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The Real Victim
Canada Free Press ^ | 9 Sep, 2017 | Daniel Greenfield

Posted on 09/10/2017 9:44:46 PM PDT by MtnClimber

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To: 2ndDivisionVet
"In police training they have an “assailant” come at you with a rubber knife from about 20 yards away while you hold your pistol out in front of yourself."

It's called the Tueller Drill and the distance is 20 FEET, NOT YARDS.

21 posted on 09/11/2017 1:34:53 AM PDT by T-Bird45 (It feels like the seventies, and it shouldn't.)
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To: jonno

Yes.


22 posted on 09/11/2017 1:45:49 AM PDT by OKSooner
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To: joshua c

Pierced whose left lung? I still don’t understand...


23 posted on 09/11/2017 1:47:09 AM PDT by OKSooner
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

Just a detail, but the Tueller drill is 7 yards (about 20 feet). I didn’t want a typo to mislead readers.


24 posted on 09/11/2017 1:48:30 AM PDT by Pollster1 ("Governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed")
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To: T-Bird45; 2ndDivisionVet
Here're the specifics of the Tueller Drill.

"The Tueller Drill is a self-defense training exercise to prepare against a short-range knife attack when armed only with a holstered handgun. Sergeant Dennis Tueller, of the Salt Lake City, Utah Police Department wondered how quickly an attacker with a knife could cover 21 feet (6.4 m), so he timed volunteers as they raced to stab the target. He determined that it could be done in 1.5 seconds

25 posted on 09/11/2017 2:06:48 AM PDT by Covenantor (Men are ruled...by liars who refuse them news, and by fools who cannot govern. " Chesterton)
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To: MtnClimber
"Kenny Herring was African-American and he identified as “Kiki”, a woman"

Image result for Kenny “Kiwi” Herring

_____________________________________

Image result for Kenny “Kiwi” Herring

_____________________________________

Image result for Kenny Herring Kristy Thompson

Kristy Thompson, 28, was also arrested on the scene for "involvement" in the assault of the man, according to police. She was charged with first-degree assault and being held on $80,000, cash-only bond.

26 posted on 09/11/2017 2:37:23 AM PDT by ETL (See my FR Home page for a closer look at today's Communist/Anarchist protest groups)
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To: BwanaNdege

I don’t have a race card, Democrat Party card, EBT or queer card in my wallet. I do have a carry permit in there. Does that balance the others out?


27 posted on 09/11/2017 3:04:17 AM PDT by EandH Dad (sleeping giants wake up REALLY grumpy)
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To: OKSooner
Pierced whose left lung? I still don’t understand.

From the article...

"Kenny tried to make mincemeat out of his neighbor.

When the cops came, the neighbor had stab wounds on his face and torso, and defensive wounds on his arms."

From another media source...

“Kristy Thompson, 28, was also arrested on the scene for “involvement” in the assault of the man, according to police. She was charged with first-degree assault and being held on $80,000, cash-only bond. “

28 posted on 09/11/2017 3:17:27 AM PDT by ETL (See my FR Home page for a closer look at today's Communist/Anarchist protest groups)
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To: OKSooner
Kristy Thompson is Kenny 'Kiwi' Herring's wife.

IMO, Kristy looks more like a man than does her husband 'Kiwi'.

Image result for Kenny Herring Kristy Thompson
Kenny 'Kiwi' Herring

Image result for Kenny Herring Kristy Thompson
Kristy Thompson

"When the cops came, the neighbor had stab wounds on his face and torso, and defensive wounds on his arms.

Kenny’s butcher knife pierced his left lung.

But Kenny still wasn’t done. He waved the knife around and stabbed an officer in the arm. And was shot and killed. Thompson was arrested and charged with assault and criminal action. "

29 posted on 09/11/2017 3:26:08 AM PDT by ETL (See my FR Home page for a closer look at today's Communist/Anarchist protest groups)
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To: jonno
Is anyone else having trouble understanding what this sentence trying to communicate?

Yes, me.

30 posted on 09/11/2017 5:04:27 AM PDT by Mark17 (Genesis chapter 1 verse 1. In the beginning GOD....And the rest, as they say, is HIS-story)
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To: Mark17

That was cleared up already.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/chat/3584829/posts?page=11#11


31 posted on 09/11/2017 6:07:31 AM PDT by ETL (See my FR Home page for a closer look at today's Communist/Anarchist protest groups)
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To: MtnClimber

And the SJWs are going to riot over this tranny and the Stockley verdict.

Hot time in the Lou this week. Stay away, you have been warned.


