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To: OrthodoxPresbyterian
All that I want is for Government to abolish Publik Skooling, and turn over Education to the Free Market.

Frankly, that idea frightens me - but not for the reasons that you might think.

Most of the parents in the circles in which I, and probably you, move would probably be able to do just as well or better if they were able to select their kid's schools with vouchers, or if the vouchers could be applied to home-schooling costs. But there is no shortage of parents who have no business making those sorts of decisions about their kids - they'd end up sending them to the educational equivalent of the con nursing homes you see on 60 Minutes.

Public education is important because there are some things that children need to learn in order to participate in a democratic republic. If we are going to grant the franchise to all citizens, then all citizens need to be indoctrinated into the basic beliefs of America, and the fundamental knowledge and skills they need to making a living - whether the parents like it or not. The question, therefore, is not whether or not schools should exist; the question is whether evolution belongs in the curriculum.

Guess I outed myself as a statist.... but Thomas Jefferson, as an advocate of public education, would probably agree with me on this one.

1,453 posted on 02/15/2006 11:20:53 AM PST by jude24 ("Thy law is written on the hearts of men, which iniquity itself effaces not." - St. Augustine)
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To: jude24; OrthodoxPresbyterian
Most of the parents in the circles in which I, and probably you, move would probably be able to do just as well or better if they were able to select their kid's schools with vouchers, or if the vouchers could be applied to home-schooling costs. But there is no shortage of parents who have no business making those sorts of decisions about their kids - they'd end up sending them to the educational equivalent of the con nursing homes you see on 60 Minutes. Public education is important because there are some things that children need to learn in order to participate in a democratic republic. If we are going to grant the franchise to all citizens, then all citizens need to be indoctrinated into the basic beliefs of America, and the fundamental knowledge and skills they need to making a living - whether the parents like it or not.

That sounds a lot like things I've been saying for quite a while. I wouldn't stop anyone from choosing a private school, but the demise of public schools would have a downside of the "unintended consequences" variety. Here are a couple of past posts I've written when that subject came up:

I can't think of a single good reason why people can't choose between an 'evolution-in' school and an 'evolution-out' school.

I'm not against school choice or vouchers or home-schooling, but I *can* think of "a single good reason" or two why there might be a downside to it.

1. It accelerates the balkanization (i.e. cultural fragmentation) of America. For better or worse, uniform public schooling has been one of the stronger influences assisting the "melting pot" effect of America.

2. It's not going to help America's competitiveness in today's technological world when a significant portion of the younger generation has been taught that large portions of established scientific knowledge are bunk, that scientists in general are deluded fools, and that science itself is a poor way to acquire knowledge about how things work. Many parents would choose to send their children to schools which taught these views.

And:
But there's a silver lining to this ominous cloud -- it will hasten the demise of government schools.

Works for me, since it appears they are beyond repair, unfortunately. I'm concerned, however, that if all public education is done via private schools, before long it would lead to (or since it may already be underway, hasten) a Balkanization of the US.

In the past 2-3 generations, the biggest forces maintaining the "melting pot" nature of the US have been public schools, and TV. Back when TV (and before that, radio) was limited to a few major stations, everyone was exposed to the same news, same broadcast opinions, and the same entertainments (e.g. the sitcoms on the "big three" networks and "American Top 40" on radio all across the country) to be discussed around the water cooler. Whether they accepted those opinions or not, or viewed the news in the same way, etc., it still provided a central, core, common focus to American life that everyone shared as a society.

Likewise for public schools, which while they suffered from many of the problems of institutions formed by consensus (i.e. community consensus, state standards, etc.), they still provided a common foundation of facts, ideas, and teachings which everyone shared as a starting point for their lives.

But with TV and the news/entertainment sources fractioning into thousands of cable channels and internet sources, and primary education devolving into countless private schools and homeschooling, is there really any common American experience anymore? While there are many upsides to parents and individuals being able to choose and customize their own news, entertainment, and educational choices, the big downside is that America may fractionate into multiple insular social groups which find little if any common ground with others, and even less reason to seek any.

Like the Balkans, we may find ourselves with a single geographic expanse inhabited by multiple groups of people with incompatible religious/social/political "national" identities.


1,457 posted on 02/15/2006 11:31:38 AM PST by Ichneumon
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To: jude24; OrthodoxPresbyterian; xzins
But there is no shortage of parents who have no business making those sorts of decisions about their kids

So the responsibility for decisions on the education of children should be left to elitists like yourself, huh?

1,564 posted on 02/15/2006 4:50:05 PM PST by P-Marlowe
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