Career Path in IT for homeschooled son

various online options ^ | 5/17/08 | Dutchgirl

[Dutchgirl]

I have been checking out various on-line IT courses for my college age home schooled son. I found this site for $149.00 that features a full menu of options for a flat one year membership,

SECURITY+ CERTIFICATION A+ CERTIFICATION

ACCOUNTANCY ADOBE

CISCO CLAIT

CONTACT MANAGEMENT COREL

DATABASES DESKTOP

DTP ECDL

E-QUALS GRAPHICS

I-NET+ CERTIFICATION INTERNET

LOTUS MCSE

MICROSOFT MOS

NETWORK+ CERTIFICATION NOVELL

PROGRAMMING SERVER+ CERTIFICATION

SOFT SKILLS UNIX

WEB DEVELOPMENT

and the other one in the link--whose typos on their web page do not inspire me with confidence.(My typos I attribute to my Saturday ration od Sam Adams)

Bottom Line: I have a great kid who wants to earn internet security cerifications without having to attend four years of liberal mind control meaningless classes. We are having a hard time wading through course descriptions to figure out where to get started. Soliciting freeper help and input.

[Dutchgirl]

Thanks for the link.

[Dutchgirl]

My hope is that gaining certifications on his own will inspire him to higher learning in a subject he’s actually interested in. Baby steps...

[AppyPappy]

I am borderline Aspbergers. When I was a kid, they thought I was autistic. In my teen years, I became an actor because I needed something to do. I forced myself out of my shell. If we had computers back then, who knows where I would be. Probably in a bad situation.

I do some computer security. I’ve had the SANS classes. Our computer security people are the most outgoing of the group because they are in so much demand. I couldn’t do it. I don’t like people that much and I abhor telephones.

I found that I loved to write computer code while I was in college thanks to my girlfriend at the time. But I graduated college with a 2.0 GPA. It was very hard to stay focused but I grew into it. It has to be something you love to do. I still build all of my own computers.

Here’s what worked for me. My parents never told me what to do. They paid for me to go to college and I made it on my own. I really needed to be on my own.

Buy him a backpack, a tent and a sleeping bag and dump him on the Appalachian Trail for a month. He’ll knuckle down after that.

[ClearCase_guy]

I agree completely. A degree is mandatory for any real advance in the field.

I fought that for years. I don't think the world should work that way. I do better work than that dork over there! Why did he get the promotion?? Well, dude, he has a degree. You don't.

It's just the simple raw fact. And at top levels, there is another ceiling if you don't have a graduate degree. You might think that 20 years experience matters. Nope. You're not on the review pile if you don't have the degree.

I hate it. But it's truth.

[politicket]

We homeschool as well, and here is what we are doing with a 15 y.o. IT-minded son:

First, your son needs to pray about and decide whether he desires to eventually work in his own business, or work as an employee for somebody else. I have done both, and owning your own business has a lot of rewards but takes up more hours in the day.

Second, find a Christian businessman in your area that specializes in IT and talk to him about mentoring your son. Work out an equitable arrangement where your son works (and learns) for free for a period of time and then begins to earn a small wage if he is any good and is an asset to the businessman.

IT degrees and certifications are worthless unless you're going to be someone elses employee. I've been in the industry close to 30 years and am currently mentoring two young men.

One more thing...if your son is into computer games then he needs to know that those days are over. I would expect any of the young men that I'm mentoring to be serious about their efforts, work diligently and faithfully, and be laying plans to build their household for their future bride. No ifs...ands....or buts.

[theBuckwheat]

Scrounge a few old PCs that you can put at least 256mb of memory in at least 5gb disk and a network card. Download one of the more mature Linux distros. Congrats, you now have the hardware to setup and experiment with 90% of the networking issues that you will learn in all those books. There is so much free info online and free software.

In today's business world, it is almost essential to get some type of certification if for the only reason that it can get your foot in the door. The single most valuable thing your son can have in this effort is an insatiable appetite for learning, a rabid curiosity about how things work, and a single-minded focus and terminal perseverance on figuring out why something doesn't work.

If he has these qualities, he will become very valuable and earn his way to an IT job that will pay quite well. There are still plenty of employers who, once you get past the HR department, are really focused on what a person can do as opposed to how many degrees they have.

[Reeses]

he is already on a computer 10 hours a day

He is acclimated then for a cube job! If he likes computer games consider a job skill for the gaming industry which is growing. Games are a bigger business than the movie industry now. Business IT is no longer good for entry level workers. This has become dominated by Indians, both on and offshore, that compete on cheaper price. IT has been very good to me but I'm planning to go back to school to formally learn investing skills. I can see the end of the line coming for me in IT.

[AppyPappy]

I was trying to find a nice way to say that the ability to play computer games is not a sign of anything. Disclaimer: I play computer games. I would say that reading alot is a better sign. It shows visualization skills which is important in analysis. A lot of our IT people are backpackers. Backpackers are generally problem-solvers and gear heads.

Gaming is a sign of a need for instant gratification.

[politicket]

Business IT is no longer good for entry level workers. This has become dominated by Indians, both on and offshore, that compete on cheaper price.

