Posted on 06/13/2006 7:12:47 AM PDT by dukeman
Well, Fitzgerald has gone and done it.
No indictment of Karl Rove. Once again, the ground has fallen out from under the Far Left moonbats.
For perspective on the moonbats’ disgust and fevered delirium, take a look at the contrast between their “Merry Fitzmas” giddiness since last Fall and today. The news is still too new for them to have turned on their beloved Fitz already, but give them time. Hell hath no fury like a moonbat scorned! Enjoy!
BEFORE
spooky3 Sun Oct-16-05 09:20 PM
Original messag
e Patrick Fitzgerald and Eliot Spitzer are my heroes
I love bulldogs who are super-competent and committed to justice. We desperately need them in these desperate times.
Who are your heroes?
Tim4319 Mon Oct-17-05 09:14 AM
Original message
What will happen to Patrick Fitzgerald after indictments are handed down?
malaise Mon Oct-17-05 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
1. They will start
the character assassination. Oh wait they've started it already.
Has anybody seen this from the right? I sure haven’t. In fact, just think of the contrast between the way we’ve treated Fitzgerald and the way the left treated Ken Starr. ‘Nuff said!
Stephanie Mon Oct-17-05 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
25. I see wedding bells in his future! [little heart graphics and smiley faces included here]
madrchsod Mon Oct-17-05 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #25
39. really..i`m not one to gossip...but i "heard" OldLeftieLawyer is falling in love with fitz...
mod mom Mon Oct-17-05 10:20 AM
Response to Original message
35. He'll be a REAL American HERO!!!!!!
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Lochloosa Tue Oct-18-05 07:21 AM
Lochloosa Original message
Whatever happens I want to thank Fitz
for not holding press conferences
for keeping his office from leaking
for showing the integrity that is so lacking in public life
for seeking the truth no matter where it leads
for not being Ken Starr
abluelady Tue Oct-18-05 08:53 AM
Response to Reply #6
17. And another.
Isn't it a shame when we have to go out of our way to address professionalism and the correct way to do things. It would be so nice to be able to expect the behavior Fitz showed.
snacker Tue Oct-18-05 07:23 AM
Response to Original message
2. I agree...
he is a true professional.
hiabrill Tue Oct-18-05 07:25 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. Absolutely
He's been amazing...
Tesla Tue Oct-18-05 07:27 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. Bless him and keep him safe!!!!
He is a true Patriot!!!
H2O Man Tue Oct-18-05 07:29 AM
Response to Original message
5. Nominated.
It's refreshing to see an honest person in the federal government. He stands in such a stark contrast to the president! This country can do better, and I think Fitzgerald is a role model of how it is done.
crispini Tue Oct-18-05 08:02 AM
Response to Original message
8. Fifth recommendation.
And here's to Fitz, who by his conduct has shown us that he is an honorable and stand-up guy. Mr. Fitzgerald, I'd like to buy you a beer or three sometime.
The Witch Tue Oct-18-05 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
13. Rec'd. GO FITZ.
There will be movies about this case for years and years to come and every time every actor will want to play him. The man will go down in history.
yibbehobba Tue Oct-18-05 08:34 AM
Response to Original message
14. Indeed.
We need people like him to save democracy from itself once in a while.
DoYouEverWonder Tue Oct-18-05 08:41 AM
Response to Original message
15. This is what America is supposed to be about
Good people doing good things. Good people doing the right things. Fortunately, there are at least a few still left in public service. Fitzgerald and his staff are definitely among them.
fooj Tue Oct-18-05 11:48 AM
Response to Original message
25. The man has restored my faith in humanity.
I told my hubby last night "Thank God we still have a few public officials that have some honor and integrity." My eyes teared up. I am so grateful for what this wonderful patriot is doing for our country. Stay safe, Mr. Fitzgerald.
Peace.
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chimpsrsmarter Thu Oct-20-05 10:34 AM
Original message
If Fitzgerald does not indict--how will he be treated here?
Edited on Thu Oct-20-05 10:37 AM by chimpsrsmarter
i'm going to guess ugly defcon 1. edited for correct defcon level.
don954 Thu Oct-20-05 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
2. i think after all the corruption we have seen it won’t be too much of a shock. We have been screwed so many times that most of us are prob secretly expecting it to happen again...
Well bitch, wine, vent.... But we will keep on fighting for what is right and honorable.
jobycom Thu Oct-20-05 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
3. Worse, if he only indicts Rove or Libby, will we go ballistic
and claim the fix was in.
I sometimes wonder if all these leaks are from BushCo, trying to work everyone up to expect a massive indictment of the whole administration, so that when only two indictments are returned Bush can say it was all overblown hype, and he'll look good.
Kralizec Thu Oct-20-05 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
10. If the last throws of Justice fail (Fitzgerald/Earl)? Well....
Revolution.
crispini Thu Oct-20-05 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
14. I think Fitz will have done his best.
I for one will press our representatives to pass a bill to allow him to issue a report. It must be very difficult for him, because I am sure that he is aware of how interested we all are in this investigation, but he also wants to make sure and only make an indictment when he can make a good case.
Of course, here on DU there will be a kabillion posts claiming that the BFEE "got to him."
kohodog Thu Oct-20-05 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
19. We'll be too depressed to say anything at all
dbeach Thu Oct-20-05 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
24. not well
beneath EVERY bush is dirt.
Bush criminals are ALWAYS near the crime.
NEVER the indicted or arrested criminal.
WONDER WHY?????
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ribofunk Thu Oct-20-05 10:32 AM
Original message
There's Only Way for Bush to Avoid Indictments...
now that the whole administration is backed into a corner:
Withdraw Harriet Meirs and nominate Patrick Fitzgerald.
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DemocracyInaction Thu Oct-20-05 12:17 PM
Original message
I Feel Like Fitzgerald Is Holding the Nation's Future in His Hands..
I've always said that we will never get back in power until the Repuke engineered image of themselves as THE PARTY OF GOD is attacked, cut down and destroyed. I feel that Fritz is the only thing we have had in five years and the only thing we are going to have of this size to blow a cannon hole into the side of their Ship of State and start it for the bottom. If he simply comes forth with a small ripple, these animals will continue to reign. If he comes forth with a good tidal wave (like implicating Cheney or even Bush - pray, pray)then that added to all the other corruption swirling around (DeLay, Frist, etc.)is perfect fodder for the Dems to show the slime behind the 'cross'. And, by god, if Fitz does go deep and long, the Dems have to jump on like the Repukes piled onto the Bill and Monica story. To do less would be unforgivable. Fitzgerald and Earl in Texas are the only thing it seems left of good, patriotic Americans trying to keep this country from the real enemies (if they succeed, I, for one, am going to finally feel some hope).
mmonk Thu Oct-20-05 12:26 PM
Response to Original message
5. In a way, he's our only check and balance
sam sarrha Thu Oct-20-05 12:34 PM
Response to Original message
8. actually the future of modern civilization,we will take the rest down with
us.. into mad max land
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HereSince1628 Thu Oct-20-05 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
10. Fitz' is in a position to create a crisis of unprecedented scale The breadth of the conspiracy that's been talked about involves multiple cabinet level positions as well as the offices of the P. and VP. It also involves at least one foreign government. Blair is still sitting, if Bush goes down, the Brits will have Blair out of office too.
Fitz could create a crisis whose scale has never been seen among the western democracies.
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garybeck Fri Oct-21-05 03:59 AM
Original message
Anyone thinking what I'm thinking?
If there really are 22 indictments coming, or something close to that, I guarantee at least one of those people knows the election was stolen, and exactly how it was done.
when we get closer a trial, and start talking about plea bargains and cutting deals, someone facing a long time behind bars might spill the beans.
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nostalgicaboutmyfutr Fri Oct-21-05 12:38 AM
Original message
The waiting is good....you'll see
more time...more leaks, more turn coats....more sweating at 1600...
more people to understand the full implications....more people to expect * to hold these people accountable...more people to think "all this and he DIDN'T KNOW???!!!"
more opportunity to go all the way to the top...
I may entertain the thought that maybe there will be no idictments that stick, or pardons get delivered all around, or maybe even another Saturday night massacre...at least for the past few weeks and coming days we saw a chance that people might fully understand what a lot of people here take for granted (the whole dirty Bushco crowd)
I like these days....there is at least the possibility of hope....
like the last few days of the election, when Kerry creamed Bush in the debates....like the night before the election when Zogby said Kerry will win on TDS with Jon Stewart...it was a good feeling then, until the following night, and it is a good feeling now....
enjoy the possible while it lasts....at the very least Bush is hobbled, and will never lead strongly again....at the best he is an unindicted co-conspirator....or even implied as one...
These are truely good times! I think we are on the verge of our world turning from black and white into color.....watch the legs curl under the house...
cheers....
Mira Fri Oct-21-05 12:50 AM
Response to Original message
3. That's my perception, too. It seems to be in such competent hands.
THe more I read about Father Fitzmas, the more I trust he'll bring a little respect back for us handling our affairs and cleaning up.
The longer he has them on the run, the more things will pop up and provide insights, proof, corroberation....
My only fear is that Bush may fire Patrick Fitzgerald.
Then we need to take to the streets, even before November 2.
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ewagner Fri Oct-21-05 10:30 AM
Original message
I really respect Fitzgerald
This article shows that Fitz did his homework really well before he interviewed Judith Miller...and, as a result, caught her failing to tell the "whole truth".
This guy is gooooooooddddd....
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berni_mccoy Fri Oct-21-05 09:52 AM
Original message
I'VE OFFICIALLY GOTTEN MY HOPES UP
A couple of weeks ago, I was very pessimistic about the outcome of the investigation. My feelings were that Bush could pardon such things as obstruction of justice and perjury and even the leaking of the CIA info. After all, these guys have blatantly lied and lived a different reality to this point. A blanket set of pardons would be a no-brainer (really) for them.
But then some things developed in the last two days that REALLY look like Fitz is going AFTER TREASON.
………….
But I would say to the Freepers: WE DUers have already been through that thought process, and it's a LOSE LOSE for you all!
Things are about to get very interesting. And I'm proud we've followed it so carefully and closely here at DU. MSM is useless. DU RULES!
NoBushSpokenHere Fri Oct-21-05 09:59 AM
Response to Original message
6. My hopes have been high enough to smile at Repubs
NOW that is an accomplishment.....I have been looking at them with a snarl ever since the election was stolen
cryingshame Fri Oct-21-05 10:06 AM
Response to Original message
9. Hm, Funny Coincidence. Fitzgerald was Kennedy's Middle Name....
Perhaps the Irish will end up kicking the Bush family's ass after all.
One Fitzgerald will be avenging the murder of another.
Karma might just be catching up with these thugs.
Generator Fri Oct-21-05 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
29. I'm swinging the opposite way
Proabably just because my (undiagnosed) anxiety disorder is killing me about know. The hurricane worries me (both for the poor Yucatan-which was my first time out of the country in five years this year and for the timing and for the gulf and for everything) my cat had surgery TWICE and now is fine (but yesterday we find a leftover thread and the husband freaks out-it was nothing) my best friend's father gets better-gets worse-almost dies-is okay again and yeow..everything on God's green earth says there MUST BE INDICTMENTS but I (we) been down so long-I don't know how to believe anything anymore. Of course this neatly ties in with the Kerry election anniversary (11/2 a date I cannot even handle thinking about) and I still think he won!
Justice must come. Won't get fooled again. Don't count your chickens-oh I KNOW and it irritates the hell out of me to be told as such.
Oh I can't read anymore speculation or hope or doom. This is killing me and I know it's killing everyone.
If it's any consulation I get really anxious and doom laden at the end of any trial. It's the worse part for me-the last days on the job-not the four years of misery. It's almost here BUT.....
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YouthInAsia Fri Oct-21-05 11:35 AM
Original message
OPPINIONS NEEDED: What brand Champagne should I celebrate Indictments with
I dont have alot of money, so something along the lines of Cristal is out. I just need a nice champagne that I can pop open and guzzle as I'm dancing in the street outside my apartment building. I already have it planed out: as soon as news drops, I'm draped in my American flag, parading up and down West Chester pike in Philadelphia with a bottle of champagne and the BIGGEST SHITEATING GRIN one has ever worn.
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hang a left Fri Oct-21-05 11:13 AM
Original message
I propose a flower fund for Fitz after the Indictments are announced.
I don't know how we could do it. Perhaps we could find a florist close to the courthouse or his office or wherever he hangs out. Everyone could call that florist and donate money. Wouldn't it be awesome if we could have a brazilian roses delivered to him while he is speaking in front of the cameras? An attached card that lets him know it is from the majority of the Americans in this country. I am sure we will have an hour or so to prep the florist to make sure that they would be there on time.
What does everyone think?
Rainbowreflect Fri Oct-21-05 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
36. Maybe we could send the White House a RIP wreath.
Mira Fri Oct-21-05 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
12. I am so for it ! Remember Barbara Boxer and the flowers!
I wonder sometimes if Mr. Fitzmas has any idea about how we are waiting, and just how much of our hopes / dreams and the start of our vindication he is holding in his hands.
If he were buried in flowers - that I would like to show the world!!!!
I'm psyched.
Who can make the arrangements?
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THIS NEXT ONE IS NOTEWORTHY, BECAUSE THEIR PUBLIC ATTITUDE WILL CHANGE IF FITZGERALD DISAPPOINTS THEM
Stevendsmith Fri Oct-21-05 11:33 AM
Original message
What is your minimum satisfactory outcome in the CIA leak investigation
I suppose mine is an indictment of Karl Rove.
But, dammit, this country deserves a hell of a lot more than that.
Uben Fri Oct-21-05 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
2. Rove, Libby,....
indicted and convicted, Cheney resignation. Minimum.
ClassWarrior Fri Oct-21-05 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
3. Minimum? Do irreparable political damage to the GOP. Guess what?
I'm already a winner!!
Dunvegan Fri Oct-21-05 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
4. Clearcutting the entire Washington...
...aspen forest.
And don't forget to burn the "vast connected root system", to boot.
I lived through Watergate...and that took forever (even through a second term) to resolve.
But that resolution was satisfactory.
I'll be satisfied if all the criminals are out of DC and/or in jail.
Pretzel-nit included.
Stevendsmith Fri Oct-21-05 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
5. We're hearing lots of chatter about perjury, obstruction of justice, etc.
That's not good enough.
My appetite is whetted for a White House implosion.
tallahasseedem Fri Oct-21-05 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
6. Rove gets a new boyfriend....and....
the GOP dies a slow death.
AngryAmish Fri Oct-21-05 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
10. Bush in jail --all else is failure
Halliburton Fri Oct-21-05 12:10 PM
Response to Original message
12. as long as Rove is indicted
I'm happy. I'd be disappointed if it only were Scooter who was indicted and Rove got away.
