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The New Hobbit Hole

Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog

Welcome to The New Hobbit Hole

Concerning Hobbits

The New Hobbit Chronicles

This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.

In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:

Our discussion has been light:

It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog

However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB

Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr

Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog

Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB

Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed

To the very philosophical:

…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla

To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…

…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB

Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog

…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1

Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed

-----------------------------------------

Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom

…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253

Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed

So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.


TOPICS: Books/Literature; Chit/Chat; Poetry; TV/Movies; The Hobbit Hole
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To: Overtaxed
I wonder where LCS is. Good snag.
26,801 posted on 09/23/2002 5:10:57 AM PDT by Sam Cree
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To: Sam Cree
Hehehe....I guess the dwarves are sleeping in this morning.

Haven't heard from LCS in a while.
26,802 posted on 09/23/2002 5:14:03 AM PDT by Overtaxed
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To: Sam Cree
Maybe LCS is having technical problems. His last post was on Sept. 12.
26,803 posted on 09/23/2002 5:15:27 AM PDT by Overtaxed
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To: Overtaxed
Smeagol got a new computer, a new desk, and a new chair this weekend! Smeagol is soooooo happy! Now, Smeagol can chat over the weekend.
26,804 posted on 09/23/2002 5:36:25 AM PDT by carton253
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To: Overtaxed
Rats...I was getting caught up on e-mail and I missed the precious!
26,805 posted on 09/23/2002 5:41:17 AM PDT by RosieCotton
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To: Overtaxed; HairOfTheDog; Sam Cree; rightwingreligiousfanatic; All
Fun party last night! I'm glad I came, even if I was late. I had an interesting day yesterday...more car issues (hopefully resolved) and dog issues and such.
26,806 posted on 09/23/2002 5:43:14 AM PDT by RosieCotton
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To: RosieCotton
Yes, it was nice
26,807 posted on 09/23/2002 5:57:26 AM PDT by Sam Cree
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To: Overtaxed
Shameless sneakle attack......
26,808 posted on 09/23/2002 5:57:43 AM PDT by ksen
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To: carton253
Now, Smeagol can chat over the weekend.

Congrats! But Smeagol missed the party last night.

26,809 posted on 09/23/2002 6:00:57 AM PDT by Overtaxed
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To: ksen
Gondor has no shame. Gondor needs no shame.....wait a minute...I'm not from Gondor!
26,810 posted on 09/23/2002 6:02:03 AM PDT by Overtaxed
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To: Overtaxed; ksen; RosieCotton; HairOfTheDog; All
Morning All!

That was a blast last night, kind of like a Mystery Science Theater 2000 experience. Sorry I couldn't stay till the end. If you had started on time... [/dwarf legalism];^)

26,811 posted on 09/23/2002 6:34:25 AM PDT by rightwingreligiousfanatic
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To: rightwingreligiousfanatic; All
If you had started on time...

But then I would have missed more than I did...so it did benefit some of us! < /selfish >

The movie went by sooo fast! It usually does, but even more so this time. Got to Boromir's bullying scene and I suddenly realized we only had a few more minutes to go.

I did more Boromir bashing than elf bashing, I think. Is that good or bad?

26,812 posted on 09/23/2002 6:41:41 AM PDT by RosieCotton
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To: RosieCotton
We have to talk. I need to flesh out my philosophy about Boromir a little bit more in my own mind, but I don't think he is worthy of the cheap shots you all were giving him last night. To me he is a semi-tragic figure to be pitied more than excoriated. And ultimately he made basically good choices and repented of his bad ones. He's a more complex character than you were giving him credit for last night. I think I am sympathetic toward him because I see some of the same type of weakness in myself. Lots more to be said about this.....
26,813 posted on 09/23/2002 6:48:18 AM PDT by rightwingreligiousfanatic
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To: Overtaxed; All
Gondor needs no shame.....wait a minute...I'm not from Gondor!

What a shame...

Morning All!

26,814 posted on 09/23/2002 6:51:18 AM PDT by Corin Stormhands
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To: HairOfTheDog; 2Jedismom; ecurbh; ksen; Overtaxed; JenB
Thanks very much, h.o.t.dog! We has some fun. Matt and I being the only real seafod lovers in our family, it's become traditional that we go out for seafood feasting together, then return for the little family party.

But (of interest to this thread) can you possibly guess what my parents-in-law gave me for my birthday? I was bowled over. They gave me...

GLAMDRING!

Now... where to put it...?

Dan

26,815 posted on 09/23/2002 6:52:51 AM PDT by BibChr
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To: BibChr
Now... where to put it...?

In the belly of an orc?

26,816 posted on 09/23/2002 7:00:03 AM PDT by ksen
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To: RosieCotton
I did more Boromir bashing than elf bashing, I think. Is that good or bad?

Definitely bad.....

26,817 posted on 09/23/2002 7:00:52 AM PDT by ksen
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To: rightwingreligiousfanatic
but I don't think he is worthy of the cheap shots you all were giving him last night

Yeah, really! Poor Boromir is caught up in something he doesn't understand and is just struggling trying to do the right thing for Gondor. Plus he has this ring thing attacking him and he doesn't even realized he's fighting that battle until after the bully scene. At least he doesn't turn traitor like Saruman or give up altogether like Denethor.

Boromir-bashers probably like shoving people off of cliffs!

26,818 posted on 09/23/2002 7:02:57 AM PDT by Overtaxed
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To: rightwingreligiousfanatic
You DO realize that most of our bashing is "just a bit of fun", right? ;-)

Here's my take on Boromir, from a more serious standpoint: he's an essentially good character, but also one of the most flawed characters. (I'm going to mix book and movie impressions here, please forgive me!) He is impetuous and hard-headed, very confident in himself (too much so at times). He loves his family and country above all and is really sincere in his desire to restore the glory of Gondor. Trouble is, where he SHOULD be listening to Aragorn (his true king, I might add) and others who might be considered his elders, he blunders along doing what HE thinks best. Doesn't stop to think that the end doesn't necessarily justify the means.

26,819 posted on 09/23/2002 7:03:21 AM PDT by RosieCotton
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To: rightwingreligiousfanatic
Hullo! - Good morning!

Oh Vim, there has been a lot said about Boromir! And yes, even though I am the lead Boromir basher... I know there is a lot more to him than that... - In the days of the original thread, and the early days of this one, we all went round and round about Boromir... The mention of Boromir's name was enough to start it all over again.... up in the main post of this thread is an exerpt from it, maybe everyone will want to hash him out again!

.....

To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters… (the post numbers are reference to the first thread)

…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB

Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog

…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1

Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed


26,820 posted on 09/23/2002 7:05:17 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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