Bush will win on Immigration to save the Republican Party.

[Pukin Dog]

Just a little dose of reality for some of you going nuts over the Immigration issue, because there is NO chance that you will win on the border enforcement issue. No chance whatsoever. Only after a migrant worker program passes, making most of these illegal aliens legal, is there any chance at all to have meaningful border enforcement.

Bush is not running for office anymore, but the Republican Congress is in need of a big victory in November. This issue will kill our chances to maintain the majority, and knowing that, Bush will likely veto any bill making illegal immigration a felony, if that bill does not include the migrant worker program (call it amnesty if you want) needed to hold onto Business and Hispanic support for the Republican Party.

The Illegal Immigration Genie is out of the bottle, folks. You can’t stuff her back in without losing the House and/or Senate in November. Pragmatic minds will rule in the end, and that is a bitter pill you best swallow now.

FReepers can’t will elections for the Republican Party, but we sure can go a long way towards losing them, if we can’t put our common sense ahead of our passions on this issue. I live in San Diego County, and I see the problems with illegal immigration on a daily basis.

Whether you like it or not, much of the commerce of this country does depend on these folks to do jobs that Americans won’t do for the prevailing wage.

So, you have a choice, you can demand the border enforcement bills on their own, or you can swallow hard and consider everything you will lose if we turn off 10-15% of the electorate, in addition to the business community that depends on these workers. Yeah, they broke the law, and so do the people who hire them.

So what?

Yeah, I said it, SO WHAT? The time to be worried about that was when there were REAL Republican majorities in the Border States. It is too late now. This is a problem that cannot be solved, but only managed.

It is possible to be right and stupid at the same time. Pete Wilson tried this a few years ago, got all kinds of support for it. It passed, and Pete Wilson is gone. Then a judge overturned it anyway. That is exactly what you can expect to happen with these current bills as well. Some judge will put an injunction on enforcement, but by the time that happens, we will be knee-deep into impeachment proceeding under a Democrat Congress.

Bush won’t let that happen, neither will smarter members of the Senate and House. You won’t win, you can’t win, but you can shoot yourself and the Republican party in the head (even if you are not a member) by pursuing a program that does not include amnesty or whatever you want to call it.

We lost this one.

Get over it. There are bigger battles ahead.

[markman46]

Bikers, thanks for the cogent arguments, gives me lots to chew on

[processing please hold]

What’s the problem, besides the fact that none of them should be here to begin with? The Constitution doesn’t even give them this right–unlike what open border lobbyists will have you believe. The entire “anchor baby” problem is due to a complete and utter bastardization of the American Constitution. The phrase “and subject to the jurisdiction thereof” is in that amendment. It means those who subscribe to the laws of the land. Those who come under American jurisdiction. Those who choose to be American.

Article...http://www.rightonblog.net/?p=342"

[Froufrou]

You are right. BTW, pregnancy qualifies as an 'emergency' condition, so when they go into labor they get medicaid, certified in the labor room of the hospita, or after the delivery if it happens that fast.

They know it and that's why they come here. They take advantage of the system. Being born in Germany didn't make my SIL an automatic German citizen. Same should apply here.

[Spiff]

I said we would likely need a guest worker program for the parents of the anchor babies ONLY! That keeps from raising taxes to pay for the mess of deporting all of those, and supporting the children.

Wrong. Severely punish all employers who are BREAKING THE LAW and hiring ILLEGAL aliens. Seize the businesses of the most egregious offenders. Announce an extremely limited guest worker program that requires all potential candidates to apply from their home countries. Set a date on the calendar and state that anyone caught illegally in the country after that date will forever be prohibited from applying for legal status and will be deported on sight if they're ever caught within our borders. The jobs will dry up and the illegal aliens will pack up their ill-gotten belongings and their anchor babies and get the hell out.

[zook]

I have no idea what your point is. And why not save the cute little insults for amusing the neighborhood 4th graders?

