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To: woodpusher

I appreciate you taking the time to make these detailed answers.
You said classes of firearms. Are semi-automatic weapons a class, and what would stop Biden from outlawing them?

If he packs the Supreme Court, which at this point seems unlikely, but if he did, he could pretty much ban whatever he wanted, and the Court would go along with him.

Would you still hold to the line that the Supreme Court decides the Constitution, or would you say, to heck with them, the baby, and the bathwater, it says “shall not be infringed?”


118 posted on 06/05/2022 7:18:54 PM PDT by David Treibs (http://www.comeandtakeit.com Battle Flags, Etc.)
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To: David Treibs
You said classes of firearms. Are semi-automatic weapons a class, and what would stop Biden from outlawing them?

That would be a class of weapons, just as automatic weapons are a class. Probably the Constitution and the Court would stop Biden. Biden is not the Legislative Branch. It would probably require a law. I lost track of how many of Biden's regulations or executive orders have been found unconstitutional.

If he packs the Supreme Court, which at this point seems unlikely, but if he did, he could pretty much ban whatever he wanted, and the Court would go along with him.

As an historical note, it would not be a first. Lincoln packed the court with five appointees, bringing the total justices to ten, following Legislative action to raise the number from nine to ten. With five, he and the Congress had a veto-proof block on the Court. Through attrition, it fell during the Andrew Johnson (D) administration, and Congress lowered the number so Johnson could not appoint anybody. After Grant (R) took office, Congress restored the number to nine, where it has stood ever since.

Biden would need Legislation to do it. At this point, I do not see it happening. Then he would need the Senate to advise and consent to any appointee. If it could be pulled off, as in the Civil War, then yes, the Court could interpret the Constitution to have strange things emanating from the penumbras. There have been some rather odd decisions in war time, like upholding the internment of United States citizens of Japanese, German or Italian ethnicity.

Would you still hold to the line that the Supreme Court decides the Constitution, or would you say, to heck with them, the baby, and the bathwater, it says “shall not be infringed?”

I would still hold that the Supreme Court is given the authority to interpret the law. Would you really rather have Biden or the Legislature do it?

If one looks at the government we had before the Civil War, and the government since the Civil War, that war may be seen as a second revolution. There was no large standing army before the war. People think of the 16th Amendment as giving us the unapportioned income tax and the IRS to enforce it. Nope. The IRS started as the Internal Revenue Bureau. Lincoln appointed George Boutwell as the first Commissioner to enforce the unconstitutional unapportioned income tax. The list of IRS Commissioners goes back to the 1860's. After the tax was struck down in the 1890's, it was resurrected by the 16th Amendment, and marketed as a very small tax on the very wealthy. Once they were given the power, they could transform the tax into what it is today.

There is always a provision to call a Constitutional Convention, but nobody could predict what might come out of that. There is always a provision for Constitutional amendments. I can think of a few that should be repealed. The Second Amendment could be revised to include concealed carry. I don't know if three-fourths of the states could agree on anything.

Theoretically, an Amendment could be adopted to make all arms used by the military available for purchase by the public at the same price as they are sold to the military, tax free. A minor problem might be what is done for a police force.

If it got as bad as you theoretically project is possible, I would not support making believe that the Constitution says what it does not say. The PTB don't care what I think now, and they won't care any time soon. Except on paper, there would neither be a legislative nor judicial solution. If it got to that point, it would probably be time for secession. Before secession was reimagined as impossible, Vermont seceded from New York in 1777 and joined the constitutional union in 1791 as a free and independent state (not as a territory). See Vermont v. New Hampshire, 289 U.S. 593, 607-608 an opinion of the U.S. Supreme Court. "[T]he Order-in-Council was nullified by successful revolution, and Vermont was admitted as an independent state with self-constituted boundaries. ... her independence was recognized by New Hampshire in 1777, by Massachusetts in 1781, and by New York in 1790." When the constitutional government was formed, really eleven states seceded from the other two. Washington was inaugurated more than a year before Rhode Island ratified, and six months before North Carolina ratified. Check out the title page of the Congressional Register, Vol I (or II or III) for the first Congress under the Constitution of the United States, listing the eleven states by name.

I'm not even clear how how secession would work these days. We are moving toward liberal urban areas dominating the far greater expanse of conservative non-urban areas. It is not just a split between sections. How do they even separate? When the checks and balances fail completely, I damn sure don't know a peaceful solution.

120 posted on 06/06/2022 12:32:41 AM PDT by woodpusher
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