Confederate States Of America (2005)

Yahoo Movies ^ | 12/31/04 | Me

[Caipirabob]

What's wrong about this photo? Or if you're a true-born Southerner, what's right?

While scanning through some of the up and coming movies in 2005, I ran across this intriguing title; "CSA: Confederate States of America (2005)". It's an "alternate universe" take on what would the country be like had the South won the civil war.

Stars with bars:

Suffice to say anything from Hollywood on this topic is sure to to bring about all sorts of controversial ideas and discussions. I was surprised that they are approaching such subject matter, and I'm more than a little interested.

Some things are better left dead in the past:

For myself, I was more than pleased with the homage paid to General "Stonewall" Jackson in Turner's "Gods and Generals". Like him, I should have like to believe that the South would have been compelled to end slavery out of Christian dignity rather than continue to enslave their brothers of the freedom that belong equally to all men. Obviously it didn't happen that way.

Would I fight for a South that believed in Slavery today? I have to ask first, would I know any better back then? I don't know. I honestly don't know. My pride for my South and my heritage would have most likely doomed me as it did so many others. I won't skirt the issue, in all likelyhood, slavery may have been an afterthought. Had they been the staple of what I considered property, I possibly would have already been past the point of moral struggle on the point and preparing to kill Northern invaders.

Compelling story or KKK wet dream?:

So what do I feel about this? The photo above nearly brings me to tears, as I highly respect Abraham Lincoln. I don't care if they kick me out of the South. Imagine if GW was in prayer over what to do about a seperatist leftist California. That's how I imagine Lincoln. A great man. I wonder sometimes what my family would have been like today. How many more of us would there be? Would we have held onto the property and prosperity that sustained them before the war? Would I have double the amount of family in the area? How many would I have had to cook for last week for Christmas? Would I have needed to make more "Pate De Fois Gras"?

Well, dunno about that either. Depending on what the previous for this movie are like, I may or may not see it. If they portray it as the United Confederacy of the KKK I won't be attending.

This generation of our clan speaks some 5 languages in addition to English, those being of recent immigrants to this nation. All of them are good Americans. I believe the south would have succombed to the same forces that affected the North. Immigration, war, economics and other huma forces that have changed the map of the world since history began.

Whatever. At least in this alternate universe, it's safe for me to believe that we would have grown to be the benevolent and humane South that I know it is in my heart. I can believe that slavery would have died shortly before or after that lost victory. I can believe that Southern gentlemen would have served the world as the model for behavior. In my alternate universe, it's ok that Spock has a beard. It's my alternate universe after all, it can be what I want.

At any rate, I lived up North for many years. Wonderful people and difficult people. I will always sing their praises as a land full of beautiful Italian girls, maple syrup and Birch beer. My uncle ribbed us once before we left on how we were going up North to live "with all the Yankees". Afterwards I always refered to him as royalty. He is, really. He's "King of the Rednecks". I suppose I'm his court jester.

So what do you think of this movie?

[rustbucket]

Then who is responsible for their being subjected to a bombardment, the Union or the Southern military?

You can't be asking that with a straight face. See my 4,519.

[stand watie]

dear m.eSPINola,

have you considered that you are becoming a laughingstock on FR??

free dixie,sw

[stand watie]

your posting of NONSENSE is NOT a substitute for brains.

free dixie,sw

[stand watie]

yet another example of your lack of THOUGHT.

free dixie,sw

[stand watie]

and you can PROVE all this drivel you posted?????

i think not.

free dixie,sw

[stand watie]

ditto.

free dixie,sw

[mac_truck]

It appears to be Dahlgren's personal plan.

Concurring bump. There were no 'orders' found on Dahlgren. If they existed at all the papers were personal in nature and Dahlgren was known to keep a journal.

The other distortion the neo-reb cultists have concocted is that Dalhgren was an 'inexperienced' officer. Nothing could be farther from the truth.

[stand watie]

and your PROOF for this assertion is?????

free dixie,sw

[GOPcapitalist]

Check out the other two reviews that I posted, both from professors of universities.

You mean Mackubin Thomas Owens, who practices the same Lincoln idolatry you do?

The negative reviews like Gutzman's come from actual PEER REVIEWED SCHOLARLY JOURNALS - not the Claremont Review of Books.

As for Gutzman's review, his gripe is that Farber was not following his own views on nullification, and therefore must not be aware of the conclusive evidence supporting it.

No ftD. Gutzman's gripe is that Farber did not even bother to consider viewpoints that differed from his own preconceived position. He did not consider different viewpoints because he was making a partisan argument, not a scholarly one.

