Posted on 02/12/2025 4:26:51 AM PST by Phoenix8
Soooo, big oil got the Aztecs too!
Probably not just one bug, as someone pointed out above, lots of critters arrived. And in the millennia before microbiology, two-way transmission of diseases were just part of saying hello. :^)
It is unlikely that it was salmonella, it does not cause the symptoms described https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocoliztli_epidemics and has too low a mortality rate.
Typhi is transmitted through the fecal-oral route, usually by contaminated water or food. The incubation period of typhoid fever is typically 6–30 days. Untreated, it has a mortality rate of 12%–30%
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6920a2.htm
Around 2000 my late husband and I decided to sell 20 acres he inherited in southern Illinois and buy rural land on WV closer to home. The land we bought cost around $5,000 an acre. but we did a Starker exchange for $500 in legal expenses, but saved paying IRS capital gains tax on the land sold and applied the sale money directly into the WV land purchase. The land had a small lake at the bottom of a large wooded hill. Not much open flat land for growing crops. Starker exchange is an IRS method for exchanging land for land or building for building. The new “business property” must cost more than the old property, you must use a lawyer. and complete the exchange within six months.
Regarding the illness, it sounds like possibly Hanta or some other hemoraghic (sp?) fever type illness. If Salmonella, drought conditions would have made water safety issues more likely. I imagine smallpox and these other possibilities and others not mentioned probably all played an ugly part. By the mid 1500s Cortez’s conquest was well over, and many more Spaniards and Europeans would have arrived with their various illnesses. Also, by this time Syphilis had been carried back to Europe for all the people having fun there. I saw a news report the other day we now have an Ebola case in the US.
Bingo! Collectively, we have forgotten how dangerous a lot of injuries and sicknesses are without modern medical care. Before antibiotics or even sulfa drugs, a lot of our more common diseases, pneumonia, would kill even young healthy people. There was a guy who had a website called WSHTF. It detailed his experiences and lessons learned while he survived the break-up of Yugoslavia. He was an EMT prior to the civil war. He mentioned numerous times how many people died of infection because they did not have access to common antibiotic creams like bacitracin.
Ahhh it just clicked in my head when I started reading that wiki article.
hantavirus IS a Hemorrhagic fever so that would explain the buboes and bleeding from the orifices as well as easy transmission if it mutated just a little. As MeanTexan pointed out it’s natural in the region.
And to Justa on how certain conditions make humans more ripe for epidemics. There is also some theories how epidemics can make humans more fit…in the long term.
One theory is the Black Death strengthened Europeans by basically culling the weak. Research shows most who survived it had more education, property and wealth (all signs of intelligence). Of course weak individuals are more likely to die from any disease. Several seemingly unrelated factors seem to back this theory up:
1. military might/mongols. They had been unstoppable but after the last few big outbreaks of bubonic plague Europe repelled them and Russia even started conquering the hordes.
2. The Renaissance. Began almost immediately after the big waves.
3. Expansion. Europeans started conquering well…everyone everywhere.
4. Reformation (religious and political systems) began not long after
Etc.
Some like James Burke explained it in his excellent TV series “Connections” in these elaborate connected series of events. Such as: mass deaths caused wealth to be concentrated into fewer hands, enabled more spending which stimulated the economy leading to lassie faire trading which promoted democratic principles, millions of dead also left their clothes which had to be used ..somehow. So they naturally thought of making paper with it which led to the printing machine which led to universities which led…Ummm whew , get it?
OR As Occam’s Razor would direct the simplest explanation is almost always right: The Black Death culled Europe’s population leaving the survivors smarter, tougher and more expansionist. Which by the way said effects seems to have ran out of steam looking at Europe today.
https://search.brave.com/search?q=hemorrhagic+symptoms+of+spanish+lady+influenza&summary=1
Hemorrhagic Symptoms of Spanish Flu
The Spanish flu, also known as the Spanish lady influenza, was characterized by severe hemorrhagic symptoms. These included spontaneous nose and mouth bleeds, as well as bleeding from the ears and petechial hemorrhages in the skin.
Additionally, patients often experienced hemorrhagic gastroenteritis, swelling of the liver and kidneys, and splenitis (inflammation of the spleen).
The hemorrhagic symptoms were often a result of the virus causing extensive pneumonia in both lungs, leading to pulmonary consolidation and fluid buildup in the lungs.
In some cases, the hemorrhaging was so severe that it caused death within hours or days due to the lungs being filled with fluids.
given the demands for power it looks like much of west texas is going to turn into either a wind farm or a solar farm in addition to all oil and gas wells.
there is brackish water under that whole area. The only desalination plant that taps into that is in El Paso.
but I’ll bet you could drop desal plants every couple miles all over west texas and turn the whole place green.
As it is, what the power companies want to do is site the chip factories right next to their power sources. But the new generation of chip factories require water and lots of it.
So there will be a demand for desalination plants.
“I disagree. Placed into historical context some bacterial infections had a localized death rate of 100%.”
Yes, but not S. paratyphi.
“I consider the Black Death as a good comparison of what primitive practices and procedures did to exacerbate illness.”
It is not appropriate to compare the pathogenicity or mortality of Y. pestis and S. enterica paratyphi. Especially when there is no way to compare increased mortality due to living conditions, diet or treatments between England in the 1500s and the Aztecs. In the absence of facts this argument cannot be definitively resolved and becomes a matter of opinion.
Direct (aerosol transmitted) very fast deaths ( less than 2 day) were not the “usual” pattern of death associated with the 1918-19 Spanish Flu, but occurred regularly and were reported all across the areas infected.
Just like the Bubonic Plague pustules and immediate death in medieval time plagues, it is as if two separate infections were spreading at the same time.
I also liked a historical novel by Gary Jennings:
Aztec
Thank you Max. Did Castillo’s Memoirs book mention the Sodomite proclivities of the native tribes?
I don’t recall any sodomy being mentioned, but then I’ve only read volume 1 so far.
I loved that show and it’s oddly how my mind works anyway.
I’ll start with one thing and wind up connecting crazy dots that make perfect sense to me but often drive whomever I’m talking to crazy.
“ I only said I bought a new pair of jeans. What the hell do weevils and woad have to do with anything?”
:D
What really killed 80% of the Aztecs?
It started with a stripper named Tiffany.
Soon after the Aztec men started to scratch and could no longer reproduce...
I actually liked that band back in the 70’s, they had a couple of good albums and my Girlfriend always got “friendly” when we listened to them.
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