Semi_subversive Fri Oct-21-05 12:31 PM
Response to Original message
14. Conviction and execution of
all involved. Drastic, but it makes me feel better saying it.
meisje Fri Oct-21-05 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
17. Bush, Cheney and Rove working a chain gang
tasteblind Fri Oct-21-05 12:38 PM
Response to Original message
18. The only satisfactory outcome is total administration turnover.
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shraby Fri Oct-21-05 01:31 PM
Original message
Fitzgerald has a website!!!!!
Ladyhawk Fri Oct-21-05 01:36 PM
Response to Reply #2
10. You mean, something new to hit refresh on every few minutes. :)
The Witch Fri Oct-21-05 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
3. nothing juicy so far...
Spazito Fri Oct-21-05 01:33 PM
Response to Original message
6. Oh!!! I am doing my damndest NOT to read anything into this BUT
I am failing miserably, lol. The timing is just TOOOO delicious!
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bostonbabs Fri Oct-21-05 01:43 PM
Response to Reply #6
23. I agree....Fitz WILL TELL THE TRUTH
and dare anyone say NO or call him a LIAR.... let everyone SEE....all the right wing nuts....I can hear the spin!!!...and documents too!!!!!! WEEEEEEEEEEEEE
enid602 Fri Oct-21-05 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
15. good job
I think Fitzie's doing a heck of a job!!!!!
BuyingThyme Fri Oct-21-05 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
20. There's not one naked picture on the whole site.
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Botany Fri Oct-21-05 07:30 PM
Original message
May I take this moment to offer love & support to any "freeper" .....
or Fox news person reading DU and feeling down.
I feel that I must take this chance to comfort you and wish that
THE BILE IN YOUR GUT CAUSES YOU TO VOMIT AND NOT SLEEP
FOR DAYS. After all I am a person of kindness.
bush & company are going down. Merry Fitzmas!
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amerikat Sun Oct-23-05 02:16 AM
Original message
I'm hoping the Fitz GJ links to Cheney's Energy Task Farse.
I sure would like to see what really happened there. I hope once and for all oil leaves a bad taste in the mouth of the murican consumer.
Fridays Child Sun Oct-23-05 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
1. Me, too. It all goes back to that, I think.
Of course, we know that the neocons have been hatching their plans, for more than a decade. But, in early 2001, members of the Energy Task Force probably discussed the rationale for invading Iraq. And Cheney knows he's dust, if it ever comes out.
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wovenpaint Sun Oct-23-05 12:43 PM
Original message
The night before Fitzmas
I was inspired by another poster's comment that we should have this poem(but can't find the post now....), and since it's a rainy Sunday afternoon, here it is.
THE NIGHT BEFORE FITZMAS (adapted from Clement C.Moore's famous poem)
Twas, maybe, the night before Fitzmas, when all through white house,
Not a creature was stirring, not even a louse?
High hopes were sung by the internet sphere in hope that indictments would soon be there.
And Mama in her DU tee-shirt and I in my FW cap, had just settled down to a long, C-Span nap.
When out from the screen there arose such a clatter, I sprang from my couch to see what’s the matter.
Away to the computer. I flew like a flash, tore open the popcorn and threw out the trash.
The spotlight on the bre*st (censored!) of the newly fallen lies, gave luster of midday to newly-opened eyes.
When what to my wondering eyes should appear, but a hugh limo and lawyers to the rear.
With such a driver so lively and quick, I knew in a moment, it must be “St.“ Fitz.
More rapid than soaring eagles, his lawyers they came, and Fitz whistled and shouted and called out by name,
“Now Libby, now Hannah, now Rove and now Card, On Condi, on Judy, on Cheney -and BUSH et all!
To the top of the portico, to the top of the wall, now, dash away, dash way, dash away ALL!”
As aspen leaves that before the wild hurricane Wilma fly, when they meet with an obstacle, mount to the sky,
so up to the hilltop the lawyers they flew, with files full of indictments, and “St” Fitzgerald, too.
Then, in a twinkling, I heard there was PROOF- that caused pawing and prancing of each evil hoof.
And as I sat at the computer, after turning around,
on the screen came Fitzgerald, with a leap and a bound.
He is dressed in his best suit, and since he had spoke, his clothes are all tarnished with mirrors and smoke.
His eyes, how they twinkle, his dimples how merry, his followers all cheer him, as he stands with the jury.
A briefcase of files he has flung on his back, and he looks just like Santa opening his pack.
Yet, with a wink of his eye and a twist of his head, he soon gave me to know that I had nothing to dread.
He spoke not a word but went straight to his work, and filed the indictments for many a jerk.
Then he sprang to his limo, and to his team gave a whistle, and away they all flew, like a patriot missile.
But I heard him exclaim, as he drove out of sight, “Happy Fitzmas to all and to all a better night!”
cat_girl25 Sun Oct-23-05 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. F*** W!
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the_spectator Sun Oct-23-05 01:56 PM
Original message
Fitzmas will be a beginning, not an end. WILL AMERICA CARE?
I'm quite confident that Fitzgerald will issue a number of indictments next week. But this will not mean "curtains" for the Bush administration. Instead, the indictments of Fitzmas will raise the curtain on what is becoming one of the great American dramas: the second term scandal. Every two-term president since Nixon has faced one of these, where he or members of his administation face trouble with the law.
I have no doubt that another one of those great dramas is about to unfold. No one knows, at this point, how it will play out, after the sound and fury have strutted and fretted their hour upon the stage. And no one knows the answer to the greatest question of all, which wil be decided not by the players, but by the audience: WILL AMERICA CARE?
Will America Care enough about this for this President to be impeached, or for his party to be punished at the polls? No one knows yet.
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Dinger Thu Oct-27-05 11:54 PM
Original message
Official Prayer Thread Before Indictments
Dear Lord,
You know what is best for this country and this world. PLEASE, let justice roll like a river (Book of Amos-Old Testament) against the BFEE.
Amen
Yeah, I’m sure God needed your pointing Him to Scripture, moonbat!
p.s. This was the one and only post of this “official prayer” thread.
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smoogatz Sun Oct-23-05 01:43 PM
Original message
Frog march frog march FROG MARCH!
I had to say it.
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still_one Sun Oct-23-05 05:31 PM
Original message
Why should we be so sure the indictments will be big?
After what we have been through the last six years I am so dis-illusioned. We have been blocked at every opportunity. I certainly hope we are not setup for another disappointment
the_spectator Sun Oct-23-05 05:57 PM
Response to Original message
14. We may be about to snatch psychological defeat out of the jaws of victory-
We're waiting. It's almost here. Like the first real voting of the '04 Primaries, to the Dean people. And they were crushed. The '04 General Election back in November. And we were all crushed. On a lower level, things like the DSM. Remember that moment on these boards when so many thought it would bring down the regime, and pronto?
Thing is, THIS time -- we're going to win the day! There WILL be indictments! Fitzmas will no longer be a happy dream, but a visceral reality. And we will glory in victory that day, for sure: the Freeps have their head in the sand on this one. Even intelligent and politically savvy-enough righties, like those on the Corner (the National Review crowd) are wishing this away with hope and bad logic.
And the great masses of people WILL sit up and take notice, the indictments will fall unexpected out of the clear-blue sky for them. They will learn for the first time about yellowcake and Miller, Rove and Libby, Wilson and Plame.
But this glorious victory will NOT mean an END for Bush and his administration. It is not curtains for them, it is just the OPENING curtain of a great second-term scandal/drama.
I really fear that it will all be so sad for many of us: after tasting real victory for the first time in ages on Fitzmas, I fear many will have their morale crushed again when the war doesn't end, the troops aren't home by Christmas, and Bush isn't impeached BEFORE we can even take back Congress in the '06 elections.
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YDogg Sun Oct-23-05 05:20 PM
Original message
Poll question: What if there are no indictments?
How disappointed will you be?
Until such time as it is known what Fitzgerald does as a result of the investigation, this is somewhat premature, but I'm curious to know just how high hopes are that high ranking members of the bush administration will be indicted.
Poll result (63 votes)
Not disappointed; the attention alone brought to the Plame Case was worthwhile. I knew they'd elude justice. (2 votes, 3%)
Mildly disappointed; the republicans suffered enough negative publicity to make the investigation worthwhile. (0 votes, 0%)
Disappointed; even if crimes were not committed, perjury seemed like a distinct possibility. (4 votes, 6%)
Very disappointed; this administration has brought shame to the United States, and their criminal ways have been established. (51 votes, 81%)
None of the above (please elaborate). (6 votes, 10%)
4MoronicYears Sun Oct-23-05 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
1. So this is Fitzmas.... how long will it be...
'til justice has spoken.. in the land of the "free"...
I will be greatly dismayed if this doesn't make watergate look small in comparison.
McKenzie Sun Oct-23-05 05:39 PM
Response to Original message
8. I voted "None of the above" - here's why
I voted "None of the above" because I will be more than just disappointed if Fitzgerald does not bring charges that are sufficient to mortally wound the Bush administration. This is make or break time. Notwithstanding the damage to the credibility of the neocon cabal that indictments of smaller players might cause, their track record suggests they will just carry on regardless. They must be removed or neutralised. Consequently, everything hinges on what charges are brought by Fitz and, more importantly, against whom.
There are two possibilities: Either Fitzgerald's charges bring the neocon cabal down or they will carry on regardless, even if it means having to ignore a huge public outcry (something they have done over Iraq so far). Fitgerald's credentials are such that his findings will be regarded as the real deal. That is both encouraging as well as a source of concern. Sure, there will be a massive outcry if the neocons are left to govern, but what are people then going to do to stop them if someone with Fitzgerald's credentials fails to bring down the neocons?
DVJNU Sun Oct-23-05 06:42 PM
Response to Original message
18. Very disapointed, and I might add I'll probably go into a deep funk, just like I did on 11/3/04
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QuettaKid Tue Oct-25-05 07:32 AM
Original message
Is it Fitzmas yet.....!?!?!?
I really don't think I can stand the suspense much longer.
seemslikeadream Tue Oct-25-05 07:35 AM
Response to Original message
1. Did you leave milk and cookies out last night QuettaKid?
It's beginning to look a lot like Fitzmas
Everywhere you go.
Who's gonna do five-or-ten?
We're thinking once again
Of handcuffs and of orange jumpsuits aglow.
It's beginning to look a lot like Fitzmas
Indictments on every score
But the prettiest sight to see
Is the scowl on Darth Cheney
At the slammer's front door.
A warrant or writ, a subpoena that fits
Is the wish of Barney and Ben;
The thought of Turdblossom hung up like a possum
Is the hope of Janice and Jen;
And Mom and Dad can hardly wait for court to start again.
It's beginning to look a lot like Fitzmas
Everywhere you go.
There's an defendant who doesn't want to tell;
One in the White House as well --
The felony kind that doesn't mind the law!
It's beginning to look a lot like Fitzmas
Soon the bells will start
And the thing that will make them ring
Is the indictment that we sing,
Right within our hearts!
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A-Schwarzenegger Tue Oct-25-05 04:48 AM
Original message
Is it Possible for Fitz to Indict Every Single Freaking Idiot who voted for Bush?
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Historic NY Tue Oct-25-05 02:36 AM
Original message
All I want for Fitzmas.........
is 22 indictments.
Come, Libby, Dick, Karl, Judy and the whole lot.
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sidwill Tue Oct-25-05 11:12 AM
Original message
I...can't .....stand.....the....suspense
Here I am on my day off, 2 double shot cappuccinos in my system, unshowered, disheveled, hitting refresh on my webrowser every 5 seconds................arrrrrrrrrrrgggggggggggggggghhhhhhh
when is this gonna end?
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DistressedAmerican Tue Oct-25-05 10:38 AM
Original message
Oh! Oh Yes. Ooooh Baby! That's It! INDICT ME! INDICT ME HARD!
Well not me actually. THEM! INDICT THEM!
Indict the hell out of their criminal asses!
cat_girl25 Tue Oct-25-05 11:06 AM
Response to Original message
6. Fitzgerald is probably the first man that will give both men and women pleasures at the same time from a news conference!
------------------------------
cat_girl25 Tue Oct-25-05 01:40 PM
Original message
Please Fritzgerald, I don't want to Cry!
You're killing me here! Sigh!
------------------------------
Chimpys_Last_Stand Tue Oct-25-05 02:33 PM
Original message
Will you still love me, tomorrow?
To borrow the title of that old "Shirelles" song, will you, still love him, if Fitzgerald asks for either no indictments or only offers up a couple of slaps on the wrist??
I too eagerly await a scathing and debilitating judicial b*tchslap from Fitz, but all this Fitzmas 'cart-before-the-horse' stuff is giving me a headache.
The guy is a federal prosecutor, not a man with a bag full of presents sliding down a chimney.
Anyway, here's hoping justice prevails in the end.
marylanddem Tue Oct-25-05 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
2. Why should we still love him tomorrow if he lets us down?
Even if he has that kind of work-obsessed-single-guy-who-eats-pizza- alone every night kind of charm...
cat_girl25 Tue Oct-25-05 02:44 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. He's not eating it alone every night.
I read somewhere that he's got a main squeeze....the lucky bitch!
------------------------------
patrioticliberal Tue Oct-25-05 04:01 PM
Original message
Fitzgerald is already disappointg me
They say AT LEAST TWO indcitments at RawStory.com . How about TWENTY TWO like rumored before? And one already submitted to grand jury, according to RAW STORY.
------------------------------
onenote Tue Oct-25-05 02:58 PM
Original message
So if it turns out that there are only a couple of indictments
How long is it going to take before the first threads appear on DU claiming that Fitz (a) was bought off and/or was always on the take; (b) was threatened; (c) has some secret plan; or (d) all of the above.
alcibiades_mystery Tue Oct-25-05 03:19 PM
Response to Original message
8. 18 seconds
Fitz will be the biggest villian in history in under ten monutes.
My prediction:
A) No indictments
B) if any indictments, they will be as follows:
I. Lewis Libby - 1 count perjury
I. Lewis Libby - 1 count obstruction of justice
I will use the following as my signature for 1 month if I'm wrong: "I'm a big idiot for underplaying the Plame Affair and getting the indictments dead wrong."
-----------------------------
1956 Tue Oct-25-05 05:01 PM
Original message
A great American Hero!
I believe with all my heart that Patrick Fitzgerald, with indictments in hand, and all his cards on the table, no matter what the final outcome, will become a Patriotic Hero to outshine the likes of many in history. Just think of what he's actually about to do! If he is able to bring these thugs down, why it just blows me away to think what it means to America, the real America! Really folx, think about what it will mean to all of us in the end!!
PaulHo Tue Oct-25-05 05:05 PM
Response to Original message
1. I don't believe *anything* with all my heart, but...
I hope you are right.
Drb Tue Oct-25-05 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
2. Fitz deserves a solid gold medal the size of a frying pan!!!
Plus free beer for the rest of his life!
Seriously, you're 100% right. We can all imagine the pressures and the bribes he's had to work past to get the country -- all the country, not just us lefties -- to where we are today.
The right wing owes Fitz more than they can ever possibly imagine. Once again, they're free to be Eisenhower conservatives, with a real Conservative agenda, not a Kleptocratic agenda.
