happen like a heart attack or cancer, there is the option of a payment plan, or charitable organizations. Honestly, I wonder what would happen if more people just didn’t pay the ridiculous rates for health insurance and took care of things themselves?

“Papa told me to never get in a p***** contest with a skunk on a balcony.”

What did papa tell you about playing the skunks part?

“Oh, my, how condescending. Why the chip on your shoulder?”

You were being annoying, I was returning in kind. I’m probably better at it than you.

“However, just so you’ll know, I pay for my health insurance, so I’m quite aware of the issue. BTW, in answer to your question to justiceseeker93, he probably won’t mind if I tell you he also provides for his own health care.”

Ok, gotcha. I’m sure that’s why Mr. Justice wouldn’t answer the question himself.

If you pay your own premiums for your insurance policy then you have seen them increase substantially above the rate of inflation year over year just about every year. I’m sure your papa also taught you about exponential growth and how it diverges from reality, so that even reasonable people will do unreasonable things, like support socialized healthcare.

Healthcare is broken, the free market (that isn’t really free) has not brought forth a solution that mitigates costs and expenses, so we’re gonna get socialized medicine. There is no doubt, only a matter of time.

Stating the obvious doesn’t make me a socialist. Refusing to see the obvious doesn’t make you conservative.

Be more polite next time, and you’ll get polite dialog, assuming there will be any more.

“$3000 a year in insurance”

$3000 a year? if only it were so. Perhaps if you are 20 years old with a high deductible.

I see you point though, and do not disagree with it at some level.

However, when everyone takes your advice and relies on charity, the well runs dry quickly.

“And, if anything catastrophic should happen like a heart attack or cancer, there is the option of a payment plan, or charitable organizations.”

I don’t think you realize what treatment for those things cost. The only alternative for most folks is bankruptcy....

again, everyone can’t go that path or the system breaks.

If you are young and healthy, it might work to your favor.

You’re deliberately writing ambiguous messages. You’ve said you are against socialized medicine, but from your other comments it appears you are advocating it, and yes, my reading comprehension is just fine.

However, I do agree with you on one point, it’s only a matter of time until this country has socialized medicine.

“You’re deliberately writing ambiguous messages. You’ve said you are against socialized medicine, but from your other comments it appears you are advocating it, and yes, my reading comprehension is just fine.”

No, your reading comprehension is not fine. I never advocated socialized medicine. I simply stated the conditions for it coming to be, and it’s inevitability.

That’s why I need to use smaller words in communicating with you people. You don’t read well, nor do you understand.

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