Posted on 03/29/2005 8:58:34 AM PST by Long Cut
We, the Witness Protection Program For Freepers, aka the Wild Turkeys, aka the Coalition of the Sane, have through mutual discussion and rigourous thought, determined that:
1. The discussion threads regarding Terri Schiavo (hereafter referred to as "TS") have become too full of innuendo, rumormongering, hyperbole, hysteria, namecalling, paranoia, and general poor behavior to warrant participation.
2. Said threads have degenerated into "echo chambers", wherein the same, common thoughts are continually posted again and again, and the same old disreputable, unconfirmed and/or false urban myths are propagated.
3. Anyone who joins in said theads with alternative viewpoints to the most extreme posts are routinely driven away with slander, accusations, and vile namecalling.
4. No data or evidence contrary to the "prevailing opinions" are accepted, considered, or discussed; and in fact are rejected outright in most instances.
5. That the continued calls for armed insurrection, military or paramilitary involvement, impeachements of politicians and judges, and death threats are embarassing, stupid, shortsighted, doomed to failure, and contrary to most if not all conservative thought prior to this case, as well as damaging in the extreme to FR and the conservative movement as a whole.
6. That such emotional, hyperbolic, and propaganda-driven hysteria is in fact contrary to all conservatives USED to stand for.
7. That the holding up of swastika and other Nazi imagery towards the police and the Bushes, the use of children as political props, and the disruption of the peace at the Woodside Hospice can only reflect badly on conservatives in general, and should be discouraged.
8. That the pursuit of this issue to the exclusion of all others by the GOP has damaged, perhaps beyond repair, the pursuit of other important issues as well as the reputation of the GOP, FR, and conservatism.
The WPPFF is NOT of one mind as to the case of TS or its correct outcome. In fact, wide disagreement exists within our little group. However, we are united in our wish that reason and sanity be respected in the discussion, as well as the rights of all parties involved or participating. We wish to discuss this as adults and intellectuals, as conservatives and as FRiends, not as children screaming past each other on some playground of hysteria. We wish for facts and evidence to be provided, discussed reasonably, and considered fairly.
We reject all accusations of Naziism, "death cultism", or other slander as methods of debate. We reject the practice of "spamming" multiple threads, of posting unending vanities, and the posting of propaganda and calls for violence. We reject, in fact, all unseemly and childish behavior which has come to characterize this case on FR.
We DO invite others to come and reasonably discuss the issue. We have no problem with FReepers who wish to debate in a rational and fair manner, and with due respect for their fellow FReepers. We have NO problem with those whose views are formed by religion; however we reject "preaching" or "being beaten with a Bible" as legitemite debate tactics. Not all of us are Believers, and such tactics only cheapen the source.
If a FReeper finds this an acceptable meansd to discuss this and other issues, they are welcome to join in and participate. Those who find pleasure in attacks, flame-baiting, slander, stalking, and personal atacks will be ignored, and their egos will go unfed.
We assume this thread to be a zone of sanity in an overheated atmosphere. Thus, a general amnesty is in effect. If posters conduct themselves within the guidlines above, we will be happy to discuss and debate with you. If a poster wishes to apologize for past slips of the tongue, or for possible "over-the-top" statements to another, it will be graciously accepted, and your company welcome.
Please bring a sense of humor; we feel that too many have been taking themselves too seriously lately.
Let the discussion begin!
Signed,
The WPPFF, aka The Wild Turkeys, aka the Coalition of the Sane.
Your doing just find sodpoodle
Matt25:41-46
Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the
devil and his angels:
For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye
gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and
ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an
hungred, or thirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison,
and did not minister unto thee?
Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as
ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. And
these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous
into life eeternal.
The members of the WPPFF are, in fact, of many different opinions on the Schiavo case. Some do support the removal of the tube; some supported the Schindlers in their cause.
What we all have in common is a wish to discuss it without being subjected to cries of "Nazi!" or "Murderer!", or having to wade through numerous nonsensical conspiracy theories. We also do not like the constant use of Nazi and other vile imagery, or the practice of flaming the skin off a poster simply because that poster is not in 100% agreement.
We wanted a place where FRiends could gather and talk calmly. Overall, it seemst to have worked well, despite the attempts by some to disrupt it.
If you wish to stay and debate, welcome. If you find the "hotter" threads more pleasurable, go there. It's all up to you.
When someone on the main forum called me a Nazi because I said that we were a nation of laws, I started looking for other threads to avoid senseless bickering. I found that to be impossible.
For now, IMO, this is a haven.
The last time I was called a Nazi was 1968 while manning a barricade at the Democratic National Convention in Chicago...sucked then, worse now, because of the supposed nature of a conservative forum that I happen to respect very much.
I will tell you why I have been posting to this thread...I was tired of asking questions, and being told, that it was unnecessary for me to have certain facts, or that those facts did not relate to the subject at hand....I was tired of not supporting armed insurrection to resuce Terri, and told that must mean I wanted her to be 'killed'...
I was tired of seeing someone who voiced an opinion that did not jive with the others on the thread labeled as a 'Nazi', simply because they disagreed...