If he's not the Man of the Year, I don't know who is.
cat_girl25 Tue Oct-25-05 05:29 PM
Response to Original message
3. Oh you don't want me to start talking about Fitzgerald.
I'll just say I'm high on him right now.
------------------------------
Walt Starr Tue Oct-25-05 11:04 PM
Original message
So what's the true meaning of Fitzmas?
"And he brought forth his first felony charge, and he sought the indictment, for there was no room for it in another.
And there was in that country, neighbors of the outted operative, keeping watch over their homes by night.
And low, the Agent of the Counsel appeared before them, and the Glory of the Counsel shown round about them. And they were sore afraid.
And the Agent said unto them, 'Fear not, for behold, I bring thee good tidings of great joy.
For on this day in the city of George, an indictment has been sought against traitors to us all.'
And there was with the Agent a great host, praising Fitz and saying, 'Glory to Fitz for his indictments, and on Earth, Peace and goodwill towards man.'"
That's the true meaning of of Fitzmas, Charlie Brown.
------------------------------
Skidmore Wed Oct-26-05 02:40 PM
Original message
Okay, I'm back. Anything happen yet?
I had a nice long nap--and feel more rested, but out of touch.
------------------------------
Stevendsmith Wed Oct-26-05 03:27 PM
Original message
Do you think Fitz knows the term "Fitzmas"?
Do you think he's aware of the cult status he's achieved on the lefty Web?
I know he's not surfing DU and the blogs, but I wonder if he's at all aware that we're all going Fitz-crazy!
The Backlash Cometh Wed Oct-26-05 03:30 PM
Response to Original message
5. Fitz knows everything.
Oregonian Wed Oct-26-05 03:33 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. He knows when you've been sleeping, he knows when you're awake
He knows when you've been bad or good, so be good for goodness sake!
------------------------------
Protagoras Thu Oct-27-05 02:09 PM
Original message
Breaking! Fitz wipes his mouth after eating a Doughnut!
Seriously though...this is important but let's not kill ourselves stressing over what he's going to do in his own time. It's this sort of extreme emotional disregulation that wrecked a lot of great DUers during the election.
We have to stay balanced enough that we have energy to fight the next stage of this battle...regardless of what it is...and the battle beyond that...regardless of what it is.
Try and spend some time with the kids, pets, at work, and sleeping...because this is something that is currently out of our hands.
"God grant me the serenity
to accept the things I cannot change;
courage to change the things I can;
and wisdom to know the difference."
Arkana Thu Oct-27-05 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
1. Raw Story breaking! Fitz spilled coffee in his lap!
I agree.
OmmmSweetOmmm Thu Oct-27-05 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
53. Can I wipe it up????? ;)
------------------------------
laureloak Thu Oct-27-05 11:12 AM
Original message
Fitzgerald for President How about that?
LynneSin Thu Oct-27-05 11:17 AM
Response to Original message
9. So I'm suppose to vote for a Republican for president?
Um, don't think so.
Just like I don't want McCain running for any part of the democratic presidental ticket.
I'm a democrat - that's all I vote for
------------------------------
Justice Is Comin Thu Oct-27-05 11:59 PM
Original message
As long as I hear the words espionage or conspiracy
somewhere in those charges tomorrow, I'll be flinging confetti around the room. That will also throw the door wide open for Wilson's civil suit, depositions etc.
And will that be some mucho problemato's.
------------------------------
geek tragedy Thu Oct-27-05 11:58 PM
Original message
Okay, I'll say it.
If all Fitzgerald comes back with tomorrow is false statement charges against Libby, then this has been the most overhyped story since year 2k computer speculation.
Your average civil lawsuit contains multiple incidents of people lying their asses off. The reason they don't get caught is that they don't have a prosecutor verifying each and every statement they make under oath.
If there was no evidence of a criminal release of a CIA agent's name, if there was no evidence of a criminal conspiracy, if they couldn't even catch Karl Rove in a lie, then we've really been wasting our time with this story.
Now, I could be proven wrong, and all of those *breaking hard* stories from Raw Story et al may be right.
But, if tomorrow comes and Scooter Libby, a nasty little crooked reptile, goes down for false statements and that's all that happens, then we need to move on to other issues.
This is all turning out to be rather anti-climactic.
Fri Oct-28-05 12:09 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. Damn
I agree with the O.P. if this is all Libby on perjury then I give up ...... "they" lied us into a war. I hope Rove is singing and that other people go down but as of now T.T. ..... the turd blossom walks.
------------------------------
PretzelWarrior Thu Oct-27-05 10:49 PM
Original message
If Rove isn't indicted I WILL MARCH to WH to join the revolt
and demand some accountability. THat would be PURE BULL****
The smelly dripping pus bag, Rove, is a danger to all of human society. He MUST be stopped. So should Bush and the entire gang of war criminals.
I WILL NOT REST TILL THEY ALL MEET THEIR MAKER, BEELZEBUB, in the FIERY CHAMBERS OF HELL!
We need restitution. The nation is awaiting a chance to sigh and finally grieve over the shit this idiot in chief has dragged us through.
Death is too good for them. They should spend decades being arranged in man piles and having their genitals snapped at by German Shepherds.
Words cannot evoke the sheer hatred and loathing I have for those piles of vomit daring to tread in our most hallowed halls!
The Night Owl Fri Oct-28-05 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
6. Get a grip...
You should be celebrating that a very high level White House official is about to be indicted. Today is not a good day for Republicans.
Rove is just a glorified PR guru anyway, so stop obsessing about him.
Libby is not nobody.
Leftist_Warrior Sat Oct-29-05 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. That sounds like something shurb said once...
"We don't really care about Bin Laden" after telling everyone we invaded Afghanistan to "get Bin Laden".
We (all of us!) were hoping for Rove and we get some clown 2 years ago none of us even heard of... and we're now supposed to be happy with him going down?
He's already been replaced. There's another no name clown sitting at his desk right now. Wow, that really put a dent in the shrub cartel.
FARAFIELD Thu Oct-27-05 09:49 PM
Original message
NO INDICTMENTS?
What with it going down to the last day and Rove and Libby not resigning im beginning to think that they are jerking us off and nothing is going to happen. Lets face it Even if LIbby is indicted, If ROVE gets off the hook, this story will fall off the planet. I just get a feeling that didly squat is going to happen. Actually i could be jinxing it in a good way too, saying that nothing will happen then a whole bunch of the buttmonkeys get indicted. What do you think will really happen?
Kurt Remarque Thu Oct-27-05 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. libby will be indicted for prejury and that will be it, i fear
------------------------------
Lex Thu Oct-27-05 08:36 PM
Original message
Kevin Costner must play Fitzgerald in the movie.
I'm no Costner fan, but they look very similar to me.
------------------------------
FRIDAY, OCTOBER 28TH—THE LONG AWAITED AND PROPHESIED DAY ARRIVES!
Dawgs Fri Oct-28-05 07:29 AM
Original message
Tin foil hat time...
What if all the leaks about Rove/Cheney/Libby being indicted were nothing more than the right giving something to the media, so that it won't be such a big deal if say, only Libby gets indicted?
I'm sure this might have already been mentioned and its probably not true, but I can't believe the Republicans wouldv'e just done nothing.
------------------------------
Rainbowreflect Fri Oct-28-05 07:24 AM
Original message
It had better really be today because I am all ready!
I took the day off work. I have champagne chilling. I'm on DU for the day. The TV is on CNN with the remote close at hand.
How are you prepared for today?
------------------------------
brentspeak Fri Oct-28-05 12:55 AM
Original message
Fitzmas: A perfect example of why Democrats lose
"Fitzmas" is just a replay of the Bush National Guard/60 Minutes/F911 mistakes: time and energy better spent campaigning and/or building Democratic grassroots is wasted on uselessly blogging and posting endlessly about scandals and rumors of scandals. People (or rather, some people) expect some "magic bullet" in the form of a scandal or a film or something else to bring the Republicans down: It doesn't work that way. It won't work that way.
Recently, I read an article about some young Republican training camp. The director of the camp told his young, well-dressed chickenhawks that (paraphrasing) "conspiracy theories and scandals about Republicans are sometimes good - it makes Democrats chase after blind leads in blind alleys and completely wastes their time. Meanwhile, we do the groundwork to win."
Vinca Fri Oct-28-05 05:16 AM
Response to Original message
45. We've been waiting years for the moon and stars to be aligned
in such a fashion that the truth about Bush and his criminal cronies would emerge. Think of a year ago. You couldn't pay the media to cover a negative story about this bunch. While your points are probably valid, I'm going to enjoy Fitzmas for all its worth.
Der Blaue Engel Fri Oct-28-05 12:08 PM
Response to Original message
57. None of these have been blind leads
Republicans would like you to think so, though.
Oh, and P.S., in case you missed the memo: Democrats "lose" because RW proprietary software counts our votes.
------------------------------
Leopolds Ghost Fri Oct-28-05 12:45 AM
Original message
MOMMY! DADDY! WAKE UP! It's FITZMAS!!!
Is it Fitzmas yet! Time to open our indictment(s)!!!!
AntiFascist Fri Oct-28-05 02:20 AM
Response to Original message
13. The spirit of Fitzmas should last all year long...
Remember kids, the bad criminals who are running our country aren't just guilty of simple crimes like perjury or disclosing an agent's identity. There are larger issues at stake such as treason: lying to Congress and the American people about the reasons we should go to war, sacrificing lives out of pure greed, collaborating with our enemies, and selling our country short, not to mention the latest reports that the last election really was corrupted. We should be thankful that our judicial system is as strong as it is, and that we have some ability to deal with tyrants, whereas in some other countries kids aren't quite as lucky. Sweat dreams!
------------------------------
Pacifist Patriot Fri Oct-28-05 09:16 AM
Original message
2:00 PM News Conference
Can't wait!
------------------------------
ocelot Fri Oct-28-05 08:49 AM
Original message
If Rove isn't indicted TODAY...
when will we see the first post here that says something to the effect of: "I knew it! Fitzgerald is just a Republican tool! They always win! Nothing will happen! WAAAAHHH!!!" ?
deadparrot Fri Oct-28-05 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
1. Before you can say "Fitzmas."
Mass hysteria sucks.
Maddy McCall Fri Oct-28-05 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
2. Already seeing them.
I think those people either need to get back on their meds or go back to Free Republic.
I said all along that this Fitzmas hysteria would end up making alot of people feel let down if the results were less than what they anticipated.
And they said to me, Bah Humbug!
Stevendsmith Fri Oct-28-05 10:13 AM
Original message
Struggling to remain optimistic but I fear that Rove is escaping the noose
Please no!!!
TallahasseeGrannie Fri Oct-28-05 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
6. It's like coming down on Fitzmas morning
and only getting clothes and books.
WA98296 Fri Oct-28-05 10:25 AM
Response to Original message
11. Try to have some faith here, Fitz has been working on this for two years
and I don't think with that much of his lifetime wrapped up in this that he is going to let anyone off.
Stevendsmith Fri Oct-28-05 10:29 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. The headlines say: "Rove will Not Be Indicted Today"
Yes, I realize that "Today" is the key word, but it's a tough pill to swallow!
------------------------------
AUYellowDog Fri Oct-28-05 12:27 PM
Original message
DAMN YOU FITZ!
I'm about to lose my mind waiting on this! Hurry up. Fitz is definately not Captain Punctual!
Sydnie Fri Oct-28-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
3. He is - he is in front of the Judge now reading the charges
we just have to wait til someone can get to a phone to tell about what is happening in that court room.
We need Will Pitt to be blogging from there damnit!
CatBoreal Fri Oct-28-05 12:34 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. Wait a minute.... if he has to read the charges to the judge....
...and it's taking a long time for him to do so, could that mean there are a lot of charges to be read?
What if the reason for the two hours between the release of the documents and the press conference is because it'll take him that long to read all of the counts?
Could that mean lots of charges against lots of people??
(just trying to keep hope alive)
Gregorian Fri Oct-28-05 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
4. The longer he waits, the better the chance Cheney dies.
Think of it that way.
------------------------------
Norquist Nemesis Fri Oct-28-05 12:20 PM
Original message
GJ leaving the Courtroom!
Seconds away from public knowing!
per MSNBC
dave29 Fri Oct-28-05 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. Breaking: My pants are on fire
film at noon
------------------------------
OhNoTheyDidNot Fri Oct-28-05 12:19 PM
Original message
So only Libby is going down today? I am so disappointed
If what the MSM and the bloggers are saying only Libby will get indicted today. This is so disappointing to me. I had much greater hope ... that it would involve Rove and Cheney and deep down inside I hoped Bush and that it would expose the entire hoax they played on people that caused us to invade Iraq. Now I hear it's just 1 indictment against Libby - Big deal. I feel ripped off.
sparosnare Fri Oct-28-05 12:22 PM
Response to Original message
6. Today is not the end.
It's the beginning. Please don't believe the RW spin, because that's that they'll say - that Libby is no big deal. Lots more to come......just give it time.
ClassWarrior Fri Oct-28-05 12:24 PM
Response to Original message
12. Hmmm... someone I've never seen before getting all hopeless...
Interesting...
NGU.
OhNoTheyDidNot Fri Oct-28-05 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #12
20. Yah, unless someone parks here and post 1000 posts per month you think they are secretly a republican. You are wrong. Look at when I signed up here. Just because I don't post 100 posts per day doesn't mean I'm a freeper. I want JUSTICE and justice will be that the lies leading up to this war will be exposed.
TheGoldenRule Fri Oct-28-05 01:16 PM
Response to Original message
42. Don't feel bad, I feel the same way too.
Rove weaseled out somehow which isn't really surprising since he's a disgusting slimy slug.
Oh yeah, it's a nice win for the rethugs..."just Libby", NO Rove, NO Cheney and NO Bush. Forget about the REAL CRIMINALS! Yeah, this really works for them.
And anyone who's content with "just Libby" might just be from freeperville.
Bridget Burke Fri Oct-28-05 02:55 PM
Response to Reply #42
53. Well, the Freepers are reporting that all of DU is disappointed....
Perhaps those hypothetical Freepers are leaving "disappointed" posts?
No, that would be WRONG!
------------------------------
truebrit71 Fri Oct-28-05 12:02 PM
Original message
I'm sorry but ONE indictment is not going to do it...
...simply too easy for the MSM Whores to brush it off...
Gods Damn It, I hate getting a tie for Fitzmas when I was expecting so much more....
Teaser Fri Oct-28-05 12:11 PM
Response to Original message
8. I'm sure Fitzgerald cares what you think
truebrit71 Fri Oct-28-05 12:14 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. I'm sorry, but where did I suggest that he WOULD give a flying...
...**** what I thought? Oh, that's right, I didn't....
I am simply voicing my feelings on one, single, indictment, and the picture of that fat-fuck Rove grinning from ear-to-ear....
All we could get was ONE?
Bugger!
------------------------------
Oregonindy Fri Oct-28-05 12:00 PM
Original message
so Libby got indicted....now what or more exactly so what?
he shuts up for 3 years and Herr Bush pardons him at the end of his presidency.