32 posted on 09/11/2017 6:49:58 AM PDT by Molon Labbie (Kim Jon Un. Entered the world stage Unopposed, led Unapologetically, died Unidentified.)
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To: exnavy

“What a dumb a$$ to bring a knife to a gun fight.”

Don’t sell knives short.

Statistically, you have a better chance of surviving a gunshot attack than a knife attack.

Tactical analysis of street encounters reinforces the conclusion that a knife-wielding assailant can close on someone armed with a drawn, aimed sidearm and inflict serious injuries before the individual with the gun can react. Critical distance is about seven yards (21 ft), as other posters have noted. Outside that distance, the knife-wielder’s chance of success decline dramatically.

These facts have been known to law enforcement agencies for at least 30 years. Curricula of training organizations have been revised accordingly.

Edged weapons bring other advantages to the fight: they are silent, they do not run out of ammunition, and they don’t malfunction as often as do firearms.

Advantages of guns:

Less training required.

Less strength, speed, and size required.

Effective at distances outside 21 ft.


33 posted on 09/11/2017 10:05:19 AM PDT by schurmann
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To: schurmann

I do not care to get that close, and i prefer large caliber handguns. The kind of handguns that rarely require a follow up shot.


34 posted on 09/11/2017 10:09:12 AM PDT by exnavy (long live the .45 colt, the original handgun cartridge.)
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To: exnavy

“I do not care to get that close, and i prefer large caliber handguns. The kind of handguns that rarely require a follow up shot.”

Pretty much my preferences too: one’s chances are better with a 45 Colt than a 25 ACP. Though even the little 25 can kill if it hits right.

The knife-vs-handgun analysis has been done largely to inform and assist law enforcement, who have fewer choices about which situations they enter, often on very short notice.

After 64-1/2 years of living, and sustaining barely-survivable injuries in a landing mishap, I avoid physical encounters more carefully than ever, despite being a CCW permit holder. Fortunately, work & daily life no longer require my presence in high-risk areas.

But years of reading - and writing - test reports (for every weapon system including small arms), picking the brains of ground troops and law enforcement folks, fixing guns for police & private citizens, and simply thinking about the problem, have led me to the conclusion that the only halfway-certain statements we can make about close-quarters violent encounters is that there are many variables, not all are identified, and no one can predict outcomes very accurately.

I used to believe large-caliber handgun rounds were clearly superior.

Now I’m less sure.

Even the vaunted US 45 ACP is marginal. 9mm NATO generates more energy (best predictor of effectiveness, as determined by USAF’s Weapons Lab, who conducted JSSAP) and has a greater effective range.

But the 455 Webley revolver cartridge used by the British attained an international reputation as a fight-stopper, despite some loadings that had a sedate muzzle velocity of 600 ft/sec. The US Thompson-LaGarde tests also rated the 455 superior in stopping power to the 45 Colt.

Many more variables need to be identified and better understood. But the “ideal” cartridge does not exist; neither does an “ideal” handgun. There are nothing but tradeoffs, some of which aren’t pretty.


35 posted on 09/11/2017 11:27:55 AM PDT by schurmann
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To: schurmann

I handload my colt ammo for self defense. That said Buffalo Bore has a .45 colt load, standard pressure, full wad cutter that is devastating to mammals. Think of a soup can shaped projectile.


36 posted on 09/11/2017 11:32:48 AM PDT by exnavy (long live the .45 colt, the original handgun cartridge.)
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To: ETL

Justice? I’d say he got his justice. Bury him and learn from his mistakes.


37 posted on 09/11/2017 11:33:19 AM PDT by NorthMountain (The Democrats ... have lost their grip on reality -DJT)
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To: tumblindice; NorthMountain
those who rise up early n the morning to chimp out with a butcher knife over BBQ.’

The BBQ may have been one that lasted until the wee hours of the morning with a bunch of drunk people talking loudly and carrying on, perhaps blasting music too. Because I've had neighbors like this myself, so can't blame anyone for being pissed off here. But certainly not to the point of going at them with a knife, unless it was a matter of self-defense after confronting them about the noise. The excerpt, at least, doesn't provide much detail, other than to sort of suggest the beef was about the smoke from the grill. Too lazy right now to click the link and see if additional details are there.

38 posted on 09/11/2017 11:42:30 AM PDT by ETL (See my FR Home page for a closer look at today's Communist/Anarchist protest groups)
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To: 2ndDivisionVet

“It’s amazing how quickly they’re upon you.”

Yup. That’s what I’ve heard from people who know a lot more than I do about the danger of someone armed with a knife. They are on you quickly plus they don’t run out of ammo.


39 posted on 09/11/2017 5:03:16 PM PDT by Pelham (Liberate California. