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Evolution Disclaimer Supported
The Advocate (Baton Rouge) ^
| 12/11/02
| WILL SENTELL
Posted on 12/11/2002 6:28:08 AM PST by A2J
By WILL SENTELL
wsentell@theadvocate.com
Capitol news bureau
High school biology textbooks would include a disclaimer that evolution is only a theory under a change approved Tuesday by a committee of the state's top school board.
If the disclaimer wins final approval, it would apparently make Louisiana just the second state in the nation with such a provision. The other is Alabama, which is the model for the disclaimer backers want in Louisiana.
Alabama approved its policy six or seven years ago after extensive controversy that included questions over the religious overtones of the issue.
The change approved Tuesday requires Louisiana education officials to check on details for getting publishers to add the disclaimer to biology textbooks.
It won approval in the board's Student and School Standards/ Instruction Committee after a sometimes contentious session.
"I don't believe I evolved from some primate," said Jim Stafford, a board member from Monroe. Stafford said evolution should be offered as a theory, not fact.
Whether the proposal will win approval by the full state Board of Elementary and Secondary Education on Thursday is unclear.
Paul Pastorek of New Orleans, president of the board, said he will oppose the addition.
"I am not prepared to go back to the Dark Ages," Pastorek said.
"I don't think state boards should dictate editorial content of school textbooks," he said. "We shouldn't be involved with that."
Donna Contois of Metairie, chairwoman of the committee that approved the change, said afterward she could not say whether it will win approval by the full board.
The disclaimer under consideration says the theory of evolution "still leaves many unanswered questions about the origin of life.
"Study hard and keep an open mind," it says. "Someday you may contribute to the theories of how living things appeared on earth."
Backers say the addition would be inserted in the front of biology textbooks used by students in grades 9-12, possibly next fall.
The issue surfaced when a committee of the board prepared to approve dozens of textbooks used by both public and nonpublic schools. The list was recommended by a separate panel that reviews textbooks every seven years.
A handful of citizens, one armed with a copy of Charles Darwin's "Origin of the Species," complained that biology textbooks used now are one-sided in promoting evolution uncritically and are riddled with factual errors.
"If we give them all the facts to make up their mind, we have educated them," Darrell White of Baton Rouge said of students. "Otherwise we have indoctrinated them."
Darwin wrote that individuals with certain characteristics enjoy an edge over their peers and life forms developed gradually millions of years ago.
Backers bristled at suggestions that they favor the teaching of creationism, which says that life began about 6,000 years ago in a process described in the Bible's Book of Genesis.
White said he is the father of seven children, including a 10th-grader at a public high school in Baton Rouge.
He said he reviewed 21 science textbooks for use by middle and high school students. White called Darwin's book "racist and sexist" and said students are entitled to know more about controversy that swirls around the theory.
"If nothing else, put a disclaimer in the front of the textbooks," White said.
John Oller Jr., a professor at the University of Louisiana-Lafayette, also criticized the accuracy of science textbooks under review. Oller said he was appearing on behalf of the Louisiana Family Forum, a Christian lobbying group.
Oller said the state should force publishers to offer alternatives, correct mistakes in textbooks and fill in gaps in science teachings. "We are talking about major falsehoods that should be addressed," he said.
Linda Johnson of Plaquemine, a member of the board, said she supports the change. Johnson said the new message of evolution "will encourage students to go after the facts."
TOPICS: Heated Discussion
KEYWORDS: crevolist; evolution; rades
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To: Sentis
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH ?
I've been researching this question all day. It seems to me post #1193 is most correct.
Still Searching though ....
To: usastandsunited
Before the 19th century the concensus among scientist was that we had a relatively young earth. However, toward the 19th & 20th centurys, scientists concluded the earth is much older. Perhaps up to 4 billion years old. Recently, there has been a shift among some scientists that the earth is much younger than originally thought,even young as a few thousand years old.
About 80% of scientist today believe the earth is at least 3- 4 billion years old.
To: usastandsunited
usastandsunited wrote "I've been researching this question all day. It seems to me post #1193 is most correct."
That wasn't an answer. In fact it isn't even relevant to the question, nice try to derail the topic however, the question is put to usastandsunited, and gore3000 now
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH?
I don't need an exact date (I would bet Gore3000 thinks he knows the exact date and time) I will be happy with a big round number doesn't have to be exact at all so......
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH?
To: usastandsunited
usastandsunited wrote "Before the 19th century the consensus among scientist was that we had a relatively young earth. However, toward the 19th & 20th century's, scientists concluded the earth is much older. Perhaps up to 4 billion years old. Recently, there has been a shift among some scientists that the earth is much younger than originally thought,even young as a few thousand years old.
About 80% of scientist today believe the earth is at least 3- 4 billion years old."
Thanks for the answer. Now we just need to get gore3000 to answer the question I have a feeling his answer will be very very different.
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH
To: Physicist
"The obvious intention here is to inculcate doubt in the minds of the students regarding evolution, as compared to such equally well established models as the atomic theory of matter, or universal gravitation."
