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To: Swordmaker
BETS are not required.

Oh I see, when you laid down the challenge that I'd win $25,000 for creating a Mac Virus...doesn't constitute a bet. However, my challenge to prove that a virus can be done on Mac OS X is said to be unneccessary.

Also you DID SAY "70,000 viruses for Windows vs. Zero for the Mac". If that's not saying that the virus is not possible then I don't know what is. Or maybe when you said all Mac virus challenges have gone without a winner doesn't mean Mac viruses aren't possible either. Or when you claim you don't need virus protection nor a firewall with a Mac means that viruses are possible and that you're just too ignorant to run one.

And what I'm saying is not only is a Mac virus possible it actually does exist. I will provide a link as soon as you take the challenge. Of course you won't take it because you know you're just spewing tripe hoping your uninformed Mac lovers will believe what you say. By not accepting my challenge you're admitting you know that a virus does exist and that you're just trolling. The challenge requires next to no effort on your part and I'll do all the leg work. It's not like I'm asking you to write a virus that will get you sued and put in jail (as you asked me to do). I'm just asking you to not post on Freerepublic for 1 month once I provide you evidence of a Max OS X virus.

83 posted on 08/24/2005 8:58:11 AM PDT by for-q-clinton (If at first you don't succeed keep on sucking until you do succeed)
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To: for-q-clinton
And what I'm saying is not only is a Mac virus possible it actually does exist. I will provide a link as soon as you take the challenge.

Oh man, this is rich. For-q has located A Mac virus and it's so dangerous that he can PROVIDE A LINK to it! Do you even realize how stupid that sounds? And what kind of teen-aged challenge is it to ask someone to not post on FR? Is Swordmaker too evenhanded and thorough for your taste? (He is for mine.) So take the Smug and Condescending Challenge. Two months and a ball cap. That's all. You can do this. I know you can.
88 posted on 08/24/2005 9:11:23 AM PDT by Leonard210
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To: for-q-clinton
Oh I see, when you laid down the challenge that I'd win $25,000 for creating a Mac Virus...doesn't constitute a bet. However, my challenge to prove that a virus can be done on Mac OS X is said to be unneccessary.

You know, For-q, you really are an idiot. I did not say that YOU would win $25,000 for creating a Mac Virus... and that, incidentally is not a "bet" but a challenge offered by one particular company... I said that a prize had been offered and cancelled for legal reasons. I also pointed out that previous such challenges offered when there were no legal ramifications went unclaimed.

Nor have I said that your challenge to "prove that a virus can be done on Mac OSX" is unnecessary. Go ahead and try... others have and fallen short.

Also you DID SAY "70,000 viruses for Windows vs. Zero for the Mac". If that's not saying that the virus is not possible then I don't know what is.

Yes, I did say that AND provided sources... something you have not. In fact, a credible and knowledgable source that I quoted stated that as of August 10, 2005, "Windows, at last count, had 97,467 viruses vs. 0 for Apple's Mac OS X." You apparently have a reading problem since you seem to think that my statement says that a Mac OSX virus is not possible... let me tell you what that says... It does not say that a Mac OSX virus is impossible; it says that "Windows, at last count, had 97,467 viruses vs. 0 for Apple's Mac OS X."

Or when you claim you don't need virus protection nor a firewall with a Mac means that viruses are possible and that you're just too ignorant to run one.

You call us ignorant. The only one around here demonstrating ignorance is you, For-Q; you are completely ignorant of OSX and Macintoshes. When a virus for Mac OSX is found in the wild, then we will reconsider paying money to protect us from something that as of this moment DOES NOT EXIST.

When you say that a Mac virus exists... you are either refering to viruses that could attack the old Mac OS or you are referring to a couple of proofs of concepts vulnerabilities such as the "Opener Worm" also referred to as "Renepo"... which is merely a script that requires the user to install and run.

Opener (AKA Renepo-A) is a shell script that can't be installed without Admin privileges (I.E. the user must install it, providing an administrator user name and password - Swordmaker). It isn't spreading. A thread on Macintouch reports an isolated example of a Mac user finding Opener on their system, which prompted a brainstorming session about the nature of the malware on the forum. The interest focused on the hacker tool in the Mac community is largely generated because of the malware's rarity value.

From the Opener Rootkit script itself:

You need an admin level user name and password or physical access (boot from a CD or firewire, ignore permissions on the internal drive) to install this ...
Or the MP3Concept Trojan horse touted by Intego...

This Trojan horse, MP3Concept (MP3Virus.Gen), exploits a weakness in Mac OS X where applications can appear to be other types of files. The Trojan horse's code is encapsulated in the ID3 tag of an MP3 (digital music) file. This code is in reality a hidden application that can run on any Macintosh computer running Mac OS X. Mac OS X displays the icon of the MP3 file, with an .mp3 extension, rather than showing the file as an application, leading users to believe that they can double-click the file to listen to it. But double clicking the file launches the hidden code, which can damage or delete files on computers running Mac OS X, then iTunes to play the music contained in the file, to make users think that it is really an MP3 file . While the first versions of this Trojan horse that Intego has isolated are benign, this technique opens the door to more serious risks.

However, this proof-of-concept trojan was also handled quickly and STILL required an install admin password. Intego spread FUD about this potential exploit, offering to sell their Mac anti-virus software... which again, only strips out Windows and pre-OSX Mac viruses. Within a week, it no longer worked.

This proof-of-concept seems to be what Intego found, and then proceeded to craft an accurate, but very alarmist press release around. While the concept definitely seems to be sound, and is something that OS X users should keep in mind when accepting files from untrusted sources, there does not appear to actually be a malicious attack of any sort currently propagating across the 'net aimed at OS X users, now matter how much FUD Intego puts into their Security Alert.

Neither one of these is a virus. They do not meet the requirement of a self-propagating, self-replicating malicious program capable of independently infecting other computers. At best they are trojans.

Both of these and other OSX vulnerabilities with potential exploits have been posted on FreeRepublic and discussed. I either posted the original article or pinged the Mac Ping list members.

Your proposal is entirely unreasonable... and borders on abuse of the system.

130 posted on 08/24/2005 12:38:18 PM PDT by Swordmaker (Beware of Geeks bearing GIFs.)
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