This is quickly changing in the industry. I have a particular client that spent two years developing a business application in Asia and wanted my company to come on board to manage the project. Upon completion of an extensive source review it became very apparent that the application was missing critical business needs and had an absolutely pathetic architecture (or lack thereof).

I ran some numbers for this client and showed them how they could develop a better product here in the states for the same amount of money by utilizing highly skilled programmers who also took time to learn the business domain that they were dealing with.

This account is now being done completely by my company and Asia is history.

Also, business programming is, and will always be, more lucrative financially than game programming. The game programmers work horrendous hours for comparatively little pay. I can take a decent programmer on as a subcontractor and have them making over $100,000/year if they show the motivation. Games are a waste of time...

[politicket]

I would say that reading alot is a better sign.

I agree. I invest about $3,000/yr. in books for my trade and invest a lot of time in reading them. That is why my skill-set, and what I'm able to mentor into young men is much more valuable than an IT degree and/or certifications.

I make these young men start their own corporations, learn to file taxes at all levels, and learn the economics of business (i.e.: what exactly a balance sheet is used for).

[Reeses]

if your son is into computer games then he needs to know that those days are over.

That was once good advice but no longer. Video games are big business now and is growing vs. IT which is being outsourced. The game industry needs a wide range of talents including hard to outsource creative and artistic skills. I can't stand video games myself but if someone loves them it's a good career choice these days.

[ShadowDancer]

It doesn't help that his little brother stayed in public school and just earned dst certification and will have oracle and MCSE by years end--at magnet school.

You basically just answered your own question with this. He is going to need schooling outside of the house at some point if he wants to achieve certain goals.

As far as his dealing with the liberal aspects of community college goes, seriously, big deal. It's a part of life and if he is going to succeed he is going to have to learn to adjust in all environments. The world is not going to bend to his thinking just because he wills it to be so. He can still aquire knowledge while filtering out the garbage. That's a lesson that should be learned by junior high.

[politicket]

Video games are big business now and is growing vs. IT which is being outsourced.

Not to disagree so much, but your points seem to be reflecting an individual who is an employee for someone else. Video game developers are not making very much money for the efforts that are demanded of them. I know this industry extremely well and a quality developer is doing fantastic if they make $70,000/year. This field is primarily for young men that are not married and literally spend their life programming games.

A young man that decides to grow up and behave like a young man (i.e. - preparing his household for his future bride instead of wasting away in front of some idiotic game) can learn a lot more skills in the business programming arena. These assets will give them an enormous amount of leverage later in life when they get married and have children.

I'm living this out every day, and mentoring other young men as well.

[AppyPappy]

We have a business incubator at Virginia Tech that does that. A Phd candidate will come up with a marketable idea. The incubator sets him up with a mentor team and set up an office for him. If the idea works out, they spin him off. It’s been wildly successful.

[politicket]

seriously, big deal. It's a part of life and if he is going to succeed he is going to have to learn to adjust in all environments.

It is a BIG deal for homeschooling families. We're not going to throw our sons and daughters into a pit of filth after spending so many years instructing them in the ways of the Lord.

Someone interested in computers does not need the "Sociology" and "Psychology" being taught in today's colleges and universities.

Sure, our kids need to know that this garbage exists, but we as parents shouldn't be throwing our kids into the pit of hell...especially our boys since they tend to be the ones to turn away from God.

[politicket]

A Phd candidate will come up with a marketable idea. The incubator sets him up with a mentor team and set up an office for him. If the idea works out, they spin him off. It’s been wildly successful.

That's great!

There's absolutely no reason that this exact type of arrangement can't work with young men getting started in life.

[ShadowDancer]

I mean no disrespect but for God’s sake, if your children haven’t gotten your message by college age, when the heck are they going to?

[Reeses]

they could develop a better product here in the states for the same amount of money by utilizing highly skilled programmers who also took time to learn the business domain that they were dealing with

Although their IT skills were laughable in the beginning India is coming up to speed and they are starting to dominate the newer business IT skill sets. The pool of highly skilled business programmers in the states is declining. And about half of IT projects get butchered by the local talent so why not have the project be butchered for half the price overseas?

If I were 18 right now I wouldn't go into IT but to Wall Street. Financial services are cyclical but the skills can be used play the new world economy game.

[Redbob]

Teach your son something that can’t be done just as well by someone named “Venkataperumal” in India.

For $5 a day.

[tbw2]

I work in IT support, with a 4 year degree in engineering. Trends I’ve noticed:
1. Credentialed educations go out of date quickly. You then have to keep taking classes to keep up to date. College degrees have a stronger, staying power.
2. The on-line training/credentials are easily available all over the world, including India. Programmers can be outsourced. However, those who gather system requirements from customers, do data mapping, work in IT management - those jobs stay here. And IT security - always, always American and often in house. You don’t outsource your body guard to India, and may not even trust a foreign national.
3. A college degree - 2 or 4 - gives you more options. If you are a certified web master or certified software installer or a certified unix server person, you’re niched. Like an electrician, highly skilled but VERY limited in career variety.
College degrees by their nature include a broader skill set. Like IT AND project management. IT AND security protocols, whether with people or data. IT AND forensics, whether recovering wiped data or working for the FBI.