Elizabeth Smart Thread, 9/17/02 to ???

[Utah Girl]

Just thought I would start a new thread.

[Sherlock]

So? That still is NOT blaming Elizabeth for wanting to leave.

You wouldn't blame her for wanting to leave with someone that by you implication was an internet sexual predator. You wouldn't blame her for running off at 14 with a boyfriend. What kind of morals do you have and what kind of mother were you?

[Sherlock]

The earthly temples were a model of Jesus Christ, designed for the offering of blood sacrifices prior to the attonement for sin by the lamb of God who took away the sin of the world. The next temple will be built in Jerusalem and will be profaned midway through the 70th week of Daniel when he enters it and demands to be worshipped of God. There is no Chrisian temple on the earth today other than the members of the body of Christ. "Know ye not that ye are the temple of the Holy Ghost." We are living stones. The Mormon temples are a creation of man's mind and are quite simply an abomination to God. Sorry.

[Palladin]

Thank you, Utah Girl. I read every word. I must say that you have presented a masterful defense of your faith. Your parents can be proud of the kind of woman they have raised.

And Mark Twain couldn't have seen the same type of Mormon women we have seen in connection with this case. They are all slender and beautiful.

[Palladin]

Thank you for your kind remarks. I, for one, truly appreciate the magnificent research and tremendous work that have gone into the LDS Genealogy Site. I found one whole branch of extended family, numbering in the dozens, from my German grandfather's side of the family there. I had been searching for them for years. Then along came the internet, and the LDS site. Voila!

[Sherlock]

I heard a catholic bishop from sweden say that there were three things you should do to learn about another religion.

The only way to learn the truth and to learn about the nature of God, his plan of salvation, and his plan for your life, is to fellowship with Him and read the Holy Scriptures. I suggest you start with the book of John. The bible is so simple you have to have help to misunderstand it. Satan has been working though the millenia to deceive religious institutions and has been very effective. All of the Christian denominations were started by powerful men of God with revelation from God's word, but after their deaths the churches with their names have become houses of tradition that have totally forgotten the lives and beliefs of the men that founded them. Jesus said "Follow me", not a church. And the only way you can get to know Jesus and learn to follow him is to read the book, for he said "In the volume of the book if is written of me", from Genesis to Revelation. And he warned in Revelation that the man would be cursed that subtracted or added to the prophecies of that scripture.

[Sherlock]

Go to the Religion section to read all you ever wanted to know about Catholicism. This religion has staunch apologists, who start about 30 threads every day here on FR on every aspect of the Faith.

I don't think you'll find any discussion of the bible though.

[jo6pac]

The author of this tripe was a satanist/sodomist/pervert who with his witch-wife joined the LDS church by deception for evil reasons.

[Sherlock]

The next temple will be built in Jerusalem and will be profaned midway through the 70th week of Daniel when he enters it and demands to be worshipped of God.

Should read "demands to be worshipped as God". But the point is the same, God has no temple on the earth today other that we living temples, those that are washed in the blood of his dear son, and are saints. We that are believers are saints now but we will never be gods, but we will return with him and rule and reign with him on earth in the millenium.

[scaredkat]

HELLO HELLO HELLO

DID WE FORGET WHAT THIS FORUM IS FOR. DID SOME OF US GET SIDE TRACKED AND CANT FIND THEIR WAY BACK. DOES SOMEONE WANT TO START A FORUM TO DISGUSS WHAT ALL IS BEING DISCUSSED HERE AT THIS TIME?

DOES ANYONE REMEMBER ELIZABETH SMART.

[varina davis]

You wouldn't blame her for wanting to leave with someone that by you implication was an internet sexual predator. You wouldn't blame her for running off at 14 with a boyfriend. What kind of morals do you have and what kind of mother were you?

1. I never implied any such thing about Liz and the internet.

2.No, I wouldn't blame her for running off if she was desperate.

3. My morals are none of your business and my being a mother is present tense.

[varina davis]

DID WE FORGET WHAT THIS FORUM IS FOR.

Thank you, scaredkat. I'm sure there is a thread for religion, and this isn't it.

[gdc61]

except for sympathy and sadness ,this thread is an excersize in futility ......with all due respect for there families you all need to get a life and a new thread topic !

[Sherlock]

The next temple will be built in Jerusalem and will be profaned midway through the 70th week of Daniel when he enters it and demands to be worshipped of God.

By the way, the he here is the Prince of the people that shall come. The 'people that shall come' is a prophecy of the Roman empire, the 4th major world empire, written by Daniel in appr. 516 BC. John in Revelation describes the 10 horns in Daniel's vision as 10 nations that will rise up in the last days out of this world empire. Obviously there is a time gap here, just as when Jesus read from Isaiah and stopped at a comma when he said "The spirit of Lord is upon me, ... to preach the acceptable year of the Lord," and he closed the book and said "This day is this scripture fullfilled in your ears". But in Isaiah 61:2 it says "To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God..". There has been a 2000 year delay in this comma. There are several of these commas in bible prophecy.

