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To: TBP
They joined it by their consent (along with the Federal government's but only if they applied.)

The were admitted, they didn't join.

There is nothing in the Constitution that prohibits secession. Thus, any state can legally secede any time.

So is that a round-about way of saying Madison is correct and that if one state is free to leave then 49 states are also free to expel?

Of course not, and don't be silly.

Why not? If it was such a great idea in 1809 and such a tremendous benefit to the people in Africa then why not 2009? Or don't they need our help anymore?

Do you dispute Dr. Williams's observation? Would he be better off if he were in Congo or Rwanda or Kenya or whichever tyrannical African satrapy than he is in America?

I don't know. Would Dr. Williams have wanted to be plucked from his home, crammed into a ship, sent thousands of miles away, and spend the rest of his life in slave labor? Would he have seen that as an improvement over what he had? How about you? Would you view chattel slavery in the U.S. for you and your decendants preferable to life as a free person, even in Africa?

61 posted on 05/06/2009 12:29:06 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur

They were admitted afte rapplying. It was their choice. Furthermore, the states — the original ones anyway — predate teh Union. The states created the Union, not vice versa, therefore they can leave the Union or dissove it if they choose. As I said, nothing prohibits secession, so any state could legally secede if it chose to do so. Thus, Mr. lincoln’s use of force to prevent them from doing so violated the Constitution.

To quote Eldridge Cleaver on his return to America from China, Cuba, and other such countries, “I would rather be in prison in the United States than ‘free’ in any of those countries.” Nobody is saying we shoudl reinstitute slavery, bu Cleaver is right and so is Dr. Williams. Black Americans are freer, richer, and generally better off than the black peope in the countries of their ancestry. There is NO question that that is true. Had their ancestors not been brought here, many of them would not be here today.

Slavery was horrible, but the descendents of slaves are clarly better off.


65 posted on 05/06/2009 12:35:10 PM PDT by TBP
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To: Non-Sequitur
“I don't know. Would Dr. Williams have wanted to be plucked from his home, crammed into a ship, sent thousands of miles away, and spend the rest of his life in slave labor?”

Since you served in the Navy- I'll ask you

What flag waved over them Slave ships? USA of Confederate? Did they dock in a Northern port?

79 posted on 05/06/2009 1:08:34 PM PDT by Idabilly
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To: Non-Sequitur

Again, there is nothing that prohibits secession, and Lincoln implicitly supported it himself with the admission of West Virginia (which was clarly unconstitutional.)

Several states expressly reserved the right to secede. New England talked about doing it before the South did it. It was simply assumed that it was allowable until Mr. Lincoln arbitrarily decided that he would not allow it.

When the Federal government unilaterally overrides the Constitution, what do you suggest that states do? Secession is the states’ “ultiate weapon” to regain their rights under the Tenth Amendment.


355 posted on 05/14/2009 3:19:00 PM PDT by TBP
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