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To: Albion Wilde
Ask yourself this: what class of people at the time had the money or the leisure time to buy novels or go to the theater? How does that class compare to those advancing racist theories today to oppress their political rivals?

In the days before movies, radio, TV, and the internet people read more than they do today. If you were a farmer and it was winter and you'd done all your work, you might take down a book and read. If you were a shopkeeper and a travelling company came to town once or twice a year, you might got to a show. Factory girls in the early Lowell mills had their own literary magazine. Of course, for many people, life was too hard and work too exhausting to leave much time for reading, but that wasn't the whole picture..

People all over the country may have had little opinion about slavery per se, but many opinions about who would move in to their community, and whether they would be compatible neighbors.

You're making my point for me. People had opinions. Those opinions couldn't all be reduced to "hatred bordering on insanity." You're also contradicting ourself. People that weary from having to work from having to work all day, may not have had the energy to agitate about outsiders and newcomers.

Every individual and all they brought with them either enhanced the community or dragged it down; so the prospect of a dispersal of former slaves was indeed a large concern.

Few Northerners thought large numbers of African-Americans were coming North (those who did were likely to be Democrats and Copperhead Southern sympathizers), but many didn't object to a black family or two living in the neighborhood. People "kept to their own," but they weren't always going to drive out newcomers if the newcomers also "kept to their own."

A lot also depended on where you lived. All sorts of people lived in city neighborhoods, and Eastern states had long established African-American families. Yes, there were incidents. There were also anti-Catholic riots. But racial violence weren't as common as you guys think. There were also times when Northerners mobbed slave catchers trying to take escaped slaves back to bondage.

The "do-gooders" (like today's progressives) dreaming of an immediate and successful integration of the two different cultures (African-slave vs European-American) were concentrated in small areas of big cities and near the Ivy colleges (Yale, Harvard) or elite old churches in New England.

The places where the American Revolution got started? Well, first of all, people who opposed slavery didn't usually envision an integrated society. They just thought slavery was wrong and wanted an end to it. Secondly, what is this idea that that 160 years ago and now are the same? Look back over the whole of our history and you find much variety. It's not like the good guys and bad guys always came from the same part of the country. Some people are fighting an endless war against another part of the country and thinking that everything that comes out of some part of the country is devil and depraved, but when America was successful it worked by bringing people from different regions together, not by making them hate each other.

497 posted on 08/03/2022 2:18:38 PM PDT by x
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To: x
You"re going far afield from the point of this thread now, delighting in the sound of your own voice, and doing the very thing you accuse me of doing ("what is this idea that that 160 years ago and now are the same?") such as the idea that farmers with large families to help work the farm and livestock settled down with a controversial popular novel like Uncle Tom's Cabin in the evening by the fireside. The only book in most American homes for more than the first two centuries since the Mayflower landed was the Bible. Which, by the way, was interpreted in one verse or another to support both sides of the slavery issue, and was quoted by both sides.

The point of showing parallels is not, and is never, to declare that the past and the present are "the same." But a series of events are often eerily similar in ways that truly bear examination when a simliar threat is looming.

Over and out.

504 posted on 08/03/2022 4:33:10 PM PDT by Albion Wilde ("Liz Cheney, Trump’s personal Javert..."--Michael Anton)
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To: x; Albion Wilde
but many didn't object to a black family or two living in the neighborhood. People "kept to their own," but they weren't always going to drive out newcomers if the newcomers also "kept to their own."

Their legislators certainly didn't get the word. For some reason they passed all sorts of nasty, horrible, draconian laws meant to keep Black people away.

540 posted on 08/04/2022 9:34:10 AM PDT by DiogenesLamp ("of parents owing allegiance to no other sovereignty.")
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