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To: steve-b
the consensual conduct of peaceful citizens

Is that the way you'd describe Michelle's story? I would describe her story as a great human tragedy.

Your description is a prime example of libertarian reductionism.

52 posted on 05/28/2004 6:25:24 AM PDT by Aquinasfan (Isaiah 22:22, Rev 3:7, Mat 16:19)
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To: Aquinasfan
Is that the way you'd describe Michelle's story? I would describe her story as a great human tragedy.

So would I. Your point?

54 posted on 05/28/2004 6:27:56 AM PDT by 54-46 Was My Number
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To: Aquinasfan
I would describe her story as a great human tragedy.

I daresay it is. However, it is not the place of government to protect people from self-inflicted tragedy. God designed the Universe to teach this principle, as evidenced by the fact that governments that ignore it end up creating far more bitter tragedies than they set out to prevent (one need only compare the idealism of Karl Marx with the mass murder of Josef Stalin).

84 posted on 05/28/2004 6:42:36 AM PDT by steve-b (Panties & Leases Would Look Good On Spammers)
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To: Aquinasfan
"...the consensual conduct of peaceful citizens..."

"Is that the way you'd describe Michelle's story?"

"Michelle had gotten her start in the business at 18, when she came to Los Angeles from her home in Utah to look for work as a nude photograph model. When she failed to get modeling work, her agent encouraged her to try porn. She refused at first. "I always hated porn. I thought it was the most disgusting thing in the world," she told Primetime, which followed her career for more than two years."

"But she finally agreed."

"She was shocked when the director told her he wanted her to do anal sex —snip- she let him talk her into it."

"Then her agent sent her on a job where she would have sex with male actors in prison outfits — 12 of them. Once again, she tried to back out, telling the director it was "sick," but once again she was talked into it."

"Afterward, she says, she couldn't stop crying. She packed her bags and went home to her family in Utah. -snip-But within a year, she was back."

"She said he could keep having sex with other women"

"I can say that I've done pretty much everything there is to do, and I can walk away feeling a little proud about it, you know?"

Michelle confessed she often felt physical revulsion during her scenes: "My whole entire body feels it when I'm doing it and ... I feel so — so gross." While pretending to be enjoying the sex, she said, she was in fact counting the minutes, telling herself, "Hey, I only have this much time left. Don't worry about it. Get the check. Gonna go deposit it in your bank." She admitted: "You get addicted to the money."

Yeah...she's a "victim", and it's all our fault.

/sarcasm

127 posted on 05/28/2004 7:08:51 AM PDT by Luis Gonzalez (Sin Pátria, pero sin amo.)
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To: Aquinasfan
Your description is a prime example of libertarian reductionism.

The huge difference I keep seeing between Libertarian arguments on FR and conservative ones is that Libertarians use their principles to deny any responsibility for their society. They seem to think there are only two options to a story like Michelle's. One is to shake your head at her and say, "Bad choice, girl. Tough luck!" The other is to create a set of laws to make her tragedy impossible.

Conservatives accept a personal responsibility for the good of society, where possible. Conservatives will take the third option. Don't use porn. Discourage others from using porn. Tell the story far and wide to create a social stigma to anyone supporting the porn industry. Use social compulsion to put the pornographers back on skid row where they belong.

Nobody would be hurt if porn were to go away, and many would be helped. A true conservative understands this, and condemns the porn industry without requiring laws to be written.

That doesn't take a government program, but it does require that you put society higher on your personal priority list. That doesn't sit well with the modern American.

Shalom.

179 posted on 05/28/2004 8:13:38 AM PDT by ArGee (After 517, the abolition of man is complete)
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To: Aquinasfan
Is that the way you'd describe Michelle's story? I would describe her story as a great human tragedy.

I joined the Army thinking I was going to do this cool job, but when I got there they made me do all this nasty stuff, and I was even scared at times. The Army is Evil! Or maybe I should have just done some more research about what exactly happens in the Army before I joined and not just believe the recruiter.

But at least in my case I didn't go crying about what happened. I learned to live it, learned to love it. If she doesn't love her job, quit whining, the door's right there!

402 posted on 05/28/2004 1:44:06 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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