Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
This is a continuation of the infamous thread New Zealander Builds Hobbit Hole originally posted on January 26, 2001 by John Farson, who at the time undoubtedly thought he had found a rather obscure article that would elicit a few replies and die out. Without knowing it, he became the founder of the Hobbit Hole. For reasons incomprehensible to some, the thread grew to over 4100 replies. It became the place for hobbits and friends of hobbits to chit chat and share LoTR news and views, hang out, and talk amongst ourselves in the comfort of familiar surroundings.
In keeping with the new posting guidelines, the thread idea is continuing here, as will the Green Dragon Inn, our more structured spin-off thread, as soon as we figure out how to move all the good discussion that has been had there. As for the Hobbit Hole, we will just start fresh, bringing only a few mathoms such as the picture above with us to make it feel like home, and perhaps a walk down memory lane:
Our discussion has been light:
It very well may be that a thread named "New Zealander builds Hobbit hole" will end up being the longest Tolkien thread of them all, with some of the best heartfelt content... Sorry John, but I would have rather it had been one with a more distinguished title!… post 252 - HairOfTheDog
However, I can still celebrate, with quiet dignity, the fact that what started as a laugh about some wacko in New Zealand has mutated and grown into a multifaceted discussion of the art, literature, and philosophy that is Tolkien. And now that I've managed to write the most pompous sentence of my entire life, I agree, Rosie… post 506 - JenB
Hah! I was number 1000!! (Elvish victory dance... wait, no; that would be too flitty) … post 1001 - BibChr
Real men don't have to be afraid of being flitty! Go for it. – post 1011 – HairOfTheDog
Seventeen years to research one mystical object seems a bit excessive… post 1007 - JenB
Okay...who's the wise guy who didn't renew Gandalf's research grant?… post 1024 – Overtaxed
To the very philosophical:
…Judas Iscariot obviously was a good man, or he wouldn't have been chosen to be one of the Apostles. He loved Jesus, like all of the Apostles, but he betrayed him. Yet without his betrayal, the Passion and Crucifixion would never have occurred, and mankind would not have been redeemed. So without his self-destruction infinite good would not have been accomplished. I certainly do not mean this to be irreverant but it seems to me that this describes the character of Gollum, in the scenes so movingly portrayed above… Lucius Cornelius Sulla
To fun but heartfelt debates about the integrity and worth of some of the characters…
…Anyone else notice how Boromir treats the hobbits? He's very fond of them but he seems to think of them as children - ruffling Frodo's hair, calls them all 'little ones'. He likes them, but I don't think he really respects them… post 1536 - JenB
Yes... Tolkien told us not to trust Boromir right off the bat when he began to laugh at Bilbo, until he realized that the Council obviously held this hobbit in high esteem. What a pompous dolt… post 1538 - HairOfTheDog
…I think almost every fault of his can be traced directly back to his blindness to anything spiritual or unseen. He considers the halflings as children, because that is what they look like. He considers the only hope of the ring to be in taking it and using it for a victory in the physical realm. He cannot see what the hobbits are truly made of, he cannot see the unseen hope of what the destruction of the ring might mean--the destruction of Sauron himself, and he cannot see the unseen danger that lies in the use of the ring itself… I just feel sorry for Boromir--he is like a blind but honorable man, trying to take the right path on the road but missing the right path entirely because he simply cannot see it… post 1548 - Penny1
Boromir isn't a jerk, he's a jock… post 2401 – Overtaxed
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Oh, I think by the time Frodo reaches the Cracks, he's not even himself anymore! I think he's not only on the brink of a dangerous place physically, he's on the brink of losing himself completely during the exchange with Gollum. But for some reason, the take-over isn't complete till he actually has to throw the Ring in. The person speaking to Gollum is not Frodo, but the "Wheel of Fire" that Sam sees. After the Ring is destroyed, Frodo not only comes back to himself, but comes back with the unbearable (to him) knowledge of what it's like to be completely without compassion. I think that's why it's so important to him to be compassionate in the Shire… post 2506 - 2Jedismom
…Regarding Frodo's compassion... it's a little too much at the end. Even Merry tells him that he's going to have to quit being so darn nice. But you're right. He's learned a lesson about evil that very few ever learn since it wasn't an external lesson but an internal one. (Those kinds of lessons have the greatest impact) Not only did he totally succumb to it, but he was rather ruthless to my little Smeagol… post 2516 - carton253
Well that Frodo was a big mean bully! (to Smeagol)… post 2519 – Overtaxed
So as you can see, everything JRR Tolkien (and Peter Jackson) is welcome here in our New Row, our soon-to-be familiar New Hobbit Hole…; philosophy, opinion, good talk and frequent silliness.