The fact that you consider the theory of evolution to have the same validity as the theory of universal gravitation shows that you must have deemed yourself "physicist" rather than acquiring the title from an institution of higher learning. Keep calling yourself "physicist." While the rest of us won't believe it, and you won't come any closer to realizing the title, you might at least raise your self-esteem.
newguy357, the physics student
To: usastandsunited
Oh and if you think the Earth is just a few thousand years old (BTW only scientists from creationist organizations believe the Earth is young and they aren't actually scientists in a traditional sense). Please answer this question HOW OLD IS THE UNIVERSE this question is only for usastandsunited. Gore3000 you need to answer your own question
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH?
To: Sentis
Read my last post.
I'm sorry you can't accept that I don't know that answer. You think you do. I don't care if 100% of scientist say they earth is 6,000 years old or if 100% say that the earth is 4 billion years old. That shouldn't keep someone from questioning and searching for the truth. I don't know how old the earth is, and quite frankly I haven't researched enough to draw a conclusion other than no one knows for sure. Once, I have an opinion myself, you can be the first to know.
Anyone that claims they know for certain the earth is a certain age, surely must have a hidden agenda.
To: Sentis
BTW only scientists from creationist organizations believe the Earth is young and they aren't actually scientists in a traditional sense
Back that up with some facts.
To: All
Wake up and smell the coffee...evolution is around you everyday and you don't need numskulls to tell you any different...
To: usastandsunited
usastandsunited wrote "I haven't researched enough to draw a conclusion other than no one knows for sure. Once, I have an opinion myself, you can be the first to know."
Then since you admit you don't know would you kindly stay out of this debate. You try to fog the issue and give non-answers. This shows that you wish to delude those who are reading these posts. I do have an opinion on the age of the universe and my opinion is based on scientific fact not the conjecture that the Earth is 6000 years old that conjecture is little more than a delusional claim put forth by people with no scientific credibility. The fact is any person that would think the Earth is 6,000 years old is in denial of the most basic of scientific facts and if this person tried to push this absurd assumption they would be shown as the pseudo-scientific hack they are.
BTW gore3000 How old is the
Earth?
To: usastandsunited
usastandsunited wrote"Back that up with some facts."
Back up the statement you made that "80% of scientists believe in a young Earth " and I will if you can't back up your ludicrous statements I wont waste my time to back up my factual ones.
BTW WHAT IS THE AGE OF THE EARTH
To: Sentis
Back up the statement you made that "80% of scientists believe in a young Earth " and I will if you can't back up your ludicrous statements I wont waste my time to back up my factual ones.
Sorry I meant to say back up the statement that "20% of scientists believe in a young Earth" each of these statements are as ludicrous as the other. I could probably paste in any number because your statements are absolutely unfounded.
To: All
You guys get quiet when asked for some facts.
Where is that Answer How old is the Earth?
To: PatrickHenry
Occasionally, somebody on the evo side clubs a Young-Earth argument on the head like killing a baby seal. The Shriek Chorus immediately arises. "Strawman argument! YEC-ism is a strawman!"
Is it? Start a thread on radiometric dating. The same people will haul out material from dog-eared, fuzzy-edged creationist pamphlets. You will once again wearily look up the rebuttals to hoary tales of old Hawaiian lava from fresh eruptions and old shells on live snails.
Strawman, my earlobe!
To: All
its like shining a light on cockroaches.
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH?
To: All
its like shining a light on cockroaches. They try to sidestep the question. Obfuscate the question and down right lie about it. You would think they were ashamed of what they believe.
HOW OLD IS THE EARTH?
To: Sentis
Back up the statement you made that "80% of scientists believe in a young Earth
First of all, I suggest you re-read my post. I said 80% of scientists believe the earth is at least
3-4 billion years old.
Second, I went back to my
source and re-read. Low & behold I mis-quoted my source. It said slightly more than half of all scientists believe in an old earth(compared to my qoute of 80%) I will re-vise that down to 55%. How's that?
Even though I have been reading from the last several days from a diverse sources on this subject & evolution, I realize you will immediately discredit that source mentioned. However, I have written to the webmaster, asking where they obtained this data. Once I get an answer back, I'll forward the results along to you.
Now, Back up your claim.
To: usastandsunited
Yes I will automatically refute your site because it gives no source for it's outrageous claim. It simply states your claim and doesn't back it up with data who are these 55% BTW I replied that I misquoted you did you not read that?
Your source is as full of holes as your statement. You can't refer to a site that is proof of your argument when it give absolutely no basis for those facts. In fact you knew it held no facts when you posted it you are merely obfuscating again. Thats the only tool you have to discredit evolution obfuscation and outright lies.
To: Sentis
Thats the only tool you have to discredit evolution obfuscation and outright lies.
Your calling me a liar because I'm not sucking up everything you state to be fact, or have I intentionally lied to you somewhere ?
.
Now, I'm not calling you a liar, but I'm still asking you to back up your claims.
To: usastandsunited
I didn't call you a liar. I said lying is a tool creationists use I said you were obfuscating thats not a lie its slightly different. If you read that post the You in that post defiantly refers to creationists in the thread. Here you obfuscate again to change the subject.
How Old Is The Earth?
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