[Sherlock]

HELLO HELLO HELLO DID WE FORGET WHAT THIS FORUM IS FOR. DID SOME OF US GET SIDE TRACKED AND CANT FIND THEIR WAY BACK. DOES SOMEONE WANT TO START A FORUM TO DISGUSS WHAT ALL IS BEING DISCUSSED HERE AT THIS TIME? DOES ANYONE REMEMBER ELIZABETH SMART.

"When they heard these things they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with their teeth. Then they cried out with a loud voice and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord. And cast him out of the city, and stoned him." At least you people don't get that hostile.

[TheDon]

Hey, I resemble that remark.

[sandude]

Your lies are so transparent that it is hardly worth a comment. You aren't fooling anybody with your little charade so why don't you just go back to the hole you crawled out of.

[Devil_Anse]

Where do you get your info that Ashely Pond had sex so many times?

I read up on the case on True Crime news, Cybersleuths crime news, and Mrs. Brady's URLs. News articles on those sites gave an account of Ashley having lived with Ward Weaver for months, and having had a "relationship" with him which included his using her for sex. This "relationship" was so intense at times that one of Weaver's adult girlfriends or former girlfriends actually became jealous of young Ashley. Ashley also reportedly had been used by her own father, and I think by some other scumbags who passed through her life. OF COURSE, NONE OF IT WAS A REAL RELATIONSHIP, IT WAS ALL ABUSE OF A LITTLE GIRL. And I guess one could say that it wasn't "having sex." Even if the young girl consented in the conventional sense of the word, of course she was not of an age or maturity level to ever really consent to such a thing. It was all victimization, and in that sense, maybe it shouldn't even be called "having sex."

The point I was trying to make was, no matter what horrible experiences young Ashley had been put through, no matter how much she was forced into an adult "relationship" a good 10 yrs b/f she'd be ready for it, she was in no way, not even one tiny bit, to blame for anything that happened to her, especially of course her murder by that monster.

As for the views you expressed here on Elizabeth, I agree.

[Devil_Anse]

Palladin, you are too smart to not know that those things I listed were not questions from me. I already know they are untrue. Catholicism, and religion in general, as well as atheism, are all marginally relevant to this discussion if people here go back and forth about whether a faith should be questioned, or whether it should be followed without questioning. And behind some of these allegations (maybe not your allegations) about church-sponsored wrongdoing, I think there is a desire to discredit religious institutions which have taken unpopular stances on certain political issues such as abortion and family life.

I think you once implied that you had attended Catholic schools. If you did attend Catholic schools, then you know: Catholic schools include Religion class as part of the curriculum, day in and day out, every single grade. Here's how it went in mine, and I think this is typical: We were taught every possible detail of our religion, year after year, going through sacraments, sin, morality, the Mass, and every other aspect of the beliefs one must have to truthfully call himself a Catholic. By about 10th grade, we'd had a good foundation in the religion. Then we spent a year being taught about the Dead Sea Scrolls, the overlap between Hebrew ways and the origins of Christianity, and I recall excruciatingly detailed discussions of the word Yahweh, and Qumran, and the relation of the words to the meaning. Then the next year our teacher began surveying the principal religions of the world. Of course, being a survey, there was only so much detail that could be gotten.

Then our teacher branched out into a survey of philosophy, again just touching on things, but giving us the resources to look at them in more detail if we wanted. He talked about many of the major philosophers, and some modern ones, comparing their views of morality. Of course we had earlier had the ideas of free will and determinism at least touched on.

The high school religion classes went far beyond just the teachings of our own church. They taught people to question things, and fostered a certain skepticism at times.

That is where I think, ironically, Catholic education has actually almost done too good a job. There is this emphasis on learning to reason it all out through whatever means your mind allows you. Some people lose faith at this point, it's almost like knowing too much.

When this skepticism is used by a member of Religion A to
continually attempt to undermine the beliefs of a practitioner of Religion B, I don't see the purpose of it. If no one is forcing the LDS religion down a person's throat, then why is it necessary to continue to question that religion's motives or beliefs? If one feels suspicion and skepticism as to the religion's motives, practices, and beliefs, then that person should just reject the religion and move on--not try to undermine the good that the religion may be doing for someone else.

As Scaredkat says, back to Elizabeth Smart. This post was too long, but I just wanted to say why I am just not interested in hearing every detail of every alleged scandal of the Mormon church--some of which are surely only internet conspiracy theories. If it ever turns out that someone was using so-called religious practices as an excuse to do something illegal to Elizabeth, then I will be right there, ready to discuss it. But right now that idea seems as farfetched as the idea of the international slave rings.

[jo6pac]

How special.