I got a bad feeling about this davey.......
------------------------------
OhNoTheyDidNot Fri Oct-28-05 12:50 PM
Original message
WHAT ABOUT ROVE???????????? Why isn't Rove indicted? I want that pig ****er to go to PRISON. Libby is thier scapegoat.
------------------------------
garybeck Fri Oct-28-05 02:47 PM
Original message
There is no Fitzmas...
This is making me ill. I don't like the tone of Fitzgerald's discussion. He practically said there will be no more indictments. he said the grand jury is over. He wants this to be completely done soon.
Won't even say if Plame was under cover or not. Even referred to Plame having possibly sent Wilson.
This smells like a whitewash. Someone had to take a hit and it was libby. I think this might be all we get, and the trial might be a vindication.
skids Fri Oct-28-05 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. You're living in a parallel universe.
GJ's don't stay in session when there is nothing further to invetigate, and yes, indict.
Moreover, you seem to have missed the part about the investigation continuing into another full Grand Jury.
------------------------------
Broken Acorn Fri Oct-28-05 02:44 PM
Original message
It's over: Libby is the Fall Guy / No one else will be Indicted
No Rove, No Cheney and especially no Chimpy.
I'll take it because it's finally official that the WH is corrupt, but it could have been much bigger.
tridim Fri Oct-28-05 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
4. It's NOT over, by a long shot
Where did you get that idea?
Loonman Fri Oct-28-05 02:47 PM
Response to Original message
7. Where's your crystal ball buddy?
You ****ing Kreskin?
Orrex Fri Oct-28-05 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #7
15. That's between him and Kreskin
But I likewise wonder what leads him to his conclusion...
Broken Acorn Fri Oct-28-05 02:48 PM
Response to Original message
10. I hope you all are right
But I have gotten down in the past with the Election Fraud of 2004 and the DSM or rather nothing that came of it.
The WH is a bunch of liars and crooks and they'll do anything to save their ass. Libby IS the fall guy; this was probably decided long ago.
I just don't want my fellow DU'ers to get their hopes up for any more than this.
Devil Dog Dem Fri Oct-28-05 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
14. I agree.
Rove skated. I fear in the end this will add to his reputation.
longship Fri Oct-28-05 02:54 PM
Response to Original message
19. Why don't you try paying attention instead of spewing crap?
aint_no_life_nowhere Fri Oct-28-05 02:55 PM
Response to Original message
21. He's prosecuting Libby for being a loose cannon
He's not charging him with the underlying crimes of violating the Espionage Act or the Intelligence Identities Protection Act because those types of crimes require proof of knowledge and intent. The lip service given to the fact that Libby harmed national security is irrelevant. Libby could have lied to Patrick Fitzgerald about what he ate for lunch and it would have constituted the same type of crime: lying to investigators and lying under oath. I'm disappointed.
Marr Fri Oct-28-05 03:10 PM
Response to Original message
40. I tend to agree. No offense to other DU'ers, but in my opinion, any
expectations of Cheney being indicted are just wishful thinking. Fitzgerald pointed out a couple of times in his press conference that's there's nothing illegal about one government official communicating classified information to another government official, so long as they both have the clearance to receive that information.
So Libby is the only one going down. He was the stooge who actually committed the crime. I've no doubt that Cheney told him to do it, but how are you going to prove that?
Fitzgerald seems like a real pro. While I was hoping for something a little more far-reaching, I have to say he seems like he conducted his investigation very fairly and professionally.
------------------------------
incapsulated Fri Oct-28-05 02:37 PM
Original message
"The bulk of this investigation is done"
Said Fitz, paraphrasing here, and that it's common to "keep a Grand Jury open" after an investigation for additional matters. And that whoever did the original leak isn't charged so no comment.
I don't know now, kids. Maybe this is it.
goodhue Fri Oct-28-05 02:37 PM
Response to Original message
3. I think it is it
But its something
incapsulated Fri Oct-28-05 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. It's certainly better than nothing
Although I'd be lying if I said I wasn't really hoping for more.
I guess we will have to wait a little while longer to be sure.
Hissyspit Fri Oct-28-05 02:38 PM
Response to Original message
4. Eek. Yuk. Rover OFF THE HOOK for all the evil illegal immoral **** he has done?
Can't be.
RememberWellstone Fri Oct-28-05 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
9. Letdown.
I wanted to see bodies scattered on the landscape. Total letdown.
Helderheid Fri Oct-28-05 02:45 PM
Response to Original message
11. I hate to say it but that was my impression too. Still, this is the beginning of the impeachment movement. I'm still going to have champagne.
alcibiades_mystery Fri Oct-28-05 02:57 PM
Response to Original message
19. This IS it
He's implying that any remaining open work is simply standard practice.
This case is signed and delivered.
Fini.
------------------------------
RethugAssKicker Fri Oct-28-05 03:31 PM
Original message
Where's the tie-in to the WAR!!!
Sounds to me Fitz will focus only on the leak and not tie it in to the Iraq War lies.
So Scooter goes down,.,, so what?
Our goal is to bring down Bush and his whole admin.
Who/WHat/How is going to make the TIE-IN and prosecute Bush for the lies??
-----------------------------
Fluffdaddy Fri Oct-28-05 04:10 PM
Original message
I'm not happy...... I wanted Karl Rove
What a big let down. AND DON'T spin this with more indictments coming later....BS
Mr_Spock Fri Oct-28-05 04:11 PM
Response to Original message
1. Me three!
Hey, we may get him eventually...
Vash the Stampede Fri Oct-28-05 04:13 PM
Response to Original message
6. Take your doom and gloom somewhere else then.
Keep the nonsensical whining to yourself.
Connie_Corleone Fri Oct-28-05 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. I guess it's time for me to stay away from DU for awhile.
There will be more doom and gloom threads and I for one am not going to try to sift through them all weekend.
Too bad the hide thread feature isn't available right now.
Fluffdaddy Fri Oct-28-05 04:16 PM
Response to Reply #6
9. I'm Not going anywhere. And I will speak my mind.
You have the right Not to read my posts or to leave
Good-day
Vash the Stampede Fri Oct-28-05 04:18 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. I also have the right to make comments like I did.
I find your pessimism little more than an attempt to stir up displeasure. I do not find it very welcoming.
Dawgs Fri Oct-28-05 04:35 PM
Response to Reply #21
30. Press conference or not... it's over...
Here's why...
We will not get build up like this again. Fritzmas has come and gone. Even if Rove gets indicted down the road, it will not be the same as if it happened today.
I'm disappointed because I thought Fitzgerald had a lot more to go on than what we all knew. Scooter wasn't enough for me, and if some of you can't deal with it then that's your problem... not mine.
brentspeak Fri Oct-28-05 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #32
46. It's over
Two years of investigation and only one person is indicted - and indicted on counts that have nothing to do with the original cause of the investigation.
Fitzgerald can continue, but if this investigation's history is any indication, nothing earth-shaking will result.
------------------------------
Solomon Fri Oct-28-05 04:39 PM
Original message
Libby Will Plead To One of the Counts. Case Over. Nothing Else To See
Here. He'll get a bad sentence because I happen to know the judge that has been assigned to the case. He gives the harshest sentences he can. He'll probably get at least 20 months in a country club prison.
Rove got away. That's it, folks.
longship Fri Oct-28-05 04:48 PM
Response to Original message
7. Fill your champagne glass to over half. Drink. Fill again.
Keep the glass over half-full and you'll see things the way we all should see it.
Fitz would *not* be continuing the investigation if there were no other crimes to prosecute.
I know we're all suffering from the lack of info on the case but as Simple Scotty says, "It's an on-going investigation." That means we're not going to hear a peep out of Fitz until things are complete. That fact *also* speaks for more indictments down the road.
I read between the lines that they may come fairly soon because the one important thing he did signal was that the "bulk of the investigation has finished".
Please keep an optimistic outlook. This thing is far, far from over.
alcibiades_mystery Fri Oct-28-05 08:20 PM
Response to Original message
11. He will get 22 months in Lewisberg
On one count of perjury.
I agree. It's over.
Skidmore Fri Oct-28-05 08:22 PM
Response to Original message
12. I see you live in the echo chamber.
Believe what you will.
------------------------------
babsbunny Fri Oct-28-05 05:20 PM
Original message
Well, all I got for Fitzmas was a Scooter!
I am a little sad. Is there hope there will be more??
Warren Stupidity Fri Oct-28-05 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
2. It is just the first day of Fitzmas
And on the first day of Fitzmas my true love gave to me
A scooter as a new indictee.
There will be many more days of Fitzmas to come.
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Burning Water Fri Oct-28-05 05:32 PM
Response to Reply #2
9. Personally,
I think it a Fitzzle, and am very disappointed.
Another Martha Stewart case where they can't prove a crime has been committed, or that the person indicted committed it, so they get them for lying about it and covering this non-crime up?? This is pathetic!! I expected so much more.
But what really worries me is this: if rich people like Martha STewart, and powerful people like Scooter Libby can't protect themselves from this sort of persecution, then what hope is there for you or me when it's our turn??
This just depresses me on all counts.
So I'm having a blue, blue Fitzmas.
merh Fri Oct-28-05 05:35 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Maybe you should go read that indictment again.
Leaking the identity of a covert CIA agent cannot be characterized as a "non-crime" - I think you meant to take a right when you took a left.
I bet you are having a blue Fitzmaz.
Burning Water Fri Oct-28-05 07:36 PM
Response to Reply #10
18. No need to be snide
And I refuse to read the whole thing twice. Perhaps you can point out to me where he was charged with something not having to do with his statements or grand jury testimony. Where does he have a legal charge against him for espionage, treason, or all the other good stuff we were led to expect?? Where was he charged with the underlying crime?
I admit, the indictment was heavy reading, and I may have missed it, so give me a hand here. I'd love to be find out I was wrong.
Understand, if you can, that I am not saying there were no underlying crimes, only that these indictments do not cover them. They are Martha Stewart indictments.
npincus Fri Oct-28-05 05:58 PM
Response to Original message
14. where are the other indictments?
Libby was not alone- this was a vast Right wing conspiracy.
The grand jury has expired. It doesn't look like indictments are forthcoming for the CIA classified info leakers.
Is Fitz going to convene another GJ?
GayCanuck Mon Oct-31-05 10:34 AM
Response to Original message
31. I would think
that after two years a guy as smart as Fitz would have much, much more. I am sad that he doesn't and am not holding out any hope that he will.
------------------------------
Cheney Killed Bambi Fri Oct-28-05 08:59 PM
Original message
How I Feel About Fitzmas
IS THAT ALL THERE IS?
Peggy Lee
SPOKEN:
I remember when I was a very little girl, our house caught on fire.
I'll never forget the look on my father's face as he gathered me up
in his arms and raced through the burning building out to the pavement.
I stood there shivering in my pajamas and watched the whole world go up in flames.
And when it was all over I said to myself, "Is that all there is to a fire?"
SUNG:
Is that all there is, is that all there is
If that's all there is my friends, then let's keep dancing
Let's break out the booze and have a ball
If that's all there is
[blah, blah, blah……..for several more verses from which I’ll spare you]
Carni Fri Oct-28-05 09:46 PM
Response to Original message
2. I just feel like I got sexy lingerie that are riding high for fitzmas
The gift wasn't unwelcome... it's just that the panties ride up my ass.
I am hoping I can return them
------------------------------
xray s Fri Oct-28-05 08:53 PM
Original message
I don't think Libby will ever go to trial
Forget about Cheney and Rove testifying.
Libby will take the fall, plead guilty and break his cherry at a ClubFed and then rejoin the Bush Crime Family in a nice comfortable private sector job.
Made men know how the game is played. It's a blood oath.
The only way we will ever beat these bastards is at the ballot box, folks.
obsqueesha Fri Oct-28-05 09:37 PM
Response to Original message
18. I agree.
Isn't this just all for show?
bklyncowgirl Fri Oct-28-05 10:37 PM
Response to Original message
22. I agree.
He'll get a nice golden parachute job while waiting for the trial. The trial of course will take months, maybe years and then, toward the end of his turn Bush will grant ol' Scooter a presidential problem and he can go on to make big bucks as a lobbyist or consultant.
wookie294 Fri Oct-28-05 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
23. I agree -- It's why I don't admire Fitzgerald
Fitz has the goods on Cheney's conspiracy, but he refuses to prosecute it. This is a sad day. I think Fitz is a Republican who felt prosecuting Cheney would be "harmful" to America's "best interests." So, he declined to go after Cheney -- even though it's obvious he was involved in criminal activity. And I disagree with DUers who say this isn't over. It's OVER.
Tomee450 Fri Oct-28-05 11:08 PM
Response to Original message
25. I agree
I don't think Libby will spend a day in jail nor do I believe that Rove or any other person from this administration will be indicted. This case is winding down and I doubt if anything else of importance will be revealed. I always believed that people were being too optimistic about how this case would come out.
------------------------------
KoKo01 Fri Oct-28-05 07:57 PM
Original message
Let's face it ....some of us have a "Nose Dive" with today's FITZ's/Result
We might not want to admit it...feeling that "lurking Freeps" will give us "finger"...but we expected more.
I think Fitzgerald did the BEST HE COULD with the "limited parameters of the case" so all said, he's was incredibly GREAT in his presentation to the PRESS.
But, "I'm NOT THE PRESS." And...I was disappointed. In some way, my gut told me "HE" was feeling like he might have wanted to go "a little farther."
But...this post isn't about Fitz...it's about how do we Democrats "MOVE ON?" What's the next step.
Any Creative Ideas? Many of us are working in our states on Voter Verified Paper Ballots, on finding new Candidate for the House who represent Progressive Values and we are working to keep Fundie Christians who want "Intelligent Design" OFF our SCHOOL BOARDS.
Here in my "Red State" we have made some really good progress ...given what we are faced with.
We need to focus on GRASSROOTS...the FITZ THING has now gone to the Courts...so we gotta get our "butts in gear" and back to Basic Dem Grassroots Politics...and figure that Matthews and Blitzer and Faux Network...aren't working for "Outting Truth" or anything to do with US AVERAGE AMERICANS...They are working to save their Press Butts.
We gotta get over this...and Move On. It was a "Hopeful Distraction." It's over... So we need suggetions as to HOW "WE CAN MAKE A DIFFERENCE!"
------------------------------
julialnyc Sat Oct-29-05 10:04 AM
Original message
I have a big crush on Fitz!
Don't tell my husband!
I can't remember the last person I have seen who was so mysterious in a good way.
I want him to be my employer, teacher, boyfriend,ect...... I just want to get some of what he's got! He's so cool!
julialnyc Sat Oct-29-05 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #2
8. maybe teacher or employer would be better!
but can you imagine how protective he could be in a relationship. You would never fear being screwed over again (oh they overcharged me......Fitz could you make a phone call)!
Blue Belle Sat Oct-29-05 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #8
51. I think there are guys that are protective like that...
Joe Wilson springs to mind.
morningglory Sat Oct-29-05 11:14 AM
Response to Reply #2
38. I would like to follow him around carrying his attache case, like that
lucky blond woman.