The boat looked great. I say this because I saw the musical Titanic on Broadway. That boat looked fake!
I was thinking more along the lines of short, creepy, and dead. 
Now stay tuned.... In a little bit I will be releasing what I have learned of the history of Threadkiller in the Hole, who I have recently discovered is my Great Uncle, and has ties to others of us here as well. Makes for some interesting reading....
Sweeney Todd is a musical by Stephen Sondheim. Sweeney is a barber who kills his patrons. Mrs Lovett, the downstairs neighbor who owns a meat pie shop, uses the dead bodies to make her meat pies. It is a great musical. I think it was done in 1979. Victor Garber was in this.
The guy who built the real Titanic (his name escapes me) was portrayed in the movie by Victor Garber.
And in Titanic, Victor played Mr. Andrews. (It was going to bother me until I looked it up, so I did. Now I can sleep tonight)
We saw it there too. We loved it. Of course the boat looked fake, but it was a musical. Other than "Nearer My God to Thee," I don't think there was that much singing on the "real" boat.
My son's middle school actually did Titanic a couple of years ago (they shouldn't have). But he was part of the tech crew and got to sink the ship...
I've been to alot of local productions of musicals that they really shouldn't have either... ACK!
Another great one. I've not seen it on stage, but I've seen the video of the stage production with Angela Lansbury and Len Cariou. Who was Garber?
I vaguely remembered my grandmother mentioning the name Threadkiller once in a story she told me many years ago. And when it was (forcefully) brought to my attention again recently by a Beorning of imposing countenance, my genealogical impulses were quickened within me and I decided it was time to dig into the musty old pile of documents left to me by my grandmother, Goma Copperhelm. They have been quietly gathering dust in a far corner of my storage cave, and it was kind of like “rediscovering them for the first time” so to speak. So far, I’ve been able to piece together the following facts: 1) Threadkiller was not his original birthname, but rather a given name as the result of an unusual and unfortunate encounter which will be described later. 2) His original birthname was Gordin Copperhelm. 3) His parents were Torkil Copperhelm and Tanquil (Stormfoot)Copperhelm (my great grandparents on my mother’s side !) and 4) Gordin/Threadkiller single handedly destroyed one of the greatest threats faced by Middle Earth. Interested? Read on….
After an apparently normal and unremarkable childhood (not much info to go on here) the young Gordin was apprenticed to his Uncle Grimshod Stormfoot’s foundry where he learned well the fine art of forging blades for axes and swords. Since the Troll wars were well in progress, his work was in much demand and his reputation grew. Still very young and in the prime of his life, Gordin wanted to go himself to the wars to wield the mighty axes and swords he was forging. And he would have done so, but for having to take over the ownership and management of the foundry owing to an accident involving poor Grimshod. Grimshod came to a sudden and untimely end while walking his faithful mule, Anvil, down a narrow path near a cliff at the entrance of his home. Apparently, Anvil stubbornly refused to step over a scorpion in the path, and Grimshod stomped on the offending arachnid with a touch too much vigor, causing the entire portion of the path both he and Anvil were standing on to cave in and avalanche down the steep rocky mountain. Both lives were lost and buried beneath tons of rubble (this is the place now called Grimshod’s Gulley). As you can see, he was not named Stormfoot for nothing.
