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1 posted on 09/02/2004 5:19:24 AM PDT by sheltonmac
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To: drstevej; OrthodoxPresbyterian; CCWoody; Wrigley; Gamecock; Jean Chauvin; jboot; jude24; ...

*ping*


2 posted on 09/02/2004 5:19:55 AM PDT by sheltonmac ("Duty is ours; consequences are God's." -Gen. Thomas "Stonewall" Jackson)
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To: sheltonmac

http://www.middletownbiblechurch.org/doctrine/sbgrace.htm
A good link explaining why some have "problems" with his Lordship Theology.


3 posted on 09/02/2004 5:41:23 AM PDT by Esther Ruth (As the mountains surround Jerusalem, so the Lord surrounds His people from this time forth & FOREVER)
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To: sheltonmac
BBN's rejection of MacArthur's teaching on God's sovereignty in salvation is based on their dispensational position (soteriologically)....

Ah, that old slander again. Just when you'd think someone would have learned something.

And there's the old false division, from the other side of the fence. Some Dispensationalists misrepresent Calvinism, and then reject that misrepresentation. WAY too many Calvinists misrepresent Dispensationalism (which, I contend, is the natural otugrowth of applied Reformation principles), and then reject that misrepresentation.

While it is true that many Dispensationalists are not five-pointers (and vice-versa), there is nothing inherent in either construct which would exclude the other.

Yes, it's true. I get really, really tired of hearing this. Open up your ears and mind, bro. Listen, and learn something — as you (correctly) want your Dispensational brothers to do.

Dan
The Science of Bible Reading

4 posted on 09/02/2004 5:44:06 AM PDT by BibChr ("...behold, they have rejected the word of the LORD, so what wisdom is in them?" [Jer. 8:9])
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To: sheltonmac; OrthodoxPresbyterian; Gamecock; Jean Chauvin; jboot; jude24; AZhardliner; ...

from the hyperlink in the article - I'd like to ask the Calvinists here if this is accurate
_________________________________________________

Most Calvinists reject as deplorable the following hyper-Calvinistic and destructive beliefs:

that God is the author of sin and of evil
that men have no will of their own, and secondary causes are of no effect
that the number of the elect at any time may be known by men
that it is wrong to evangelize
that assurance of election must be sought prior to repentance and faith
that men who have once sincerely professed belief are saved regardless of what they later do
that God has chosen some races of men and has rejected others
that the children of unbelievers dying in infancy are certainly damned
that God does not command everyone to repent
that the sacraments are not means of grace, but obstacles to salvation by faith alone.
that the true church is only invisible, and salvation is not connected with the visible church
that the Scriptures are intended to be interpreted by individuals only and not by the church.
that no government is to be obeyed which does not acknowledge that Jesus is the Lord, or that Biblical Law is its source of authority
that the grace of God does not work for the betterment of all men
that saving faith is equivalent to belief in the doctrine of predestination
that only Calvinists are Christians (Neo-gnostic Calvinism)



Arminianism and Hyper-Calvinism were both among the historical errors battled by Charles Spurgeon, who was himself a 5-point Calvinist. He vigilantly fought these twin errors on both sides of the spectrum. One of Hyper-Calvinism's main errors is to declare that, because of God's sovereignty, we should not evangelize the lost. Spurgeon rejected such nonsense as do the large majority of people who would call themselves Calvinists today (such as R.C. Sproul, John Piper, John MacArthur, Alistair Begg and many others) We believe the doctrine of election should be declared strongly because the Bible does and because man's affections are enslaved to sin. He cannot save himself but needs the effectual working of the Holy Spirit if he is to have ears to hear when we preach the gospel. Many Christian missionaries whom most would consider heroes held to the five point of Calvinism: William Carrey (he was opposed by a Hyper-Calvinist), Jonathan Edwards & David Brainard (missionaries to native Americans) just to name 3.


5 posted on 09/02/2004 5:49:49 AM PDT by Revelation 911 (wondertwin powers activate!)
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To: sheltonmac
It's good to FINALLY find a link as to what exactly constitutes Hyper-Calvinism. Everyone is sure all over the board on this. I couldn't agree with any of that except perhaps only Calvinists were Christians. ;O)

"The action taken to remove MacArthur from the station for preaching a biblical doctrine is an ominous development. Let us pray the Lord open the eyes of our dispensational brothers who are bringing confusing and inconsistent theology into the Church."

I wonder if the BBN would be so willing to remove Billy Graham, Pat Robinson, or Jerry Falwell for preaching that man can choose to accept or reject God? The church has lost its "sovereignty of God" perspective and in turn we no longer fear the Lord which is the beginning of wisdom. An ominous development indeed.

9 posted on 09/02/2004 6:05:30 AM PDT by HarleyD (For strong is he who carries out God's word. (Joel 2:11))
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To: sheltonmac

HyperCalvinism: a newer, more virulent form of the old heresy?


15 posted on 09/02/2004 6:22:29 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: sheltonmac

That's a shame. I'm not really sure what a hyper-Calvinist is, but I used to listen to MacArthur regularly and found him to be very sound doctrinally. Even in matters where I disagreed with him, I could see the reasoning behind his views. I hope they reconsider.


18 posted on 09/02/2004 6:24:58 AM PDT by opus86
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To: sheltonmac

Too many know-it-all theologians.


23 posted on 09/02/2004 6:38:43 AM PDT by Gotterdammerung
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To: sheltonmac

PRAISE THE LORD FOR THEIR COURAGE IN STANDING UP FOR THE BIBLICAL BALANCE OF SCRIPTURES.

Hyper-Calvinism, imho, is a perversion of the WHOLE COUNSEL OF GOD.


36 posted on 09/02/2004 7:47:02 AM PDT by Quix (PRAYER WARRIORS, DO YOUR STUFF! LIVES AND NATIONS DEPEND ON IT)
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To: sheltonmac
there is no human answer to the sovereignty of God and the "free will of man".

I believe God is sovereign; but you're free to disagree.

85 posted on 09/02/2004 11:09:52 AM PDT by kevao (John Kerry: Spitball-Throwing Girlie-Man.)
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To: sheltonmac
This is the one area that I strongly disagree with MacArthur on. I have all his commentaries, use them to prepare sermons and have read many of his books. There is one verse that clearly denounces Calvinistic teaching. Paul said, "God is not willing that any should perish, but that all would come to the knowledge of the truth."

God is not willing that any should perish. Calvinistic teaching clearly teaches that God predestines some to hell and some to heaven, in other words He predetermined and decided that man would have no free will in the matter of salvation according to this teaching.

Predestination would better be understood in these terms. God predestined that all who choose Christ would be saved, and all who reject Christ would be damned. This is the sense in which God predestined, and it puzzles me why so many find this difficult to comprehend. Two (choices), the choice is not predestined, but eternal destiny is predetermined by the choice man makes.

195 posted on 09/05/2004 10:05:18 PM PDT by evangmlw
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