[processing please hold]

Just stealing the TVs Americans won't!

You bad. *chuckle*

[samcgwire]

I see so many white flags on this thread alone that I find it hard to believe, honestly. It's been a long time since I've since such acts of contortion to bend over and allow America to be utterly gutted. And I mean that with the utmost sincerity and respect. As for thoughtful comments, I try to make every single post just that. I run a significant business and don't have time for anything but the cold hard facts.

[Froufrou]

I agree. I do not believe it was the Founding Father's intention to leave such a big hole in the 14th Amendment.

[Reagan Man]

>>>>Wrong or right, its a great discussion, eh?

90% of posters are telling you, you are DEADWRONG. This is not a great discussion. You're on the wrong side of this issue and being given the ultimate FReeper smackdown. Look at the results of the current FR poll question. Public opinion isn't quite that high, but FReepers and Americans in general are in agreement on this one.

[processing please hold]

If you didn't think the present was scary enough the future holds much worse.

Lord have mercy!!!

My back is stiffened for whatever lies ahead.

[Marine Inspector]

What's ridiculous is to suggest that the unwed fathers be deported while our taxes go to support anchor babies' moms on welfare and food stamps.

Sorry, that was not my suggestion. You must have me mistaken for some other poster.

Deport the illegal. The USC child can stay or go, but that's up to the parents. As for welfare for the child, speak to your Congressman.

[TXBSAFH]

They are accompishing very little in the way of a conservative agend in power.

[Pukin Dog]

Do you personally enable the illegals/invaders?

I don't stand at the border with the back of my truck open, if that is what you mean.

What I do, is take advantage of available labor, and I don't ask people who WANT TO WORK whether or not they are here legally. I am not the border patrol. If you don't like people hiring illegals, then I bet you don't shop at WalMart, right?

I respect any man who will bust his ass for a buck under the San Diego sun. Men have done worse to feed their families and until someone slaps a badge on my chest, anyone who wants to work has my respect, I don't care where you come from.

[MineralMan]

"The phrase “and subject to the jurisdiction thereof” is in that amendment. It means those who subscribe to the laws of the land. Those who come under American jurisdiction. Those who choose to be American."

---

Well, despite your boldfacing, you are incorrect. Every person inside the borders of the United States of America is "subject to the jurisdiction thereof," with one exception: those here under diplomatic immunity, which is what that clause references.

If you are here, under whatever terms, you are subject to the laws of this country, unless you have diplomatic immunity. Therefore, you are "under the jurisdiction" of the USA.

There have been numerous rulings on this matter, if you'd care to look. Your opinion of what the words mean is not necessarily what the words mean. The Constitution is a legal document, subject to interpretation by the SCOTUS.

I'm afraid you are incorrect.

[La Enchiladita]

If only you knew what a LAFF RIOT you are!

[processing please hold]

Heck, I live near the border and I've talked to several OB nurses as well as midwives who see this kind of thing EVERY DAY.

Damn.

I say, send them packing back across the border then send Fox the bill.

[Miss Marple]

Well, I guess you don't mind all those welfare payments on YOUR state's budget, but Indiana can't afford it. And in case it hasn't yet occurred to you, those children are citizens and have a legal right to welfare payments.

Sure, some parents will take their children home, particularly if they are small. But older children, especially those in middle and high school, will probably be left here with friends so that they can apply for college and get jobs in the USA. Until they are 18, we will be paying for their upkeep.

[Marine Inspector]

I'm all for Capitalism and free market, but unlike the poster I was speaking to, I don't think it will work with zero regulation as she suggested.

Some regulation will be needed (i.e. laws against hiring illegals)

[Froufrou]

Set a date on the calendar

We've done that before. It hasn't worked. But going for the employers who break the law is the way to go, IMHO. Make the penalty so big [Kinky Friedman said something like $10,000 per head!] the employers won't think it's attractive any more to hire cheap labor.