And so Gordin became the master of the foundry and could not be spared for the Troll wars, for now his skills were much too valuable to risk losing in battle. For the wars were fierce and the casualties high. And Gordin was able to hone his skills to the highest level of the craft then known in those parts. (Now, remember that this Gordin of whom we are learning is none other than Threadkiller, my grandmother’s brother. He attains that appellation later in the story, so bear with me….) His swords, axes, and armor were much in demand, for it was said that a Gordin blade retained it’s sharp edge longer than any other then known. And he forged an axe with all his skill from the last remaining piece of steel inherited from Grimshod made from the mystical ore mined from the Eerf Cilbuper mountains, and this axe he retained for himself, having a sense that some special need would call for it’s use. And this Axe he named G’nad the Magnificent.
It came to pass that, as the Troll wars were winding down, a new evil presence was felt in Middle Earth. An evil sorcerer, one of Melkor’s fell creations awakened from the dim past, began to move in the land. And this presence became known as the Eessennet Nacilbuper, (because he arose from the Eerf Cilbuper mountains), a humorless chump with a giant chip on his shoulder, hideous in appearance, and oozing foul smelling bilious liquid from his pores as he moved about the land. And anything that was touched by the acidic bile was utterly wasted and destroyed. If it fell on living plants, they withered and evaporated. But if it fell on living animals, they did not die, but writhed in agony as the bile burned all the hair off their bodies and colored their remaining skin greenish-purple, and no hair would ever grow again yet they retained their life. And if it fell on the earth, it was utterly scorched and hardened like unto rock..
Now it was determined by a learned council led by the Most Wise Godehtforiah, and including Dexatrevo, Nottoceisor, Noric Stormhands, Nesk, notracIIIVII, and Allussuilenrocsuicul that the only thing that could kill this evil menace (the Eessennet Nacilbuper) was a blade forged from ore mined in the very mountains from which it emanated. And thus it was that Gordin took up the great axe G’nad and set forth to the region of the Eerf Cilbuper to hunt the foul creature down.
In time, and through many wanderings, Gordin came upon the valley of Eloh Tibboh Wen, and chanced to see Eessennet Nacilbuper in this secret, special place. Now the valley of Eloh Tibboh Wen was imbued with special magic from the earliest days of the Valar, and the Eessennet Nacilbuper had no strength for the fight in that place and was easily defeated. Gordin was able to walk directly up to him and with one mighty blow from G’nad, chop off the offensive head of the Eessennet Nacilbuper. But though the foul creature had no strength to fight in that place, he still retained the noxious bile that now spilled out from his body and onto Gordin. And Gordin’s body absorbed all of the liquid, such that all of his armor, all of his clothing, and all of his hair was burned off and consumed. And Gordin’s skin was turned purplish green, and any clothes or armor he tried to wear ever after began melting and evaporating from his body in a few hours time, such that he could not wear anything made of threads, or of leather, or even of armor. And so he became known as Threadkiller, because any type of clothing (threads) he tried to wear was destroyed whenever he tried to wear them, and he was unable to wear anything.
And Threadkiller made his home in the lovely Eloh Tibboh Wen, carving out a lovely cave for himself, and he avoided all contact with others, and they tended to avoid him as well, due to fear of getting too close to him that some of the noxiousness might rub off on them, and for fear of the ugliness of his appearance. But he was happy in the knowledge that he had destroyed a great evil from Middle Earth, and rejoiced in the beauty and peace of Eloh Tibboh Wen, which contained all that he needed for sustenance. And his sister, Goma Copperhelm, came to visit him often and brought him news of the outside world and comforted him. And thus she learned the story of how Gordin her brother became Threadkiller. And it is said to this day, that if you travel in the region of Eloh Tibboh Wen, you will find many strange and beautiful sculptures made of stone, depicting all manner of creature and person. And a gentle feeling of peace and tranquility comes to all who visit that place. No one knows what happened to the mighty axe G’nad the Magnificent, but some say it will be used again one day in the Final Battle….
Sorry for the long post, all…but I felt it was important. Have a great day! I have more…uh…research to do now….
Good name for an axe...
Bravo brother Vim, well told... you and I need to have much beer and red meat off the bone together...
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