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To: Carry_Okie
When you can't win on facts, you try personal attack. OK.

That wasn't meant as a personal attack. I was in fact just stating it as I see it.


Oh, the old Marbury v. Madison canard. There's a reason the DOJ dropped the Emerson case. Let's see if you can figure out what it was.

I know exactly what that case was. It was the case that established judicial review as it is today which effectively elevated the Court above the other 2 branches of government. And I thought that when the case was dismissed, it was then successfully appealed by the DOJ and Emerson was found guilty in Federal court. What strikes me as the salient issue is that the final ruling was that the 2nd Amendment is NOT an individual right.


That does not follow. Ahnold is splitting the Republican vote.

But it does follow. Try and follow this: Arnold is splitting the Republican vote, effectively keeping the right-wing from ramming a conservative candidate through who could not otherwise win in a regular general election.
Arnold is saving the Republicans from themselves.

Arnold's widespread support is coming instead from all factions of the political and non-political spectrum. This is what makes him the best choice, because he is the only candidate that the vast majority of Californians will accept as consensus, thus providing him the neccessesary mandate he will need to govern in an otherwise politically divisive special election.


That may have been true fifteen years ago, but since the development of mass media among the people it has become no longer true. You still haven't been able to show why we need Ahnold when conservative ballot propositions have been so successful. What you don't understand is that the Internet and the fax machine changed everything. What plays well in the media no longer determines elections. That's why your assertions about Davis' media buys against Riordan don't hold water.

I would like to believe that is true, but I just don't see it reflected yet in the perceptions of average Californians. Perhaps it is because I live in the Bay Area, but the typical response from even the most non-political persons is "*gasp* you're a.. a... r-r-republican...??"

Most people here seem to still buy into The Simpsons-style mass media propaganda that Republicans are heartless, stingy, bible-thumpers who want to destroy the environment.

In the pop-culture perception wars Arnold can take us forward a long, long, way.

603 posted on 08/13/2003 11:41:02 AM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
I know exactly what that case was. It was the case that established judicial review as it is today which effectively elevated the Court above the other 2 branches of government. And I thought that when the case was dismissed, it was then successfully appealed by the DOJ and Emerson was found guilty in Federal court. What strikes me as the salient issue is that the final ruling was that the 2nd Amendment is NOT an individual right.

I should clarify this, as I rushed it out...

"It was the case that established judicial review as it is today which effectively elevated the Court above the other 2 branches of government"
referred to Marbury v. Madison.

"And I thought that when the case was dismissed, it was then successfully appealed by the DOJ and Emerson was found guilty in Federal court. What strikes me as the salient issue is that the final ruling was that the 2nd Amendment is NOT an individual right"
referred to the Emerson case.

605 posted on 08/13/2003 11:46:55 AM PDT by DrMartinVonNostrand
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
I know exactly what that case was. It was the case that established judicial review as it is today which effectively elevated the Court above the other 2 branches of government. And I thought that when the case was dismissed, it was then successfully appealed by the DOJ and Emerson was found guilty in Federal court. What strikes me as the salient issue is that the final ruling was that the 2nd Amendment is NOT an individual right.

This is wrong on so many counts that I'm not going to bother with it. In the Emerson case, the Appellate Court (I believe that it was the 5th Circuit) found that the Second Amendment was an individual right. You are mixing up the Emerson case with the recent Ninth Circuit ruling.

Try and follow this: Arnold is splitting the Republican vote, effectively keeping the right-wing from ramming a conservative candidate through who could not otherwise win in a regular general election. Arnold is saving the Republicans from themselves.

Here is another post of yours:

I agree McClintock as a single candidate would indeed win the election with a simple plurality.

How am I supposed to "follow" that? More important, why should I try?

So how is Ahnold saving us from anything? If McClintock would have won by a plurality without him, as you asserted, how is he saving us from anything by splitting the vote?

Best to tell your handlers that you are out of your depth here.

Arnold's widespread support is coming instead from all factions of the political and non-political spectrum.

Each of which has loyalties about an inch deep. They don't show at the polls and they will desert him in a heartbeat if the Slave Party fearmongers are successful (which they usually are with anybody but a saint, which Ahnold isn't).

Most people here seem to still buy into The Simpsons-style mass media propaganda that Republicans are heartless, stingy, bible-thumpers who want to destroy the environment.

Some Republican Bible thumpers are defining the cutting edge of environmental policy, like me.

609 posted on 08/13/2003 11:55:33 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (And the Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.)
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To: DrMartinVonNostrand
"But it does follow. Try and follow this: Arnold is splitting the Republican vote, effectively keeping the right-wing from ramming a conservative candidate through who
could not otherwise win in a regular general election.
Arnold is saving the Republicans from themselves. "

We've followed it. We've tried several different ways to explain why you're wrong.

Your current idea isn't new, it's OLD...and it's been the path followed by the established GOA RINOs, like Riordan, for a great many decades. I'll need a Californian who knows what he's talking about to confirm this...but I believe it's been tried as far back as the time Reagan left the CA governorship.

So...yes...it is *Arnold* who is splitting the ticket, and Riordan RINOs working to ensure that no conservative has the opportunity to be on the ballot, and then will sabotage any conservative Republican who does make it in the election.

611 posted on 08/13/2003 11:58:55 AM PDT by Maelstrom (To prevent misinterpretation or abuse of the Constitution:The Bill of Rights limits government power)
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