Beausoir Sun Oct-30-05 01:05 AM
Response to Reply #100
104. Oh! Yeah! Or...he could be...
tired of being in charge all of the time. Just bone weary of carrying the weight of the world on his shoulders. In that case, he'd want someone else (coughmecough) to make all the moves and solve this particular "case" for him.
Either way, Fitz honey, I got you covered.
FreedomAngel82 Sun Oct-30-05 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #104
134. Hehehehe
I wonder if he likes things kinky. I'm young and got tons of energy.
ccbombs Mon Oct-31-05 01:35 AM
Response to Reply #2
157. You gotta figure though
He's probably "thorough" in every aspect of his life, if ya catch my drift
...of J.Temperance Sat Oct-29-05 10:07 AM
Response to Original message
4. I prefer Joe Wilson myself
Wilson's very sexy and debonair and sophisticated...and I also think he looks naughty in the "Ahem" way.
So I prefer him.
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OmmmSweetOmmm Sat Oct-29-05 10:11 AM
Response to Reply #4
9. Joe Wilson does it for me too! Fitzgerald doesn't exude testosterone
the way Wilson does.
Blue Belle Sat Oct-29-05 12:12 PM
Response to Reply #4
52. I'm with you on the Joe Wilson preference...
very sexy.
Makes me want to join the CIA so I can meet men like him!
DoYouEverWonder Sat Oct-29-05 10:10 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. The good guys are always more handsome
that's why most repugs look like lily livered pigs.
[Remember, these are the people who are smarter than we are!]
Tight_rope Sat Oct-29-05 10:29 AM
Response to Original message
25. I'm a sucker for intelligence...And Fitz made me have an orgasms yesterday. I listened to every word with great depth. I even watched him over and over last night. Only thing missing are glasses. I'm attracted to intellectual men who wear glasses too.
[“an orgasms?” Yes, intelligence is attractive!]
JulieRB Sat Oct-29-05 01:42 PM
Response to Reply #50
56. Patrick Fitzgerald Estrogen Brigade
Chicks who dig the Fitz.
In the meantime, why do I think that People magazine has had a reporter trailing him for a few days now?!? We're going to know everything by next week, including whether it's boxers or briefs.
heidiho Sat Oct-29-05 12:14 PM
Response to Original message
53. OMG - Me Too
he makes my heart go pitter patter!
Good looks and brains too - Take that, Ken Starr!
MrsGrumpy Sat Oct-29-05 12:15 PM
Response to Original message
54. I don't have a crush on him, BUT, I feel the need to take care of him...
even though he is older than I...
K8-EEE Sat Oct-29-05 06:58 PM
Response to Original message
64. Yeah!!!! He's A Workaholic, HE NEEDS ME!
Gosh that Fitz needs a good backrub and stuff. He's overworked, poor thing. Let me at him! PS == don't tell my husband either. SIGH! He reminds me of the Russell Crowe character in "L.A. Confidential," can I be Kim Bassinger? In my dreams baby...
grasswire Sat Oct-29-05 11:54 PM
Response to Original message
79. my advice: Keep It To Yourself
The public objectification of someone with that degree of integrity is a bit demeaning.
cryingshame Sat Oct-29-05 11:59 PM
Response to Original message
81. You Know, It Seems Fitzgerald Has Sublimated His Life Force
Rare is the individual who has found the truth worth of his own measure.
cat_girl25 Sun Oct-30-05 12:17 AM
Response to Original message
97. I think the only flaw is his teeth.
He needs to do something about that.
cat_girl25 Sun Oct-30-05 01:03 AM
Response to Reply #109
103. After this case, Fitzgerald needs to see a dentist.
Not becoming at all. It could be why he doesn't smile that often.
mandyky Sun Oct-30-05 07:01 AM
Response to Original message
116. I'm in love with his beautiful mind
I love hime the way I loved John Kennedy and Bobby - not for their looks but for their ideas and the way they spoke and held themselves. [Uh, how about Bill Clinton’s “holding himself”?]
I told my 8 year old son as Fitz was speaking - there is a GOOD Ameican. My son asked if he was a Democrat I said no, so he asked "Independent", and I said yes. I told my son you never put your party above your country.
[BOOWAHAHAHAHAHA!]
foreverdem Sun Oct-30-05 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #126
131. He scuba dives too
I read he was recently certified. But he says he doesn't swim that well! He said he's better at sinking. Not to worry Fitz, I'd gladly give you mouth to mouth if you needed it (and even if you didn't).
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Marie26 Sun Oct-30-05 11:11 PM
Response to Reply #131
133. Ooooh, he likes animals too!
He likes cats (though he can't seem to keep them long). His first cat was kidnapped by worried friends who sent him a ransom note that told him to stay home more. He was later turned down to adopt a kitten in Washington cause he worked too much. Maybe we should have a competition for most obsessive Fitz fan. Who can find the most obscure possible fact about Fitzpatrick on Google? Go!
shenmue Sat Oct-29-05 02:31 AM
Response to Original message
7. Would this be the right time...
to talk about my huge crush on Justice Souter?
Thank you. I think I've said my piece.
------------------------------
smoogatz Sat Oct-29-05 11:07 AM
Original message
Poll question: Fitzmas: Fantastic, or Fizzle? What's your reaction to the first day of Fitzmas?
Poll result (64 votes)
Ecstatic--Fitz is a god! (2 votes, 3%)
Very happy (29 votes, 45%)
About what you expected (10 votes, 16%)
More would be better (8 votes, 13%)
Mildly disappointed (8 votes, 13%)
Depressed (1 votes, 2%)
Suicidal (0 votes, 0%)
WTF happened to the Rove indictment I asked Fitz Claus for? (4 votes, 6%)
I won't be happy with anything short of a total takedown of Bushco (2 votes, 3%)
Fitz is just another rightwing tool (0 votes, 0%)
hwmnbn Sat Oct-29-05 11:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. I was mildly disappointed...
I wanted Rove hung by his feet in the Rose Garden.
However, I was encouraged by Fitzgerald's presentation. I'm an impatient sort but have renewed confidence in his prosecutorial talents.
He has been the epitome of integrity and has the respect of the vast majority of people. He is trusted. That's a rare commodity in Washington.
Richard D Sat Oct-29-05 11:34 AM
Response to Original message
4. I'm a combination of . . .
. . . very happy and slightly depressed. I see it as a good start. The seeds of the destruction of the * evil empire are planted. * now has zero political capitol, Rove might go down, and it could go all the way to Cheney or even *. Even if the case is not about the war, it has already revealed to anyone with more than a couple functioning neurons that they were lied into it by the neo-con cabal.
I'll be thoroughly ecstatic if * et.al are frog marched to the World Court. But I'll also be happy to see them thrown from office some time in the future (if the world survives that long).
smoogatz Sat Oct-29-05 11:59 AM
Response to Original message
7. I'm in the WTF happened to the Rove indictment camp, myself
I want to see that blubber-necked ****ball do the perp walk.
------------------------------
montana500 Sun Oct-30-05 01:05 PM
Original message
This post is for the Fitz results complainers.
I love you guys but:
Stop.
You are playing into the right wing talking points.
You are derailing momentum after a historical indictment.
Stop.
wookie294 Sun Oct-30-05 01:13 PM
Response to Original message
8. I believe wishful thinkers are playing into GOP's hands
You should take your hope and turn it into OUTRAGE at Fitzgerald. His news conference was designed to get the reaction that hopeful people are giving it today. You are being manipulated by a corrupt prosecutor and the Bush administration.
------------------------------
michigander3 Sun Oct-30-05 12:39 PM
Original message
I hope I'm wrong--but what you see is what you get-with Fitz.
About a year ago, many of you were saying Kerry was going to come up with something brilliant regarding the stolen election. It didn't happen, and I doubt anything more comes out of the CIA/leak case. Libby's trial will be stalled til after the 2006 election-and then Bush hands out a pardon when he is found guilty. Bush takes some heat -but he is a very lame duck by then anyway.
Aquart Sun Oct-30-05 12:41 PM
Response to Original message
1. How is that a description of Fitzgerald?
There have been enough links to his record for you to know that's a pile of crap.
Mend Sun Oct-30-05 12:42 PM
Response to Original message
4. I am thinking that we, the grassroots, will have to save our
country ourselves...there are not going to be any white knights to the rescue. I hope we can all concentrate on 2006 elections, giving time and money to our people.
dajoki Sun Oct-30-05 12:47 PM
Response to Reply #4
10. you are correct...
i'm afraid the investigation is over. no more indictments. we have to take matters into our own hands to rid us of these corrupt bastards.
------------------------------
Rex_Goodheart Sun Oct-30-05 09:24 AM
Original message
Excuse me if I'm a bit underwhelmed...
22 months into this investigation and the FBI FINALLY gets around to interviewing Plame's neighbors to determine if her CIA status was widely known? Sorry, but that smacks of ineptitude to me... as in let's hurry and patch up this oversight.
Plame's identity was leaked. Witnesses lied about it in spades. A reporter was jailed for 85 days. And all we get is THIS?
To think I wrote all those Fitzmas carols, Gordon Lightfoot, and Elton John song parodies. Bah.
No Exit Sun Oct-30-05 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
3. Well, then, just put it all behind you and
go on to other things!
As you go on, if you happen to hear a really huge clamor in the distance, pay it no mind. That'll just be the sound of millions of Americans screaming for the resignation of the president and vice president. Just ignore it. No biggie.
Fluffdaddy Sun Oct-30-05 09:32 AM
Response to Original message
5. Thank you, I'm happy some here are seeing things the way they are.
Some folks here needs to take off their damn rose color glasses and start see things the way they are. I'm not happy with the investigation and how this went down.
Fitzmas my ass
kurth Sun Oct-30-05 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
7. Libby will be ancient history a month from now
Libby has been exposed as a schemer and a liar, and the trial will have a narrow focus on that. IF Rove is indicted, the charges will be similar. It's extremely unlikely that Fitzgerald will pursue anything else. The Watergate analogy may well turn out to be wishful thinking.
Media_Lies_Daily Sun Oct-30-05 12:36 PM
Response to Reply #7
29. Gosh...where DO all these new posters come from? Interesting. NOT.
wookie294 Sun Oct-30-05 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
9. I'm astounded at the level of denial by wishful thinkers
People who think this is only the beginning are in denial. It's over and we were screwed. Fitz's prosecution is really lame. He could have charged conspiracy, outing an undercover CIA agent and violations of the Wilson's civil rights.
Fluffdaddy Sun Oct-30-05 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #9
10. Amazing is it not that some here do not see the truth?
This story will die in a week or less. Libby will do 6 months in a country club jail
We got played again.
Tomee450 Sun Oct-30-05 12:30 PM
Response to Original message
24. I'm also underwhelmed.
Only one indictment and not likely to be any more. People were saying there could be up to twelve indictments. I suspect no one will ever be held accountable for the outing of Valerie Plame and there probably will be few changes in this administration. Furthermore, I doubt that Libby will ever spend a day in jail. He'll probably wind up with probation and Rove will continue doing what he has always done.
Media_Lies_Daily Sun Oct-30-05 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #24
30. Gee...sounds like something I heard during Watergate...
...those were rightwing talking points, too.
Tomee450 Sun Oct-30-05 06:04 PM
Response to Reply #30
47. The last time I checked
we were still living in a democratic Republic where one is allowed to have a different opinion. I am a lifelong democrat so you can just stuff your insinuation that I am a right winger. I feel this case is going nowhere. I have a right to express that opinion. When you try to silence those with whom you disagree, it is you who are behaving no differently than the right wingers who object to dissenting views.Your attitude reflects intolerance.
[Uh-oh, looks like the gloves are off. He used the “I” word!]
------------------------------
kentuck Sun Oct-30-05 09:08 AM
Original message
I don't think Fitzgerald will call for any more indictments...
I think he left it open-ended for a reason. However, in my opinion, that reason was to prevent people from saying it was a "whitewash" or that the Prosecutor was a Republican partisan. If he had announced that the Libby indictment was it, then a lot of people may have not been very happy with his announcement. So, I think this is a "cooling down" period. I do not think there will be any more indictments from Fitzgerald. Just my opinion.
proReality Sun Oct-30-05 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
2. You're not alone...
Letting the White House Walk?
Special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald indicted White House aide Lewis Libby only on narrow charges of perjury and obstruction of justice, raising concerns among some Iraq War critics and U.S. intelligence veterans that Fitzgerald missed the broader conspiracy of leaking a CIA officer's identity to punish her husband. Did Fitzgerald give the White House a walk?
For the full story of whether Fitzgerald understands the ugly intricacies of Washington, go to Consortiumnews.com at http://www.consortiumnews.com
Missy M Sun Oct-30-05 09:12 AM
Response to Original message
4. I agree with your opinion. I think Libby will be it and it will all fade away. It is all very disappointing and sad.
zanne Sun Oct-30-05 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
8. I'm surprised you aren't getting flamed for saying this.
Wow. I've never been flamed the way I was yesterday and the day before for daring to suggest that I was disappointed in the indictment handed down. I have to think that, either we're terrible pessimists, or alot of people here are engaged in wishful thinking. I know it's early yet, but Fitzgerald's language strongly suggested that he was just tidying up and that, for the most part, the investigation was over.
cryingshame Sun Oct-30-05 09:22 AM
Response to Reply #8
14. Are you disappointed when your team is leading by 20 after the 1st half?
Do you feel disappointment during half time cause they referees didn't just end the game and give it your team after the 1st half?
zanne Sun Oct-30-05 09:36 AM
Response to Reply #14
24. I'm fighting about self-censorship on DU,
which has become increasingly conservative. If I state a fact alot of you disagree with, you attempt to get me to shut up about it with denigrating remarks. A few months ago, another DUer had to PM me to give me his position on gun control, (pro-control), because he/she actually felt INTIMIDATED about posting it on the boards. When someone has to feel intimidate about posting because they're afraid their position is TOO LIBERAL FOR DU, then we have a BIG problem.
Mzztakable Sun Oct-30-05 09:22 AM
Response to Original message
15. There will be more indictments, and the lies leading to war will be exposed. I am finally confident enough to say "impeachment." Oh, it sounds so good. IMPEACHMENT IMPEACHMENT IMPEACHMENT!!!!!
Media_Lies_Daily Sun Oct-30-05 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
73. Yep...your post is right on schedule. I try very hard not to respond...
...to your posts, but sometimes your comments make me so angry that I have no choice but to respond. IMHO, your negativity is either part of your own personal make-up, or you are here for purposes other than those espoused by DU.
Just my opinion.
kentuck Sun Oct-30-05 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #73
74. You're entitled to your opinion....
I hope you will give everyone else the same coutesy? I'm sorry you are so eaasily angered... must be the conservative genes you were born with?
------------------------------
goodboy Mon Oct-31-05 03:06 AM
Original message
Flame on: Defeatist DU'ers and trolls killing our momentum in unison...
