Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.
In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:
Our discussion has been light:
It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog
However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB
Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr
Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog
Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB
Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed
To the very philosophical:
…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla
To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…
…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB
Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog
…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1
Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed
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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom
…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253
Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed
So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.
I think it is... it's the song they're playing on the radio now, anyway!
Someone at TORN has reported where you can download the 16 minute video. The clip itself is 30 MB. It played fine for me in Windows Media Player, but TORN says you might need DivX to play. I would recommend saving it to disk and then watching it, otherwise internet traffic might cause hiccups or slowdowns while watching it.
Well, let me qualify my recommendation by saying that I haven't heard the entire CD. But, I like three of the songs on the CD ("Drive", "Where Were You", and "Work in Progress") so, it seems like a good bet to me!
Heh, recommendation by sampling...
Eä! Let these things Be!
Enjoy! And have a good night! :)
Which of us is the eldest TooK? Or are we Ents?
3-14-1941
I have finally managed to put up an image gallery of stuff I have collected in my travels over the internet. It's not much to look at yet, and not linked in to the rest of the site (such as it is) but you may be interested anyway. There are a lot of publicity photos (some great portraits), paintings by Lee-Howe-Naismith, and such. If I had more time, I would make it look pretty like the screencaps pages, and maybe sort them into some semblance of order. Maybe eventually.
A few pieces of artwork that I think would be great visual imagery if conveyed accurately to film:
But there is one image that I think would be way too scary (accurate, but scary) for even the most hearty and stout among us to see on film:
In my opinion we are robbing ourselves of a much deeper enjoyment of the world of Middle-Earth if we don’t tackle TS and conquer it. It is in TS that we learn of the creation of Middle-Earth and the powers that inhabit it. These stories serve as the canvas on which JRRT painted TH and LoTR.
Ok, enough of the introductory remarks, on to The Silmarillion. TS is divided into five main sections. The first is “The Ainulindale” which is the account of the creation of Middle-Earth by Iluvatar with the assistance of the Ainur (or Valar). The second section is “The Valaquenta” where we are introduced to the players that helped shape Middle-Earth, i.e. the Valar, the Maiar, and the Enemies. The third, and longest, section is the “Quenta Silmarillion”. This recounts in greater detail the creation of Middle-Earth, the introduction of the Children of Iluvatar (Elves and Men), and the making and destruction of The Silmarils. The fourth section is the “Akallabeth” which is the account of the downfall of Numenor. The fifth, and final, section is “Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age”. This last section is self-explanatory.
Let’s begin our journey through The Silmarillion
The Ainulindale
The account of creation as told by Rumil of Tirion
Tolkien took great pains to communicate that LoTR was not an allegory, Christian or otherwise. The great themes of Christianity are present in LoTR, but the specifics are missing. This changes a bit in “The Ainulindale”.
”The Ainulindale” begins with the statement:
There was Eru, the One, who in Arda is called Iluvatar….
One can’t help but be reminded of Genesis 1:1, which says, “In the beginning God….” In Tolkien’s world, Iluvatar is the self-existent Creator God. Iluvatar begins his creation with the creation of the Ainur, who are later called the Valar. Tolkien translates Ainur to mean “Holy Ones”.
Iluvatar makes his creation through music. He begins a theme and each of the Ainur is given a part of their own to weave into the theme begun by Iluvatar. All of the Ainur marveled at the music of the creation, all but one. That one was named Melkor.
Melkor desired to make his own creation, and to have creatures worship him. So Melkor began making his own theme, which he weaved into Iluvatar’s theme, causing discord in the music of creation. Iluvatar eventually stopped Melkor by causing the music to cease. Iluvatar told Melkor, and the assembled Ainur, that:
…thou, Melkor, shalt see that no theme may be played that hath not its uttermost source in me, nor can any alter the music in my despite. For he that attempteth this shall prove but mine instrument in the devising of things more wonderful, which he himself hath not imagined.
Nothing can be done that Iluvatar does not know about and will use for his own glory.
Iluvatar then shows the Ainur what their music has created. He shows the Ainur in a vision how Middle-Earth will run its course. Iluvatar stops the vision before its consummation so the Ainur do not know what occurs after the Third Age.
The Ainur are so enthralled that a number of them want to live on Middle-Earth. Iluvatar creates Middle-Earth, just as he had shown the Ainur earlier. Some of them go to live on Middle-Earth to help create and shape the planet, on the condition that they cannot return to Iluvatar until the ages of Middle-Earth are complete.
We are then treated to an account of the Ainur attempting to create upon the earth the land and sea areas. Every thing the Ainur attempt to create, Melkor destroys. Through this process Middle-Earth receives its final shape.
In “The Ainulindale” we catch a glimpse of some of Tolkien’s theology. He believes that everything that happens is part of God’s plan for Mankind and the earth. Sometimes it is good, sometimes it is bad, but ultimately God’s plan is carried out.
and ones that we can’t even nibble at without getting sick to our stomachs on the other
I think the Silmarillion rocks!
Also, in the LoTR theology, not all has been revealed. Even the Valar do not know all of Illuvatar's mind- especially regarding the fate of Men and Middle-Earth. It is a source of subtle and sorrowful tension/anxiety throughout the stories. Poor Men. Death may indeed be a gift from Illuvatar, but the mystery surrounding what happens to their souls made it so easy for Melkor to turn it into a dark and fearsome thing.
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