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Evolution's bottom line
National Center for Science Education ^ | 12 May 2006 | Staff

Posted on 05/12/2006 12:13:47 PM PDT by PatrickHenry

In his op-ed "Evolution's bottom line," published in The New York Times (May 12, 2006), Holden Thorp emphasizes the practical applications of evolution, writing, "creationism has no commercial application. Evolution does," and citing several specific examples.

In places where evolution education is undermined, he argues, it isn't only students who will be the poorer for it: "Will Mom or Dad Scientist want to live somewhere where their children are less likely to learn evolution?" He concludes, "Where science gets done is where wealth gets created, so places that decide to put stickers on their textbooks or change the definition of science have decided, perhaps unknowingly, not to go to the innovation party of the future. Maybe that's fine for the grownups who'd rather stay home, but it seems like a raw deal for the 14-year-old girl in Topeka who might have gone on to find a cure for resistant infections if only she had been taught evolution in high school."

Thorp is chairman of the chemistry department at the University of North Carolina.


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: butwecondemnevos; caticsnotchristian; christiannotcatlic; crevolist; germany; ignoranceisstrength; ignorantcultists; pavlovian; speyer
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Comment #1,001 Removed by Moderator

Comment #1,002 Removed by Moderator

To: curiosity
FYI, no priest could have lifted Hitler's excommunication. Under the Code of Canon Law in force at the time, only the pope can lift the automatic excommunication that comes with assaulting a priest, monk or nun.

Hmm.. And lets think about this a bit. Is George Bush ex-communicated if a federal officer roughs up a suspect that happens to be priest, monk, or nun? Did Hitler personally rough up a priest, monk, or nun? Did Hitler's minions illegally rough up a priest, monk, or nun? If it was illegal, did Hitler explicitly and knowledgeable order it? If he did, who would know? If an ex-communication falls in the forest, with no one to hear it, does it make a sound?

1,003 posted on 05/14/2006 8:19:07 PM PDT by donh
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Comment #1,004 Removed by Moderator

To: Havoc
I think the concepts of good and evil are a little more complicated than just pulling quotes out of the Bible. After all, the Devil can quote what is written also (Matthew 4:1-11) to suit his own needs...which raises an interesting question. It's obvious, at least to me, that Christ and the Devil know who each other are. If belief alone is the only qualifier, then how does that explain the Devil, and how, if such belief only yields good, does that explain the subsequent initial manifestation of evil by him.
1,005 posted on 05/14/2006 8:31:16 PM PDT by csense
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To: HappyFeet

That story about Darwin recanting really is a phoney one-- don't be fooled by it. http://www.christiananswers.net/q-aig/darwin.html

Read any book from rabid IDers or whatever and it'll say the same as the neo-Darwinists on this point.

Darwin's God by Cornelius Hunter is a good book by a a biophysicist skeptical of aspects of Darwin's theory that deals with Darwin's religious belief.

The natural theology of William Paley was convincing to Darwin in its logically taut, scientifically educated argument from design. But the theology of Paely regarding the Problem of Evil was a simplistic dismissal of the existence of evil akin to that of Voltaire's Dr. Pangloss.

The rejection of Paley's simplistic theology regarding the problem of evil was one of Darwin's motivations in rejecting design and God in toto. This page has some of his (I think) interesting thoughts on religion http://pages.britishlibrary.net/charles.darwin/texts/letters/letters1_08.html


1,006 posted on 05/14/2006 8:34:36 PM PDT by mjolnir ("All great change in America begins at the dinner table.")
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To: HappyFeet
"If an ex-communication falls in the forest, with no one to hear it, does it make a sound?"

Yes, it does.

Ah, but that's not scientific. In fact, it's not even scientific if you do hear it, because you didn't move your ear thru every millimeter of the forest, at the same speed at which the sound traveled, to prove that there was a direct connection between the tree falling, and you hearing it. These gaps in the air displacement theory of sound demonstrate that you could never actually hear a tree fall in the forest. There can only be microsound, which God generates right in front of your ear canal, science can't prove the existence of macrosound.

1,007 posted on 05/14/2006 8:34:37 PM PDT by donh
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To: HappyFeet; PatrickHenry
1000

you cheated :)

No, I learned from PH, but at this hour he is:

Early to bed, early to rise
Makes you yawn with bloodshot eyes!

1,008 posted on 05/14/2006 8:37:39 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Stupidity is the only universal capital crime; the sentence is death--Heinlein)
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Comment #1,009 Removed by Moderator

Comment #1,010 Removed by Moderator

To: lexfreedom

I don't think that homosexuals are all that concerned with the next generation, being more concerned with the momentary sensation.