Let me first say, I'm not going to call anyone out.
DU'ers: What the **** is wrong with you? It's one thing to be cynical,it's another thing to be a "realist" but when you start spouting Repuke talking points while you whine about how "we wuz robbed" or "I'm not happy with the investigation" or "the prosecution was lame" or "It's over, we're screwed"
Bull****. Why don't you at least learn everything you can about it before you make an ass out of yourself? You're freakin' out because there's only been one indictment? You think that means it's over?
For ****'s sake people, Fitzgerald once indicted 1 person in order to put pressure on the others, and ended up with 60 ****ING INDICTMENTS!
Read the transcript from the press conference! Fitzgerald said several times that he's not done, he's going to get to the bottom of it, that he feels this is a very serious crime and he'll not rest until he can look anyone in the eye and say he did everything he could! He said that this crime PUT US ALL IN DANGER! The guy charged and prosecuted Gambino Mafiosos and Al-qaeda terrorists goddammit! You think he's going to let some traitorous domestic terrorists get away? **** NO!
If you don't want to help us by researching, writing letters, emailing stories and following leads, that's fine. But please, for the love of (insert deity), don't provide aid and comfort to our enemy by taking the same position and regurgitating the same talking points!
STAY POSITIVE, STICK TOGETHER, WORK TOGETHER! The only way the pukes can win is if they divide us! That's what they've done in every election, and that's what's happening on this board!
The Repukes are in their 'last throes' Let's drop a holy smart bomb of truth on their lying greedy criminal fat anal-cyst crusted hypocritical fascist theocratic ASSES!
Trolls: **** YOU! You know you're ****ed! That's why you're coming here to disrupt! Why don't you special ed. flunkies go to Iraq already and fight them there before they come to your house and steal your Nascar jacket and burn your confederate flag and nazi memorabilia. You're so insignificant, not even an IED would waste itself blowing you up.
I feel better now...I'm gonna drink one more beer and go to bed.
goodboy Mon Oct-31-05 04:40 AM
Response to Reply #5
21. If you really pay attention to WHAT Fitzgerald says and HOW he says it
there is no other conclusion...
They're ****ED.
And we can help. THIS IS WHAT THE DU IS ALL ABOUT!
And I don't want to turn on my TV without seeing ads telling the awful truth about Bush, and how his arrogance, mental-retardation, incompetence and illiteracy is killing the country and the world.
They're down. They're extremely vulnerable. Now's the time to kick them right in their nuts while they're down!
Finish them.
End them.
Traveling_Home Mon Oct-31-05 06:34 AM
Response to Reply #21
38. Disability,p>
Don't appreciate your analogies to persons with mental retardation. Your explicit extremist prejudice towards persons with disabilities is showing and is pretty ugly.
goodboy Mon Oct-31-05 06:41 AM
Response to Reply #38
41. Right...I'm giving up "explicit extremist prejudce towards persons
with disabilities" for Lent.
Lighten up.
Selatius Mon Oct-31-05 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #38
62. Man, what are you smoking?
You totally missed the crux of his post and instead zero in on an unfortunate choice of words. Unless you can demonstrate a clear, consistent pattern where he continuously denigrates the mentally handicapped, you are grasping at straws.
Traveling_Home Mon Oct-31-05 10:38 AM
Response to Reply #62
65. Unison
Let's see - a post aimed at getting all of us to stick together is written in such a way as to denigrate and alienate and separate out as lesser one of the strongest communities of democratic supporters - persons with disabilities and somehow pointing that out is harsh. Messenger and message stuff.
Sorry folks - can't go home with ya on this one.
choie Mon Oct-31-05 03:52 AM
Response to Reply #12
19. I can totally relate
After the 2004 election I went into a morale tailspin where I could barely stomach turning on the computer. It literally took me months before I reversed my course by turning depression outward into anger.
The thing is, we're doomed if we stop being able to recognize a victory -- even one that starts small -- for what it is. If we allow ourselves to collapse when our high expectations aren't met, we'll never be able to go the distance.
The race to get our country back isn't a sprint. It's a marathon, with all the peaks, valleys, exhaustion, elation, aches and pains this kind of struggle demands.
zanne Mon Oct-31-05 08:59 AM
Response to Original message
51. It has morphed into an issue of free speech on DU.
Since Friday, I have called a "freeper", a "Doom and Gloomer", a "pessimist" and more. Before I logged in on Friday morning, I felt that I was one of many people on DU who were disappointed that only one indictment had come down and the lack of new information that came out of two years of investigation. So I posted the way I felt. I was flamed like never before. The attack was immediate.
Some of the people who were thinking of posting on DU have been sufficiently discouraged from doing so, after seeing the insults that have been hurled at the very few posters who have dared to have an opposing opinion.
When did we become "sheeple"? There have been posts in the past that have really rankled me and I responded to them, but I never even hinted that they didn't have a right to their opinion. A few days ago, a poster who will not be named by me actually suggested to the moderators that us "Gloom and Doomers" should have to go to a separate thread to post our opinions. Is that what DU has come to? (I'm no freeper, as all of my previous posts will prove). What's up, people?
Dawgs Mon Oct-31-05 10:40 AM
Response to Original message
66. No way...
If you aren't happy with my opinion then too bad. If I feel that this is over, then I'm going to express it. I'm not going to "be positive", or change my view just to make you(or others) happy.
In saying that, I don't believe this is over. I think this is just the beginning of the end for Bush and his friends.
We have something great here at DU because, as Democrats, we listen to all opinions. I think it's wrong when I read threads like this that tell me to shut up if you're not going to help.
You shouldn't tell anyone not to express their opinion just because it doesn't fit your agenda.
nashville_brook Mon Oct-31-05 10:44 AM
Response to Original message
67. DU is really hitting hard times -- the best folks are GONE
gave up a long time ago bc apparently trolls toe the official DEM party line better than big-brained DU'ers with their thinking caps on -- i.e. critical of the party line.
long-time DU'ers who had the temerity to point this out are gone daddy gone. all that's left are newbies, pushovers and trolls.
happy 2006.
kilaana Mon Oct-31-05 02:14 PM
Response to Original message
146. Yeah!!!
Right on! That's the best pep talk since Belushi's speech in Animal house!
Fescue4u Mon Oct-31-05 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
166. Its just a discussion forum
I understand your frustration.
But don't believe that because a few trolls throw water on a discussion board, that it really affects, well anything beyond the discussion board.
This thing has a life of its own, and would even if DU didnt exist.
goodboy Tue Nov-01-05 02:13 AM
Response to Reply #166
203. DU is NOT just a discussion forum, but rather many things to many people..
We're 70000 progressive activists. We can change the world...but only if we work hard and stick together.
------------------------------
mopinko Sun Oct-30-05 09:39 PM
Original message
i feel like a fart in a windstorm
how about you? sometimes i really wish i could just get back to my regularly scheduled life. i wouldn't mind turing everything upside down to make a difference. but it doesn't feel like i am. or we are. what do you all do to keep going, and keep caring?
Spinzonner Sun Oct-30-05 09:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. Please stay upwind
------------------------------
garybeck Mon Oct-31-05 11:31 AM
Original message
I'm sorry. After Friday I'm not optimistic about the investigation anymore
Although I remain hopeful that something bigger will evolve, I am disappointed that only Libby was indicted, and not hopeful about others being indicted.
I know that there are all kinds of things you can "read into" Fitzgerald's comments. But that goes both ways. He seems like a straight shooter and I think we should take him for his word. A few key things stick out in my mind...
He clearly said that the major work in the case is complete. he said it is very routine to finish a few things after the GJ is completed. He even said he wanted people to "use caution" in reading into the fact that he's not completely done. That was for US. He was telling us there's not a huge new issue he needs to investigate, like the Niger docs, or the entire WHIG.
It seems to me, if there were more people he's considering indicting, and an expanding investigation, he wouldn't downplay it. He would want them to be shaking in their boots. He would mention several times that the investigation is continuing, so that the targets get worried. But he downplayed the continuance and said he is just about done, which sends the message to the possible targets that they're just about clear.
Another thing that bothers me is that there were all these leaks about there being "22" indictments, possibly Cheney himself and bunch of others. (by the way, where did those leaks come from? Sometimes I wonder if Rove is leaking false info he knows will end up at Huff Post and Raw story). These other indictments seem almost impossible now, since we know that "Mr. A" is probably the only other person he's considering. As many have noted, Fitzgerald has done this before where a possible future target is not named. Since there is only one Mr. A (Rove), and virutally all the other players have been named directly I think we can infer that those people are not going to be indicted.
And, since we know that the judge in Libby's trial is a lifelong Bush appointee (also served BushI and Reagan), I don't have a lot of faith in the outcome of the trial. I hate to be pessimistic but the realistic side of me sees a Bush cronie sitting at the bench. If that weren't the case, I would place some hope in the trial. Maybe the trial would force Cheney and others to testify and others would be implicated in the discovery phase of the trial, but with a Bushite sitting at the bench, I can't be overly hopeful about it.
This leaves me hanging on to one thread of hope. It all comes down to Mr. A, who it seems everyone agrees is Karl Rove. I've dropped my hopes of seeing Cheney indicted and a bunch of others. It's nice that Libby got shafted but I for one will be disappointed if Rove walks. That's my barometer for this entire investigation now - if Rove gets indicted I'll be happy. If he walks, I will be bummed.
I'm sure many of you will call me overly pessimistic and cite all these reasons why Fitgerald is still holding all his cards and is going to pounce on the whole regime at some point. I will read your replies and I hope they are right. I hope it all happens and the house of cards comes tumbling down. It just doesn't smell like that anymore to me. I am going to have to read all the stories about "22 indictments" with a spoonful of salt, not just a grain... I'm sorry.
goodboy Mon Oct-31-05 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
3. Fitz doesn't want to tip his hand at all. Gary, I love ya, but I'm gonna really gloat all day long when more indictments come down!
Pithy Cherub Mon Oct-31-05 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
8. blah blah blah
Kralizec Mon Oct-31-05 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
14. I completely and utterly disagree. This feeling has never come to my mind until people on DU fathomed the notion from who knows where (trolls, MSM propaganda?).
Since Fitz gave his news conference, I've never once had any doubts, judging by what he said and what he wrote, that this investigation would not continue fully.
melting the beehive Mon Oct-31-05 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
20. I'm afraid the whole investigation was a limited hangout and
Fitz is the uber whitewasher. Everything will be quietly swept under the rug, the big fish will escape and a pardon will eventually be issued for the fall guy. Time will tell.
michigander3 Mon Oct-31-05 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
21. Remember Kerry--"Bush won fair and square" . What I thought Fitz was ...
saying on Friday-"Libby is all we can prove" I think both these men are risk adverse and afraid of looking foolish. So we need to take them at face value when they make public statements.
emulatorloo Mon Oct-31-05 12:13 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. take at face value Fitz statements that he cannot talk about the activites of his office/grand jury as they are ongoing.
take at face value his statement that the investigation is not over.
zanne Mon Oct-31-05 12:25 PM
Response to Reply #31
37. What if someone reads the indictment thoroughly....
Like I did, and gets something different out of it? Why pounce on people just because they disagree with you? This is the Democratic Underground. We're supposed to discuss things here with other Democrats. Lately, I wonder just how democratic it is. I know we all feel very strongly about this subject, but the same people seem to get together on a thread and just attack the person or persons who sees it differently. If you want to see membership go down, that's the way to do it. Come on, people!
incapsulated Mon Oct-31-05 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
48. I agree and DU truly saddens me these days
I understand the desire to feel optimistic, to speculate on the events of Friday and come up with the most happy interpretation with the most satisfying outcome.
But those of us who speculate, and I would remind everyone that this is ALL SPECULATION, and come to a different conclusion, that do not see this investigation expanding greatly, and who would feel quite disappointed if Rove is not indicted, are just as entitled to our opinion as anyone else here.
This attempt that I see to marginalize, insult and shout down those who have an opinion that doesn't agree with the majority is a pathetic thing to see from so-called progressives. If your sensibilities are so very sensitive that logical argument, dissenting opinion or simply speculating a less than wonderful outcome puts you into a state of despair or makes you so angry that you need to insult and disparage those who disagree with you, then maybe you should get another interest aside from politics.
In case you hadn't noticed, we are on the same side. We just have a different opinion. Those of us that do see the situation more pessimistically, for the most part, would LOVE to be proven wrong. I was more than willing to make the most positive speculations about the investigation immediately after the Libby announcement. My feelings changed after the press conference and at this point I am more pessimistic but hopeful that my take is wrong, that Rove will get indicted and I will be satisfied that some real justice was done. Until then, all that is left to do is wait and see. I do not intend to spend my time here calling those who have a different view trolls and other childish insults, nor do I look to DU to fuel whatever fantasy outcome I may desire, without any dissent or feasible alternative viewpoint permitted.
incapsulated Mon Oct-31-05 01:45 PM
Response to Reply #50
Those on both sides will present an argument for their opinion, mostly based on how they interpret certain facts, events, etc. I did so earlier, but I'm not willing to get my head bashed in here.
Beyond that, it is all what you chose to believe since NOBODY KNOWS what will happen.
Except that those who believe that little else will happen are being driven off of DU by a gang mentality of insults and hostility that is usually reserved for the real enemy. I don't think anyone other than a masochist wants to "discuss" the issue with that threat hanging over their heads. Note the thread here calling us trolls and the high-fives and insults that follow. Not exactly a welcoming atmosphere for "debate".
Fine. So long. Dissent will not be tolerated, I get it.
merh Mon Oct-31-05 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
78. Who the **** cares?
Your optimism is not necessary for justice to be had.
Go get another hobby.
------------------------------
rhett o rick Mon Oct-31-05 03:15 PM
Original message
Don't gloat yet. After two years only 1 indictment. Not much when you
consider all the damage that was done. 1000 steps toward fascism and 2 steps back. At this rate we all will be goose-steping by 2008.
SharonRB Mon Oct-31-05 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
1. Please be patient.
Fitz said he isn't finished yet.
LSparkle Mon Oct-31-05 03:20 PM
Response to Reply #1
4. Amen -- I'm sick of the doom-and-gloom crowd
Please note that Scottie McC WILL NOT COMMENT since the INVESTIGATION IS ONGOING ... the fat lady has not yet sung.
NNN0LHI Mon Oct-31-05 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #4
15. I have never used the hide thread option before Friday
I have used it a hundred times since Friday. This thread will be 101 times I have used it. Right after I hit Post message.
[This is the cyber equivalent to holding your ears and humming loudly to avoid hearing something you don’t like]
Don
rhett o rick Mon Oct-31-05 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. Patience my ass, we are loosing the fight against fascism, or haven't you noticed. Bush has three more years with the backing of the repub controlled congress and judiciary. Bless Fitz, I am glad he is continuing, but it will take much more to turn the tide. Your quote: "we have not yet begun to fight". What the hell are "we" waiting for? The next disaster, maybe bird flu, or sooner or later, Bush will initiate martial law. Then what are you going to do? Blog. Sorry to take this out on you, but i think we are farther gone than most think. For example, it would take a generation to recover the money Bush has squandered. And that is if we had a favorable congress.
