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Posted on 12/19/2019 9:43:18 AM PST by rintintin
The Constitution says the impeachment process involves both chambers.
If the House doesn't send them to the Senate, that transforms them into just another meaningless House resolution, like declaring National Pickle Week. At most it transforms "impeachment" into a nonbinding House "censure" of the president.
So I'll be glad if they nullify their "impeachment" by keeping it to themselves and not sending it to the Senate.
An indictment in the criminal system isn’t an indictment if not sent for prosecution.
Yes, now you’re describing it better.
A person hasn’t been indicted until an indictment is sent to the prosecution. The same also applies for impeachment.
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Bingo! a Grand Jury can vote to indict, but if not sent for prosecution there is not an indictment.
My thoughts exactly. It is not an actual impeachment until it is sent over to the Senate for trial.
The Dims want to have their cake and eat it too. They want their partisan temper tantrum to be the last word and not have to deal with pesky things like a defense and the witness testimonies and evidence that would bring up.
OR they are being held until the election to see if the Senate flips. If DJT wins, they can then remove him with a D senate based upon built in impeachment.
Having not enumerated the laws allegedly broken, House Democrats have voted to accuse Trump of ... obeying the law.
No and Horowitz on FNC said it would be like indicting someone but never bringing charges. The indictment would hang on Trump through his re-election.
FWIW, I’m an attorney.
The house voted for articles of impeachment which under the Constitution would normally be forwarded to the Senate. If the Senate never receives the articles they technically don’t exist. By refusing to forward the articles to the Clerk of the Senate, Nazi Pelosi is effectively exercising a pocket veto of the articles.
Until they are lodged in the Senate, Trump has NOT been officially impeached. The Senate can’t act on them until they are filed. Just as a court cannot begin court proceedings until an indictment is formally filed with the court. .
Pelosi is the prosecutor. She is exercising her discretion to NOT bring the charges. She knows she can’t win. It’s all a farce. Don’t let anyone tell you Trump has been impeached. Not yet. Maybe never.
How enlightening.
You can’t indict someone without filing the indictment with the court. Until the court receives the formal document it is just another piece of paper. If they don’t lodge the impeachment articles with the court (in this case the Senate) then they are just a stack of papers.
A prosecutor can draw up an indictment, but until it is formally filed with the court, it has no legal effect.
Interesting analogy but doesn’t fit the wording of the Constitution.
Your analysis would be correct if you substitute the word conviction. An impeachment without a conviction is a nullity. Similarly, an impeachment without a conviction is a nullity, but it still is an impeachment. An indictment rendered by a grand jury but never filed in court is a nullity. But the person was still indicted.
I’m not sure McConnell has to wait for the impeachment to be filed in the senate before the senate could vote to dismiss it since they are the sole body that establishes the trial rules.
Wrong.
A person is indicted when the grand jury and the prosecutor signs the indictment.
Actually people do get indicted by grand juries and the prosecutor decides not to file it in court. They still are indicted it just has no legal effect.
Doesn't anyone know the law here? Grand juries indict/acquit - a prosecutor has no influence other than presenting his case for their decision. If they reach an indictment, the person so charged has been indicted. It says nothing about whether the prosecutor will use that decision in which to bring formal charges before a court. That is, he may not.
That's where we're at - the House, sitting as the grand jury, has voted to "indict". However, that doesn't mean the House management team (aka 'prosecutors') will actually bring the charges before the judiciary body ie the Senate. Also, as in normal legal proceedings, the one so indicted has certain rights as well. Otherwise, prosecutors could create 'pocket' indictments and keep them in storage for the time and place of their choosing.
Yes, I know this shampeachment is a political, not criminal process, but the same essential dimensions are going to be subject to the same dynamic. That is, it's hard to conceive the Senate being held captive to the time/pleasure of the House to send over articles whenever they please. What if the Senate is in the middle of approving Trump's replacement for RBG, and the House decides to sent them over in order to interrupt the process? As you can see, that ain't gonna fly.
Anyways, it's all semantics at this point. Trump should proudly wear the fact that he's the first politically impeached president in 230 year. It's important for him to emphasize that the left has destroyed a legacy of b-partisan, measured & serious treatment of the impeachment clause.
NO the House sets the stage for the Senate Court to consider.
The dems own lawyer from the hearing agrees with p-marlowe. Feldman from judiciary committee hearing is saying the same thing. You can’t curtail a process and say you’ve completed it.
We shall see if feldmans theory is right. It would be good if it ends up being the case, but time will tell.
If Marlowe’s theory is true, then potus is not impeached.
If he is impeached,the McConnell can act now.
Win/Win for President Trump either way.
Feldman May be right. Only time will tell. McConnell can set a trial date without receipt of anything from the house, alternatively, and if they are not ready dismiss the case.
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“It’s already in Wiki”
Wiki isn’t a source of record. In fact, it is often wrong.
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