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To: Alas Babylon!
Interesting and I don't know.

The Chinese are very aware of their history and much has been written recently about them establishing a new Silk Road based on solar influence.

For example a paper from 2011: Climate patterns in north central China during the last 1800 yr and their possible driving force

The follow graph aligns with dynastic collapse and solar minimum:



The modern communist elite may understand the tradition of the Mandate of Heaven, however they may be far more practical in their understanding of economics. Basically, you can print money. They will not be able to print more food. That makes them especially dangerous over the coming years.

The Mandate of Heaven is interesting and may explain their aggressive posturing today.
48 posted on 08/15/2019 10:39:17 AM PDT by PA Engineer (Liberate America from the Occupation Media.)
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To: PA Engineer

Sorry to be slow to get back to this thread. Have not had time to look at this more closely.

And the correlation(s) in the graph are...???

From left to right -

The War with the Muslims and the internal rebellion occurred after temperatures returned to near normal (a few years or more after the Dark Ages cooling had mostly ended, it appears.)

The Goryeo-Khitan wars appear to have begun before the Oort Solar Minimum dropped temps. and precip. below average, but then continued on into the (modest) minimum.

The Mongol Invasion and Jin Dynasty collapse occurred during a period of near normal precip. and temps.

The Song Dynasty collapsed as the Wolf. (Temperature) min. took hold, but how much of that was simply due to the Mongols’ strength & success? (The cold seems not to have slowed THEM down.)

The Yuan Dynasty collapsed during a period of near normal temps., but a considerable dry spell.

The Mongols captured the Ming Emperor during a fairly normal climate / weather period.

No major historical calamities during Spoerer Min.

Multiple rebellions, wars / battles before the Little Ice Age took hold.

Ming Dynasty collapses during Maunder Minimum. The Ming Dynasty had been under various duress for a long time though - possibly the MM was the final straw?

The Dalton Minimum is such a small blip that the lack of calamities is likely irrelevant.

The famines of the Qing Dynasty occurred during near normal temps, and precip. that began near normal but then peaked (a little after the famines, it appears? Hard to say from this though, what weather (as opposed to climate) may have happened in individual years.

So... overall there is some spotty correlation, but big problems could also occur when the climate was fine, and the climate could sometimes go to heck and not spur wars or political strife.

And, FWIW... There’s little to suggest that “hot” temperatures caused strife.


57 posted on 08/19/2019 2:25:26 AM PDT by Paul R. (The Lib / Socialist goal: Total control of nothing left worth controlling.)
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