On the other hand, some homosexuals adopt that lifestyle as a defense mechanism to trama.

Of course, a diety could make even a homosexual union productive. Interesting: religious people who assert that marriage is about producing children can justify homosexual marriage by cracking the door to let in a miracle!


1,011 posted on 05/14/2006 8:59:39 PM PDT by donmeaker (Burn the UN flag publicly.)
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To: aimhigh

I would suggest that Hitler was a Catholic, but not a Christian.

Also, rather than being the son of Alois Hitler, he was probably the illegimate son of Mr Schicklegruber, for whom his mother worked as a maid during her marriage to Alois Hitler. After Alois died, Adolf Hitler's mother married Schicklegruber, and had a (second) child with him.


1,012 posted on 05/14/2006 9:02:30 PM PDT by donmeaker (Burn the UN flag publicly.)
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To: HappyFeet
So, we agree, right? It's not scientific to claim you've heard the tree fall in the forest just because you see the tree fall and some sound reaches your ear, because of the gaps in the continuous flow of evidence.
1,013 posted on 05/14/2006 9:04:52 PM PDT by donh
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To: HappyFeet
I've heard of it, thought, and all my life believed, as I believed 99% of people believed too, that evolution, and the idea that humans come from apes, is a lot of bunk.

From where did you obtain the information that 99% of people believe that the idea that humans come from apes is bunk? Also, you did not actually demonstrate that it is bunk. Claiming that it is bunk does not demonstrate that it is bunk.
1,014 posted on 05/14/2006 9:06:41 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Havoc
No, I remember. Sorry. You may be able to get by with making statements publicaly and trying to rewrite history; but, you can't rewrite the memory of it that those of us who were there have. The only way you can get away with it is to try and make us all think we've just forgotten or mis-remembered. Ain't gonna work.

Please provide references to support your claim that the theory of evolution has ever referenced the Big Bang. Claiming that it once made such references does not demonstrate that it actually ever did make such references.
1,015 posted on 05/14/2006 9:07:51 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: donh
When the Pope does a real excommunication catholics are required to shun you.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

Excommunication means you're no longer a member of the Church and therefore don't have access to the sacraments. Nothing more. There's nothing in Canon Law about "shunning." Catholics are free to form friendships with excommuncated people, and are in no way restricted from associating with them. An excommunicated person can even come to Church, as can all non-Catholics. He just can't take communion.

Given that Hitler didn't partake of the sacraments, it hardly matters.

Had the Pope actually, publicly excommunicated Hitler, and any priest that co-operated with the SS, it almost certainly would have halted the holocaust in its tracks.

RFLOL. That's a good one. You really overestimate the temporal power of the Holy See.

Why would SSmen have cared, given that most left the Church (see Speer, p. 142)?

If the pope had declared the excommunication, Hitler would have confiscated every piece of Church property in Germany and disbanded every Catholic school, seminarary, nunnery, and the like, just like he did in the Netherlands when the Dutch Bishops condemned the Nazi party.

1,016 posted on 05/14/2006 9:09:28 PM PDT by curiosity
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To: HappyFeet
I already did explain and justify it.

No, you did not. You asserted it. You did not actually justify the claim.

That's what I believe about evo.

Believing that evolution is an attempt to destroy Christianity and, with it, western civilization does not actually demonstrate that evolution is any such thing. I am aware that you believe it, however that does not mean that your beliefs are justified.

It's like going to the poll booth and casting a vote for candidate A instead of B. Why vote for A instead of B? Could be many factors, but no one asks you that you must justify why you voted for A and not B. I voted for Bush because I thought he was gonna be better than Clinton and Gore. You follow me?

This does not make your claim factual. Reality is not decided by vote.
1,017 posted on 05/14/2006 9:09:51 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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Comment #1,018 Removed by Moderator

To: HappyFeet
No, I don't.

Darwin's family members, who were present at his deathbed, later denied that Darwin made any deathbed conversions. It would appear that the information that you have read regarding Darwin recanting his theories and accepting Christianity is in error.
1,019 posted on 05/14/2006 9:11:45 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: donh
Did Hitler personally rough up a priest, monk, or nun?

He sent many to concentration camps where they were killed, and yes it was known. See Edith Stein and Maximillian Kolbe. He also ordered the confiscation of a good deal of Church property, and that was also known.

1,020 posted on 05/14/2006 9:12:27 PM PDT by curiosity
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