[GOPcapitalist]

Has anyone ever denied that abuses occured?

The Harry Jaffa cult comes awfully close!

Moreover, Farber states that this is a classical liberal view, held by Jefferson.

Farber wouldn't know Jeffersonianism if it was stapled to his forehead. That's why he also uses his partisan argument in favor of Lincoln to make similar partisan attacks upon the Jeffersonian (read: conservative) elements of the Rehnquist supreme court.

[mac_truck]

In case you missed to other pro-Farber reviews, I will post them again.

It's no surprise that you haven't gotten a response from the boy cultist . He's too busy checking your post counts, calculating the impact on bandwidth and breathlessly pinging the mods with the results.

That is when he isn't comparing Jeb Bush to Pontius Pilot.

[GOPcapitalist]

He stated that Farber was 'even handed' as well.

No. He calls his _attitude_ "even-handed." He describes Farber's book as "partisan" though, and it is.

[GOPcapitalist]

A scholar tore it to bits (and frankly, I do not read the review that way).

The blind never do.

"In sum, LINCOLN'S CONSTITUTION is a partisan work, more a lawyer's brief for the Lincoln administration to be argued before a contemporary American court or group of academics than an exercise in historiography." - Kevin Gutzman

I gave you a link to two other scolars who did, both professors.

You gave me links to two unscholarly hack jobs published in unscholarly publications such as the Claremont Review of Books, which is every bit as partisan as Farber himself.

I, on the other hand, have given you a total of three reviews - all from refereed scholarly journals - that have one or more severe criticisms of flaws in Farber's book. Naturally you ignore it and pretend they don't say what they plainly do.

[GOPcapitalist]

Farber wrote a work for the public, not a scholary one for the professors.

So you admit then that Farber's book is unscholarly?

[GOPcapitalist]

Concurring bump. There were no 'orders' found on Dahlgren. If they existed at all the papers were personal in nature and Dahlgren was known to keep a journal.

...and yet another lie from the garbage_truck. The papers found on Dahlgren were written on the official stationary of the Third Division U.S. Cavalry Corps.

[sully777]

The 'South' lost again. :)

---

I live in the Deep South, sir. I don't really want to gloat.

And though it seems impossible to comprehend, I once resided north of the Mason Dixon in an area that was just as rebel as Ole Miss, and were just as embroiled in the secessionist rhetoric and activity as South Carolina on a hot, humid evening. People forget that The Federalist Party fell apart after they suggested New England secede from the Union. People forget partisan battles and terror activities in states hundreds of miles north in the 1860's. People forget that states such as Maryland and Missouri remained Unionist under suspicious parliamentary activities, and states such as Ohio, Deleware, New Jersey, New York, and Pennsylvannia harbored rebels-many without pretense. People forget the ethnic riots in the northern cities. It was truly a civil war that could have proved disastrous for all, including ultimately the world.

What I am saying is that the USA survived and the world is blessed by a union rather than a division. But there are those fools on both sides of the Mason Dixon that never learn the lessons of that horrific war. It has been almost 150 years since those bloody days and its time we learn from the lesson rather than rip open the scar.

The premise of the thread was asinine from the start. We are Americans by God, let's start acting like Americans. You can't go backward you can only go forward. I don't play what ifs, I'm Irish.

[GOPcapitalist]

He's too busy checking your post counts, calculating the impact on bandwidth and breathlessly pinging the mods with the results. That is when he isn't comparing Jeb Bush to Pontius Pilot.

Funny he'd say this, considering that it'd take him the very same thing and more that he's alleging to derive the results he's purporting!

Remember what I said yesterday about the Wlat Brigade sharing its various bad habits among the members like venereal diseases? Among them seems to be the very same style of cyberstalking that got Cap'n Crunch admonished by the mods and exiled, which he now denies.

[GOPcapitalist]

Of course being the only poster around here to have gotten himself slapped down for abuses and gone into exile for a month he would know.

[lentulusgracchus]

That is when he isn't comparing Jeb Bush to Pontius Pilot.

Don't you mean "Pontius Pilate", late Roman procurator of Judaea? As in, "Lucius Pontius Pilatus"?

At least try to stay up with the adults. You could begin by paying attention to them.

Assuming anyone cares at this point.

[GOPcapitalist]

Don't you mean "Pontius Pilate", late Roman procurator of Judaea? As in, "Lucius Pontius Pilatus"?

Not surprising. He has the same difficulty with his assumed namesake Mack Trucks...barring the likely possibility that Mac Trucks is a third world or ex-Soviet offshoot brand specializing in garbage disposal units. In fact, that could explain why he considers the communist party a "legitimate" political institution!