The Lord of the Rings: A Rambling Review and Reflection

Modern Reformation ^ | unknown | By J. Ligon Duncan

[Biblical Calvinist]

For all Tolkien fans; A wonderful article discussing Tolkien from a thoughtful theological perspective..hope ya'll will find it as interesting as I did. Enjoy !

[rightwingreligiousfanatic]

(((((((((PING!!!)))))))))

[rightwingreligiousfanatic]

Pinging an interesting article....

[Sam Cree]

I really enjoyed this well written article, thanks for posting it. I'm not too convinced that hobbits are Calvinists, though. Aren't Calvinists protestants?

[rightwingreligiousfanatic]

The Elves of Lorien seemed to be designed to appeal to the cross-dressing set, yet also came across as angry and vindictive

Ruthlessly snooty is how I like to refer to it. Ruthlessly snooty and awfully haughty....... And cross-dressers for sure!

Elf Bash Material!

[Sam Cree]

I like the elves pretty well, but those elves in Lorien are spooky, I wasn't even sure what sex they were.

[Biblical Calvinist]

Sam, yes, all Calvinists are Protestant, however..I'm sure that Dr. Duncan was refering to the possibility that Tolkien was espousing an AUGUSTINIAN world view..

While Augustine is generally considered to be one of the chief architects of Western Civilization..he is also embraced by the Protestant Reformers as well as the Catholics as one of the greatest Theologians of the Church. (for instance, Luther was an Augustinian Monk.)

Dr. Duncan was probably refering to the fact that Calvinists are Predestinarian; as Augustine was also Predestinarian in his theology. (The Protestant Reformation was essentially an Augustinian Revival.)

And, since the World of Middle Earth appears to depend; at least on a very subtle level on a Providential Diety...I think that this is possibly why Dr. Duncan's brother's friend made the "tongue in cheek" statement that Hobbits are Calvinists.

[JenB]

Most of us are: however Augustine and several other early church fathers had definitely Calvinist tendencies, and I do know some Calvinists who still attend Catholic churches...

And yeah, there's a lot of stuff in LotR that makes sense from a Calvinist viewpoint... but I doubt Tolkien put them in that way!

[Bear_in_RoseBear]

Thanks for the post and the ping! It was a very interesting article. I didn't care for the slaps at fantasy novels and comic books, though. ;)

[Sam Cree]

Thanks, guys...'course now I'm going to have to look up Augustine, predestinarian and Calvinism.

[Corin Stormhands]

Thanks, guys...'course now I'm going to have to look up Augustine, predestinarian and Calvinism.

Whatever you do, don't look them up on FreeRepublic!!!

As for Hobbits being Calvinists, well, as the resident Arminian (at least the admitted one) of The Hobbit Hole, I'll give as much to say that Tolkien's works are so universal in nature that one could, yes, infer that from the works. But I bet Tolkien would disagree...

[Biblical Calvinist]

Sam, you really don't have too far to look; for there were many threads on this very subject over the last two years; primarily on Predestination, Augustine, and Calvinism...posted by Orthodox Presbyterian( formerly known as Uriel1975). Here is a link to the first thread that OP posted in January of 2000.

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a393faef2392f.htm

Please keep in mind that there are over 200 threads in this series..but if you thoughtfully read through the first 2-3 threads.. you'll get a good understanding of the Augustinian, or Calvinist Predestinarian position. You'll also get an earful from various people who fail to understand the underlying foundation..that God IS Sovereign. But..I think that you'll find that Uriel1975 (now Orthodox Presbyterian) eloquently presents the case for the Orthodox Biblical doctrine of Predestination.

I know that the concept of Predestination is a "toughie" to grasp; but it IS well worth anyone's time to examine.

[Sam Cree]

Tolkien's works are so universal in nature

I like this phrase.

[fnord]

my take on the women of LOTR:

Arwen - very fetching but empty-headed (the extended DVD sures brings this out) Much more attractive than Galadriel, but her vacuous mind sure is a turn-off.

Galadriel - I thought she was supposed to be so beautiful as to bewitch a dwarf? Whoever plays her should learn the first secret to beauty: SMILE! The most descriptively beautiful woman in the book is a rather dowdy, plain woman in the movie. Am I the only one who sees it this way?

Eowyn - Very pretty, and strong (from the trailers). I think she is the most attractive woman in the movie so far.

Rosie Cotton - gorgeous to a fault. The only reason I would leave the Shire os to rescue the world ... for her.

OK, a shallow review to be sure.

[BradyLS]

There were rumors that Kate Winslet would play Galadriel. I'm not sure she would have been right for the part, but she would have been great to see anywhere in the movie.

I think Liv Tyler has the looks to play Arwen, but I was personally put off by the breathless delivery of her lines.

Cate Blanchett's Galadriel I liked better, but found the Ring-temptation scene a bit over the top for my taste. Positively Wagnerian at one point!

Fortunatley, we have two more films and added footage from all three films to round out their characters to look forward to.

[maquiladora]

Great article! Thanks for posting it.
It's October and were moving swiftly into that pre-release period ahead of The Two Towers. Anticipation is building, and I for one, cannot wait!

The Two Towers promises to be one of the most astonishing motion pictures we've ever seen.

[Corin Stormhands]

Here is a link to the first thread that OP posted in January of 2000.

Don't do it Sam! There be orcs and trolls over there!

BC, Sam's a friend of mine from The Hobbit Hole. I offer this warning as one who was chewed up and spit out in the Religion forum (yeah, I did a bit of my own as well). From my view, FR's Religion Forum is not the place for any serious study. If Sam really wants to understand Augustine and Calvin (and I believe he does), the religion forum is the last place I'd send him.

[LadyDoc]

A friend leaned over to my brother as the movie began and said: "Do you think any of these people know Hobbits are Calvinists?"

No, they like beer and parties, like the good Roman Catholic that invented them. :-)

[Princeliberty]

Arwen is not empty headed in Tolkien's writings.
Its Ms. Tyler who is empty headed and can even
do a good job of pretending to have mind.
The one bad mistake by Jackson.
He should have cast Ashley Laurence as Arwen.

[Renfield]

Last February, I visited New Zealand, and was priveleged to tour the site where the opening portion of the film was made; a sheep ranch near Matamata was the location for "Hobbiton". It was even more beautiful and bucolic than it appears in the film, although most of the set had been removed. The entrances to the hobbit-holes were still in the hillside, and the apple trees were still there, although the limbs had been browsed down to stubs by the sheep. Normally, the owners of the ranch wouldn't allow such visits, but a friend of a friend knew them, and arranged our excursion.
Here's a funny site related to the topic of LOTR, for those of you who haven't seen it: http://home.nyu.edu/~amw243/diaries/
(Calvinist, you are more prescient than you know, about suspecting the elves of appealing to "the cross-dressing set".........)