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The New Hobbit Hole
Posted on 03/14/2002 5:07:26 AM PST by HairOfTheDog
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To: HairOfTheDog
As for drunkenness, another interesting element is that in the movie Bilbo certainly seems tipsy when he gives his party speech. Don't think that's overt in the text, but also don't think JRRT would object.
To: Wordsmith
Don't think it necessarily implies that pipe weed is intoxicating. Like you, I'd say it tells us more about Saruman. Fits his character. It's a slur against hobbits, and against Gandalf for "slumming" with them. And it's also typical of the self-justification of the deceiver/deceived. After all, Saruman the breeder of Uruk Hai is hardly one to lecture on "purity." I agree... It speaks to Saruman's sarcasm and twisted thought more than it does anything about hobbits or Gandalf or Pipe-weed... Good angle!
To: HairOfTheDog
Sure, I know what was in those pints. They drink and even feel it, like when they were visiting with Goldberry and
The drink in their drinking-bowls seemed to be clear cold water, yet it went to their hearts like wine and set free their voices. The guests became suddenly aware that they were singing merrily, as if it was easier and more natural than talking.
I just don't want them to make fools out of Merry and Pippin...and falling-over drunk isn't funny.
I'm not that flapped over it. Not any more flapped than when that woman says "OH WOW" when M and P set off that firework dragon.
To: 2Jedismom
Oh - I think they will still be cute... They won't make fools of them! - I trust that.
To: 2Jedismom
And I think you are fun when you're flapped ;~D
hehehehe - Oh Wow!
To: HairOfTheDog
And Tolkien
did enclude even "falling-down" drunkeness into his story, after the LEP...but in a very dignified way, imo...he didn't glorify it...he just stated it as a matter of fact.
About midnight carriages came for the important folk. One by one they rolled away, filled with full but very unsatisfied hobbits. Gardeners came by arrangement, and removed in wheel-barrows those that had inadvertently remained behind. Night slowly passed. The sun rose. The hobbits rose rather later.
The drunk hobbit at the keg didn't bother me in the least...just what I expected from the description Tolkien gave. The Saruman/Gandalf exchange just seemed a bit too far off what Tolkien would have said. But it is just my opinion.
I know you'll be right about M and P...but I'm awfully fond of them, you know!
To: HairOfTheDog
No...not flapped here though! Bothers me like a little gnat (which I pronounce guh-nat, btw). The "Oh Wow" thing just makes me roll my eyes and think "Gimme a break."
To: 2Jedismom
To be honest... I didn't even notice the inappropriateness of Oh Wow! Until you mentioned it some time ago...
It didn't even occur to me that this was a very modern expression. Surprised exclamations beginning with OH! WWAAA! seem very natural to me. I chuckle now thinking of you when I see it.
To: 2Jedismom; HairOfTheDog
We just need to get tobacco and alcohol classified as "lifestyle" drugs. :)
To: 2Jedismom
The line's not in the book. It's a stupid drug reference Yes, but actually it's not as bad an addition as you think. In Unfinished Tales there's a bit about how Saruman started smoking to emulate Gandalf - he had a serious envy problem - but did not admit it because he had at other times criticized Gandalf for the habit. So, Saruman's a hypocrite and a liberal, but he's not accusing Gandalf of being a druggie, and Jackson actually kept to the spirit of things!
Hi all, here briefly. The next I'm really available for a joint viewing is probably the weekend of the 17th. If anyone's up for it, either night should work for me!
17,250
posted on
08/07/2002 12:07:38 PM PDT
by
JenB
To: Overtaxed
I don't even know what that means OT!
To: JenB
Consider it scheduled!
At your convenience!
To: Overtaxed
"I've been thinking that maybe the mass-media phenomenon might have something to do with that attitude. "
Aside from the fact that all of those 60's people are the "establishment" these days, and therefore, running most everything.
To: JenB
In Unfinished Tales...
I have GOT to get this!!
To: Wordsmith
"As for drunkenness, another interesting element is that in the movie Bilbo certainly seems tipsy when he gives his party speech. Don't think that's overt in the text, but also don't think JRRT would object."
Yeah, I was just at a large wedding that really amounted to a family reunion. Quite a few tipsy speeches were given, including one by me, though I worked hard not to get out of hand before my toast. The Bilbo party scene really speaks to me.
To: HairOfTheDog
Drugs like Viagra.
To: Overtaxed
Oh dear... I am still lost... Is "lifestyle drug" a new term I just haven't noticed?
To: JenB
I just ordered The Book of Lost Tales from the library...whoever has it doesn't have to check it back in till the 13th, then it usually takes them a couple of days to get it to the library I requested it sent to...I guess it'll be 8-10 days till I get it.
To: 2Jedismom
Lost Tales is a little hard to read - it's the very very first edition of the myths. Unfinished Tales is much easier, everything was mostly settled by then and it has some hobbit stuff.
Bye for now! Have a good afternoon!
17,259
posted on
08/07/2002 12:25:58 PM PDT
by
JenB
To: JenB
Oh Crud bucket! I ordered the wrong one!
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