CatWoman Mon Oct-31-05 03:16 PM
Response to Original message
2. my head just exploded
think I'll scoop all this **** up, put it back in and go lie down.
rhett o rick Mon Oct-31-05 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
38. This thread was intended to encourage everyone to continue the pressure not to bring anyone down. Sorry if i gave the wrong impression. I think it is more important than ever to take it to them. And "never give up" mr warrior.
Media_Lies_Daily Mon Oct-31-05 11:33 PM
Response to Reply #38
39. Good grief...you pulled the pin on that grenade....
...and now you want to pretend that you didn't know what you were doing??
Right. Sure. Sell me another bridge.
leesa Tue Nov-01-05 08:48 AM
Response to Original message
42. Ah yes, GOP talking point #231.
------------------------------
Dawgs Tue Nov-01-05 08:46 AM
Original message
Four days later...
Four days later and the media is pretty much only talking about "the Flu" and the Supreme Court nomination.
Four days later and the right is attacking the left with claims of hating Italians.
Four days later and the right has spun the indictment as 'no big deal' and 'Rove is innocent'.
Four days later and the media is reporting that Bush's problems are over.
Four days later and many of you still wonder why a lot of us are so pessimistic.
H2O Man Tue Nov-01-05 08:49 AM
Response to Original message
1. Perhaps you could invest a couple hours in writing letters to the editor and to elected officials. Democracy isn't something that is going to be brought to you by prime-time tv. It's something you can choose to do, or choose not to do.
Dawgs Tue Nov-01-05 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Whatever...
Do you know me at all? Do you even know if I do the stuff you suggest?
No, but if you did you would realize that I do write to as many people as I can, and volunteer as much as I can. It doesn't change the fact that the media, and the right, is controlling the mis-information in this country. It doesn't change the fact that I'm pessimistic because of it.
Quit assuming you know me.
H2O Man Tue Nov-01-05 08:57 AM
Response to Reply #2
5. Your writing exposes who you are. I am not assuming.
WilliamPitt Tue Nov-01-05 11:56 AM
Response to Reply #5
19. Don't forget
that you're not the boss of him, either.
H2O Man Tue Nov-01-05 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. Don't forget
I didn't say I was. I made a suggestion.
WilliamPitt Tue Nov-01-05 12:15 PM
Response to Reply #23
28. No. You told him what to do.
H2O Man Tue Nov-01-05 12:19 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. As a literate person,
I am sure that you understand what "perhaps you could ...." means.
WilliamPitt Tue Nov-01-05 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #29
31. You're not the boss of me
WalrusSlayer Tue Nov-01-05 08:52 AM
Response to Original message
3. Yup, I'm right with ya...
Hearing Sean Hannity and Michael Graham just spin this into oblivion was a breathtaking experience. Say what you want, but they are good at their job.
Mid term there is still hope that Fitz will uncover something that will stick and make this regime accountable. Long term I fear that even such a miracle will not be enough to save this country.
cynatnite Tue Nov-01-05 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Maybe listening to RW nutjobs would drag a lot of people down...
It seems to me that many hear on the left take asswipes like Hannity way too seriously.
emald Tue Nov-01-05 09:45 AM
Response to Original message
10. four days later
and it's all over. I'm convinced that these SOB's are gonna destroy the US if it's the last thing they do. It must be their goal; what else can describe the bizarre and unusual actions * takes? Fitz was a joke. Justice is a joke. Honor is a joke. Our country is a joke. Our smirking resident is a joke. Ha Ha.
Beetwasher Tue Nov-01-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #10
24. I Think You Should Commit Suicide
It seems like it's your only way out.
JulieRB Tue Nov-01-05 12:20 PM
Response to Reply #10
30. Okay, now I'm pissed
I beg your pardon:
>Fitz was a joke.<
Let's talk about this, shall we? Did you watch the same press conference I did last Friday? Why don't you do a bit of research on the man's career if you think he's a "joke"? The state of Illinois certainly doesn't think he's a joke. Ask the 66 indicted so far there in one case, including the former Governor. The state of New York thinks he's just fine, too. According to the Oct. 28 issue of the Chicago Tribune, there was a car and driver available round the clock to Patrick Fitzgerald right after September 11th in case he was needed to prosecute those who thought it appropriate to attack our citizens with airliners. It seems he put the previous attackers of the World Trade Center in prison. They were going to DRIVE his ass to New York if they had to, since there were no flights available. He is known for slowly and patiently teasing out the facts, working harder than God to form his case, then putting those who desperately deserve it behind bars. He's not only bad, he's nationwide.
If you know so much about the man and his career, here's another tidbit: Richard Clarke, an antiterrorism expert and adviser to multiple Presidential administrations, said in the past 24 hours to another DU'er that Fitzgerald would find the truth. If anyone should know, he should.
I'm willing to wait. At this point, he's our only hope. Our party is fortunate enough to have the amazing Barbara Boxer and the indefatigable John Conyers, but they can't fight on alone. Let him do his job, for God's sake.
Julie
------------------------------
lostnfound Mon Oct-31-05 10:41 PM
Original message
The one big thing that's wrong with the Fitzgerald investigation is
...that "we" have nothing to do with it.
Think about it: After all of the THOUSANDS of rotten, greedy, idiotic, dangerous and wrong-headed decisions that the Bush Administration has made, the ONLY force that is making a dent in their armor is the CIA.
The CIA?? That's where our hopes for our country must rest? Oh. My. God.
Did we have any effect in causing this investigation to occur? If so, I'm not aware of it. Not DU, not we-the-people, not Democrats, and not liberals. It's the CIA that demanded, and got, this investigation. We demand all day long and sadly get nothing. Tens of millions in the streets didn't make a dent. What do we need to do differently to get through? Fifty million in the U.S.? Paper ballots? Our own TV and radio stations? Why can't we get our voices heard even when most agree? It's the dang 'heads and tails' politics, where we adopt a team and don't cross lines.
I want them OUT of office really, REALLY bad. I'm THRILLED that perhaps we will see Cheney resign, or who knows, even an impeachment in the West Wing in a couple of years. But they still seem impermeable even on issues where the vast majority of Americans side with us, like the environment and universal healthcare. We shouldn't deceive ourselves into thinking that the Fitzgerald investigation has been any kind of success for our side -- it's been a force of nature; the seeds of their own destruction planted by their own folly. It's been their failure, not our success.
What has changed? The public opinion of Bush is lower, but have the underlying disorders been cured? Does middle America think that Bush made a mistake, or do they think that corporate-conservative ideology is inherently flawed? Do they think that the problem is simply the individual character and judgment of a few members of the Bush administration (even Bush himself), or do they recognize the profit and power motives behind the war, and how strongly they shape the neocon hawk agenda?
We still have the work of creating a dramatic shift in public opinion about the underlying ideology and practices of neo-conservatives. We have to figure out how to awaken people to the wrongness of one-sided trickle-down policies, the dangers of hawkish foreign policy, and the predominance of corporate fascism. That's the roots work.
We need strategies for making inroads into the ideology of the other side -- can we make the neocons feel the pain of popular outrage of even their own base, where we have broad agreement, like on the environment and universal healthcare?
The CIA leak, egregious though it was, has been useful in creating an opening. But we need our own ways to succeed, to get through: Fifty million in the streets. Paper ballots. Our own TV and radio stations. And to not pass up opportunities for popular education and alliance building. What is happening now with the Fitzgerald investigation is exciting, but it's not exactly a victory for democracy.
Quixote1818 Mon Oct-31-05 10:51 PM
Response to Original message
2. It's scary isn't it?
It's like the country is hanging by a tiny thread (the CIA) which is preventing complete chaos. Talk about a strange organization to hang our hopes on. The Democrats and the CIA on the same team? Weird!
AX10 Mon Oct-31-05 10:54 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. It's an unusual combination.
The Dems and the CIA.
Quixote1818 Mon Oct-31-05 10:58 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Well, I guess the CIA is filled with people who believe in facts and
reason and not little voices from God. It seems the CIA has some good people watching out for the country! Thank Goodness!
MadisonProgressive Mon Oct-31-05 11:03 PM
Response to Original message
11. God Bless the men and women of the CIA!
lostnfound Tue Nov-01-05 12:34 AM
Response to Reply #12
15. "Every check & balance co-opted by the right and our only ray of light"
...seems to be a revolt by our Central Intelligence Agency and one lone principled special prosecutor."
Very well put.
I'm SOOOOO glad for the revolt and for Fitzgerald, but why is it that the weight of 10 million protesters (and a massive registration drive..and a surge in activism by liberals..etc.) counted for so little.
And the absence of check and balance, and the single thread by which we are hanging, is not cause for a sense of comfort.
------------------------------
Writer Fri Nov-04-05 12:27 PM
Original message
I'm suffering from Fitz withdrawal.
I must confess that I miss seeing pictures of him, giggling school girl snickers, and considering a parallel universe with a geeky 40-something year-old prosecutor who needs a fresh helping of lasagna.
Oh woe is my life at the moment. Pass me some scotch.
Clark2008 Fri Nov-04-05 12:33 PM
Response to Original message
2. He is a little cutie pie, isn't he?
A smart, driven, thorough cutie pie.
Savemefromdumbya Fri Nov-04-05 06:27 PM
Response to Original message
12. His cat can meet my cat anytime!
his outfits are a little old fashioned but I expect prosecutors have to dress like that? I believe he likes bungy jumping and mountain climbing!
BlueIris Sun Nov-06-05 12:21 AM
Response to Original message
24. Aw, really? I'm still kinda feeling the Fitzmas rush.
Some have lost the faith or gone batty from waiting and--I feel that, I miss him, too--but part of the joy of Fitzmas, Pt II, will be the second coming. It'll be better than the first round. In fact, we might even call it the third coming. Or the fourth. He's that good.
And if you were me on the weekend after Fitzmas, Pt I, it's more like the fifteenth. I really enjoyed my Fitzmas.
----------------------------
Foreverdem (679 posts) Thu Jan-05-06 01:30 PM
Original message
For Fitz Fans The February issue of Vanity Fair has a pretty lengthy article on him. Just picked it up and haven't had a chance to read it yet. Just an FYI for Fitz fans.
cat_girl25 (1000+ posts) Thu Jan-05-06 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
3. I just got word about that.
Are there any pictures besides the lengthy article?
AchtungToddler (1000+ posts) Thu Jan-05-06 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Yes, including some smoking hot nudes
with references to his "legal briefs barely covering the...".
-----------------------------
buff2 (1000+ posts) Thu Jan-19-06 03:03 PM
Original message
What has happened to Fitzmas? The silence is deafening.
Fitzmas—Nothing
Abramoff—Nothing
Wire Tapping—Nothing
All Bu$h crimes—Nothing
The White House,Senate,Congress--Majority rightwing
MSNBC---Rightwing Whores
Fox-- Rightwing Whores
CNN-- HUGE rightwing Whores (with the hiring of Beck,Bennett and Watts.)
Scotus--rightwing about to turn even righter.
Dictatorship-- Just about a DONE DEAL!
We are so Phucked.
havocmom (1000+ posts) Thu Jan-19-06 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #9
19. And after that, St. Patrick Fitz!
Honestly, how many 'what about Fitzmas?' threads a day have we had lately?
Maybe Skinner could tack a banner:
Grand Jury proceedings are SECRET. Fitzgerald is known for following rules. He is also involved in many investigations. Stop getting twisted knickers about the silence. Unlike the Ken Starr investigations, which leaked like a sieve, Fitz's investigations are tight. And he has one hell of a track record. Calm down and be of good cheer. We will have Fitzmas all this long year!
Meanwhile, dotcosm, can I pour you a glass of red win, in anticipation of Fitzentine's Day? Am thinking Feb 14 is a big day for law enforcement in Chicago. Here's to Fitz! May he take as long as he needs to and nail what hides need it to the wall!
------------------------------
debbierlus (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-27-06 07:05 PM
Original message
Poll question: How much do you LOVE Patrick Fitzgerald?
We ALL love the Irish Alligator. Here on Fitzmas eve, it is time to determine just who loves him the most! How much do you REALLY love Fitz?
Poll result (48 votes)
I am a female, and I would bear his children and name them Patrick, Patrina, Patrica! (26 votes, 54%)
I am male, and I would bear his children, if they developed the technology! (5 votes, 10%)
I love him so much I would sleep with Bush, himself, if it would help get info for Pat's case! (2 votes, 4%)
I love him so much I would sleep with CHENEY, if it would help get info for Pat's case! (1 votes, 2%)
I love Pat, but not THAT much! (5 votes, 10%)
Other....Do tell, below! (9 votes, 19%)
Beelzebud (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-27-06 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
2. I won't love him until I see results.
He brought down the Illinois republicans, but I withold my judgment of him until I see the results of his Bush investigation.
Undeterred (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-27-06 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
4. I would shower with him to conserve water
and ride with him to conserve fuel.
LiberalEsto (1000+ posts) Thu Apr-27-06 07:08 PM
Response to Original message
5. I would adopt 20 cats
and name all of them Fitzgerald, as in Fitzgerald 1, Fitzgerald 2, Fitzgerald 3, etc.
Then I would toss them a few catnip mice named Karl, Dick and George.
Alamom (800 posts) Fri Apr-28-06 11:30 AM
Response to Reply #21
25. Julie, I have to admit...
my (natural, bio-identical replacement) Estrogen soars when I see him.
I think it's seeing honesty and integrity in the flesh, working for truth and justice.
He's my "Superman".
warrens (1000+ posts) Fri Apr-28-06 04:12 PM
Response to Original message
31. I will love him a lot more...
If he can get a certain group of fellas put behind bars. Or better, on death row.
-----------------------------
rudy23 (173 posts) Fri Apr-28-06 12:58 PM
Original message
What will you do if Fitzgerald decides not to indict?
I want to see Rove nailed as bad as anyone on here, but what will you do if Fitz thinks against better judgement to indict?
Will you still sing the praises of his thoroughness, his meticulous nature, or his allegiance to truth?
I guess I'm setting myself up, just in case. I've seen so many people wriggle out of trouble in the last 6 years, nothing would surprise me.
I just hope everybody takes a reality check, and realizes in all the hoopla, that Patrick Fitzgerald doesn't work for the Democratic Party, and his goal is not to dismantle the neocon machine. I'm afraid of what will happen if Fitzgerald takes the overly cautious route, and decides it's unwise to proceed with indictments.
cat_girl25 (1000+ posts) Fri Apr-28-06 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
3. There's not much we can do except to be sad about it.
Simskl (332 posts) Fri Apr-28-06 01:07 PM
Response to Original message
8. It would wreck my day but I find no reason to not trust Fitzgerald, he seems to be pretty thorough and as a rarity in Washington, honest as well.
I'd be upset because I really want to see that prick Rove brought down hard but I'm sure there's some more mud on him somewhere, just gotta keep digging for it.