I was tired of seeing Michael Shiavos children being called 'bastards' all of the time...
I was tired of being expected to accept only those 'facts', which supported the Schindler side, and expected to disagree with any 'facts', which lend support to the Shiavo side...
I suppose I could go on and on...
I never wanted Terri Shiavo disconnected, because I had absolutely no idea just what her wishes were for herself, in the situation that she was in...I wanted her to continue with the feeding tube, I wanted to her enjoy her life, in whatever state she was in...
But, I dont trust politicians at all, they all have their own agendas....they may be caring people, but to me anyway, their first and foremost position is always that of being a politician...yet in spite of that feeling, I do feel that both Pres. Bush, and Gov. Bush, had it in their hearts and minds to do and say their utmost for Terri Shiavo, to try to sustain her life..yet they were denigrated for not carrying things further....
But I also dont necessarily trust any of the parties involved in this case, they all have their own agendas...I was even critical of some of the members of the Schindler family because I just noticed discrepancy in some of the different things they were saying regarding Terri...things just did not jive for me...
But at least I could voice that on this thread without being attacked for that opinion...If I had voiced the slightest critique of the Schindlers, I can only envision what I would have been called on any of the mainstream Terri threads...
I also went on to say, that I could easily understand why the Schindlers might seem to be making conflicting statements...they were of course frantic to save their daughter and sister, they were distraught at their inability to get anyone to be able to actually do anything to get the feeding tube reinserted...I understand that...I myself, have felt the feeling of hopelessness at not being able to save a child...its the worst feeling in the world...
But I dont like being called a 'Nazi', a 'troll', or worse, simply because I may not always go along with the general consensus on a thread...
And so I am here, for the little time that I am on FR...
I was on the side of life...I was on the side of keeping Terris feeding tube in...I was not on the side of violence, or of calling, or of threats, simply because I might have some points of disagreement, which I always tried to express civily...
What possible good does it do to make death threats against a guy's family? How is conservatism, or hey! the right to life advanced when you say things such as were said there?
Several people referred to MS's children as "bastards" with venom dripping. Yeah, I know...it's TECHNICALLY correct, but they were reveling in using it. It wasn't to be linguistically correct.
The whole thread was sickening, and just one more reason that we have this one.
Good said!
Hi there...I lived in Chicago in 1968, only watched on TV what went on at the Democratic National Television...
A pity if you did leave the party. You sound like just the type of person the party needs to correct the problems you mention.
I went to the U of I at the Circle Campus...the day of the assassination of MLK, I was in class, when someone ran into class and told us to get out, and run for the 'L', as there were mobs running onto campus, with baseball bats, and clubs and such....dont know if that was true or not, just remember being scared and running...
Last year, I toyed with the idea of getting involved directly in GOP campaigns and politics. I was really hot on the idea.
Now? Nah. Anytime from now on that I try to tell someone what the GOP stands for, all they have to do to almost EVERY point is say, "Terri Schiavo" to negate it.
I'll bump to that thank you. I posted a couple of hug smiley gifs rather than pop my cork, I hope that doesn't fall too far outside the bounds of civility. :)
Anyway, I have no Wild Turkey in the house, so I'm going to pour myself a shot of that fine Elmer T. Lee bourbon that's calling to me from the kitchen. What a day.
You have to wonder about that one. Were they naive enough to think they could change the outcome, or was it all an attempt at trying to look good that failed? Is that too cynical a question? It's a bit unexpected for guys who play the Demorats for fools all the time.
Looking at DeLay's comments, there might have been some attempt at setting up the judiciary for blame. If so, they miscalculated public opinion.
Maybe you can tell me. As a Newbie, I thought that the kind of posts, such as on the thread you were referring to, are against the rules or at least standards of this forum? I guess I'm either confused or disheartened.
I don't get to post all that often but I don't mind some good old fashioned arguments. Sheese, I've managed to survive the Walmart threads{LOL!}
But I've seen people banned for much less then what's going on now. I hope this isn't the way it's going to be in the future here: afraid to speak up, being called Nazi or worse, people calling for the use of force, having to find a haven like this thread. But I have a feeling it is.
I've been here for nearly 4 years now, and I'm shocked at what's been allowed to go on - the name calling, like "nazi", "stormtrooper", deathocrat, etc. and the outright calls for violence and implied violence. And yes, people have been banned for much less in the past. I'm disheartened, to say the least. I don't know if this is going to last or not.
I guess I missed those comments. I am sure that even though it is free speech it would have been removed. One should not insight violence.
I know feelings are running strong but I do believe all those closed to Terri felt they were doing what was right for their daughter and wife.
We are a country of laws and in the end a husband trumps parents.
Feel like a broken record on that one. :(
As for the death penalty, I am waiting for the left to come on strong saying you wanted Terri to live her life was of value why not those on death row. They are being punished they are in prison.
Why bother putting them to death. Maybe they did not do it .. what makes their life not worthy of saving.
I know the answer but it is an interesting question how this will fit into the next presidential campaign.
That makes sense. Agreed on the miscalculation.
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