Me. (1000+ posts) Fri Apr-28-06 01:10 PM
Response to Original message
9. "if Fitz thinks against better judgement to indict"
And he would think against better judgement because....?
*shadow government*
Radio_Guy (875 posts) Fri Apr-28-06 02:58 PM
Response to Original message
20. Then we investigate Fitz
There is more than enough evidence to indict Rove. Anyone who has been paying attention can see that.
------------------------------
stop the bleeding (1000+ posts) Wed May-17-06 09:11 AM
Original message
We need people to Stakeout Fitz / The Courthouse
We need people to stakeout Fitz/courthouse today, Thursday and Friday. It would be cool if someone could give us live unbiased reports of what is happening in and around the courthouse in these upcoming days.
Does this sound like a good idea or is it lame?
Any takers?
-----------------------------
pnorman (1000+ posts) Wed May-17-06 09:20 PM
Original message
Update on the Rove Indictment Story
By Marc Ash,
Wed May 17th, 2006 at 12:52:48 PM EDT :: Fitzgerald Investigation
For the past few days, we have endured non-stop attacks on our credibility, and we have fought hard to defend our reputation. In addition, we have worked around the clock to provide additional information to our readership. People want to know more about this, and our job is to keep them informed. We take that responsibility seriously.
Here's what we now know: I spoke personally yesterday with both Rove's spokesman Mark Corallo and Rove's attorney Robert Luskin. Both men categorically denied all key points of our recent reporting on this issue. Both said, "Rove is not a target," "Rove did not inform the White House late last week that he would be indicted," and "Rove has not been indicted." Further, both Corallo and Luskin denied Leopold's account of events at the offices of Patton Boggs, the law firm that represents Karl Rove. They specifically stated again that no such meeting ever occurred, that Fitzgerald was not there, that Rove was not there, and that a major meeting did not take place. Both men were unequivocal on that point.
We can now report, however, that we have additional, independent sources that refute those denials by Corallo and Luskin. While we had only our own sources to work with in the beginning, additional sources have now come forward and offered corroboration to us.
We have been contacted by at least three reporters from mainstream media - network level organizations - who shared with us off-the-record confirmation and moral support. When we asked why they were not going public with this information, in each case they expressed frustration with superiors who would not allow it.
We also learned the following: The events at the office building that houses the law firm of Patton Boggs were not in fact a very well-guarded secret. Despite denials by Corallo and Luskin, there was intense activity at the office building. In fact, the building was staked out by at least two major network news crews. Further, although Corallo and Luskin are not prepared to talk about what happened in the offices of Patton Boggs, others emerging from the building were, both on background and off-the-record. There were a lot of talkers, and they confirmed our accounts. We do have more information, but want additional confirmation before going public with it.
THE 24 HOUR THING
We reported that Patrick Fitzgerald had, "instructed one of the attorneys to tell Rove that he has 24 business hours to get his affairs in order...." That does not mean that at the end of that 24-hour period, Fitzgerald is obliged to hold a press conference and make an announcement. It just means that he has given Rove a 24-hour formal notification. Fitzgerald is not obliged to make an announcement at any point; he does so at his own discretion, and not if it compromises his case. So we're all stuck waiting here. Grab some coffee.
------------------------------
Jigarotta (1000+ posts) Fri May-26-06 04:19 PM
Original message
It's been two weeks since Rove was indicted.
What's the story?
Has anyone from TO provided any more information?
Are we just going to let this die like Corporate Media lets things die?
Where is Leopold's revelation of his sources, as promised? Can he at least say what the deadline date for that is?
-----------------------------
AFTER
matcom (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:01 AM
Original message
NBC: KARL ROVE WILL NOT BE INDICTED
just announced
Swamp Rat (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:02 AM
Response to Original message
1. NO **CKING WAY!!!
Skidmore (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:03 AM
Response to Original message
3. On Washington Journal too--first half hour will take calls on this
topic. Vent your outrage!
yibbehobba (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:12 AM
Response to Reply #6
18. He isn't cooperating.
He isn't being charged. It's over.
napi21 (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:05 AM
Response to Original message
8. Yea, I heard this on KGO radio. What a way to wake up!
I guess the whole day is going to be disgusting now!
malaise (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:09 AM
Response to Original message
13. According to his lawyer
Damn I can't take much more of this.
KharmaTrain (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:19 AM
Response to Original message
26. But...But...But...
Where's the indictment? I can hear the large DU thud already happening...all the build-up for this Fitzmas gift...and could be that Santa is about to drop a coal instead. I hoped there'd be an indictment...but I also believe Fitz has done his job with the law and justice first and partisanship second...and I'm seeing a bigger picture here.
However, I also expect this place should turn into a morgue...and those who had the highest hopes and wishes will be the most upset...looking for someone to blame...be it that the "fix was in" or Fitz being a Repugnican or a dozen conspiracy theories. Also, let the Truth Out flames reach a boil again. All a lot of angst that was needless in the first place.
From watching Fitzgerald work here in Illinois, he "squeezes up"...and his target here hasn't been Rove. Remember, his deal is to find the guy who threw the sand in the umpire's eyes. While Rove probably tried, he wasn't the one Fitz was refering to.
This case isn't over...it's just starting. There's been an indictment and a trial and Libby still stands a very good chance of being convicted here.
Today's prescription...a large chill pill.
Minnesota Libra (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:36 AM
Response to Original message
32. Well Duh, is there anyone who didn't already know this? The..........
.....neocons/fundies won't allow there own to be indicted. Why do you all think the grand jury's finding were Sealed v Sealed??
Junkdrawer (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:40 AM
Response to Original message
35. Above . The . Law
This only USED to be a nation of laws.
Hubert Flottz (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:45 AM
Response to Original message
37. Seedy Gonzales to the rescue...
I got a bad feeling the minute I heard Gonzo was on Fitz's ass about a month ago. They rig everything. They are the Mega-Mob.
East Liberty Denizen (3 posts) Tue Jun-13-06 08:05 AM
Response to Original message
43. Did they get to Fitz?
In DC, Rove would have easily been convicted following indictment, and we would be a lot closer to taking them down.
Although perhaps there is something more to the story.
Meisje (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 08:23 AM
Response to Original message
50. but but but some of you knobs stood with Liepold!
dogday (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 08:27 AM
Response to Reply #50
53. Shame on you
is that all you can do is call names and berate people?
alyce douglas (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 08:31 AM
Response to Original message
55. This just sucks
there is so much underhandness going on, how can this sleaze get away with it? Libby can't be the only one going down.
this just sucks, that means that this sucker will be spreading his lies during the mid term elections,
Rachel Maddow talking about this now. Michael Isakoff Newsweek reporter just finished talking about Rove.
leveymg (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 08:56 AM
Response to Original message
65. The ground rushes up.
I saw the news that Rove won't be indicted first thing this morning, and my initial feeling was like that of a passenger flying on board a plane that one knows hasn't received scheduled maintenance. You're shocked, but not very surprised, when the ground finally rushes up at you.
Like the rest of this saga, this chapter has been full of uncertainty and plot twists. The fact (finally we can speak of facts) that Rove wasn't indicted could either mean a tragic ending -- there won't be any more prosecutions (and BushCo gets away with it) -- or, a dramatic end -- Fitz is moving up the food chain, and Rove has sung -- or, a surprise end (a deal has been struck whereby Cheney and then Bush leave office early, or otherwise give up power, but don't go to jail). I still expect some sort of surprise ending, but that's just my take on it.
It seems some of us have learnt a bit about reality (such as about sealed cases), and one hopes a little humility. I also wish that some others would try a little compassion for those among us who have made mistakes.
- Mark
------------------------------
originalpckelly (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:03 AM
Original message
We deserve an apology. You abused our trust Mr. Leopold...
This episode has reduced the credibility of the entire internet left. I think it is about time you write one last story, what really happened with Karl Rove. Did you really have sources? If so, who were they? We might just accept an apology, but I don't know if we will. It really isn't up to myself alone, I know I could forgive you, and hopefully other people will as well. I do know one thing, you will not be trusted again.
This whole episode is also our responsibility as a community. We have been too quick to assume rumors are correct and the truth isn't. We have been so devoted to our ideology, the facts have just become temporary stumbling blocks. While the right has its "intelligent design," we have our "Rove story," "did they really kill Zarqawi," and "was 9/11 an inside job." I could go on listing the conspiracy theories on our side, but there are too many. I have always believed the wonder of our side, is that we respect the truth, but in the past few weeks I have been sorely disappointed. We should not treat rumors with more credibility than professional news outlets. They may have a bias, but the there is only so much one can distort without crossing the "Pravda-line."
I think the next few days should be a period of reflection for us all. Maybe there should be some form of peer review created for these blogs, that way if they are original investigations they can have some sort of credibility. A type of "official approval" logo. That way we can be certain future internet investigative reporting is accurate.
DoYouEverWonder (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:04 AM
Response to Original message
1. Oh please
get over it.
Printer Friendly | Permalink | Reply | Top
texasleo (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. you get over it
------------------------------
Philosoraptor (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:17 AM
Original message
Cspan caller: "Ha ha, Bill Clinton Impeached, Karl Rove is Free"!
The republicans are full of glee.
partylessinOhio (553 posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:31 AM
Response to Original message
6. This is no surprise. We all could see this coming. We no longer
have any checks and balances, we have no democracy.
If I had the means I would have been out of this country long ago.
Be prepared for big losses in the fall elections with more Repugs being elected. It will be even more difficult to live here under Blackwell.
We have been voodoo-ed completely.
zidzi (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:05 AM
Response to Reply #9
17. I say we BURN
their diebold machines instead!
-----------------------------
Ilsa (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:16 AM
Original message
My second thought, upon hearing the news this morning,
was of Joe Wilson and Valerie Plame and how totally frustrated they must be.
In light of that, this is my "shout-out" to them for being such brave people and trying to do the right thing for the nation.
--------------------------
sabra (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:39 AM
Original message
Dean re: Rove "it's not very good news for America."
http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=D3...
"He doesn't belong in the White House. If the president valued America more than he valued his connection to Karl Rove, Karl Rove would have been fired a long time ago," said Dean, the Democratic Party chairman, speaking Tuesday on NBC's "Today" show. "So I think this is probably good news for the White House, but it's not very good news for America."
madokie (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:41 AM
Response to Original message
1. all I know is if this is true I am one pissed off mad assed okie
lonestarnot (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. I am tooooooo!
Don't have a clue how this is happening.
------------------------------
Nimrod2005 (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:50 AM
Original message
To all Democrats, a list of recent Bush (and GOP) wins:
I am calling them wins because it is an election year, there will be winners and losers in November...
1) Rove walks
2) San Diego seat won
3) Al Zarqawi terminated
4) DeLay is out of the way
5) Iraq government is formed
6) Bush makes visit to now more peaceful/stable Iraq (this will be the headline)
As of now, looks like a GOP immaculate plan and flawless execution are in play for the Rove team.
We really REALLy have alot of work to do between now and November.
Has Harry Reid been met with Howard Dean lately?
------------------------------
antifaschits (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 09:46 AM
Original message
A time to worry,
So, we have Rove being cleared. We have Rove in charge of political planning again (even without the title). We have Boy George visiting the troops so long as 70,000 of them are guarding the streets. We have the newsies citing Newt that Bush is back.
why should we worry?
Not because of Bush's actions or the Fitz decision. No, it is something far worse and more dangerous.
It is the lack of conviction, strength and reality in our democratic leadership. If you think that the Iraqi government is shaky and fragile, it is far stronger than the Democratic leadership. My worry is that they will look at these Rovian moves and forget about all the planning, all the decisions, and all the progress they were starting to make.
What worries me is not how the country will react to the GOP ploys, but how our leaders in Congress react.
I thought it was against the rules to post DU material ..??
Was that rule changed and I missed it ..??
Besides, we already know how they think - they live in LA-LA land - and don't even know America is not a "democracy".
Good Recovery. "Ahh, I meant to do that!"
Heh.
This has to hurt after the MSM pushed the rumor about indictments. They were sure it was in the bag.
ROFLMAO
Great way to kick the second part of the morning into high gear!
Maybe if you are real nice, a Republican Capitalist Robber Baron will give you a job.
Fitz has the goods on Cheney's conspiracy, but he refuses to prosecute it.
Eat bile, dumb@$$. I watched Ken Starr push Bubba for sex and miss selling rocket info the ChiComs in exchange for campaign dollars. Imagine how I feel!
Reading this mess, I begin to smile. It looks like the Democrats are getting a taste of the grief and astonishment I felt during the entire Clinton mis-ministration. Sweet!
Go to this link and WEEP!!
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1634325/posts
Moonbats gettin' nuttin' for Fitzmas
DU and KOS are mad
Moonbats getting nuttin' for Fitzmas
'Cause Truthout's been nothing but bad.
I wonder if it ever glimmers in the back of their minds that they may be wrong, that maybe they are living in a nightmare of their own construction - that they lost an election, and instead of looking at really why people don't vote for them, they have to tilt at monsterous windmills, making decent people into ghouls, all because they can't deal with the fact that enough people think their message is crap.
Sometimes, reality checks are too painful if you are too invested in the fantasy, I guess...
Demeter (1000+ posts) Tue Jun-13-06 07:01 AM
Response to Original message
6. My Heart Is Broken, My Spirit Crushed, My Faith in America Destroyed
Edited on Tue Jun-13-06 07:02 AM by Demeter
On the other hand, I am sure that there are numerous other criminal enterprises that Kkkarl has participated in, so we just have to keep digging. Perhaps Fitz is doing just that--he has the license to do so.
Or am I approaching the definition of insanity, here?
Their child-like emotion is a riot... and their political acumen flies in the face of reality.
They had bowl full of hope. Heaping portions of delicious hope in a beautiful ornate bowl. They savored the wonderful vision of hope with a gleaming eye.
Then the gods pissed in the bowl and flushed it. Sucks to be them.
As disgusted as I am with Bush (illegals) and the Senate (damn near everything), I read this and it makes me feel better. We're still better off than they are. 'course we're not looney, so we'll always have sanity & common sense, certainly puts us one up on them.
They seem to be very well acquainted with all the tiny details of the investigation,but not one of them asks if Valerie Plame was a covert agent at the time of her name being mentioned, and thus no crime having been committed.
In fact nobody mentions it. Strange.
Most salient and succinct. A 'bottom line' comment if ever I heard one.
Hey democrats: No one likes you...they really, really don't like you.
People like Victoria Toensing have been saying it all along...and she had a hand in drafting the Intelligence Identities Protection Act of 1982 (50 USC 421-426) - the law that was said to have been violated and upon which the dems have hung their hat; and apparently have hung themselves.
"Hey democrats: No one likes you...they really, really don't like you."
Careful, I don't think there are any more therapists available for the influx a comment like this can make. They are still tied up with PEST issues.
Yep!
Hey Dims! Over half the country''s just really not that into you...
I'm happy to be of service! And I think their kooks are kookier than our kooks. :-)
Yeah, ain't it? DU: the gift that keeps on giving!
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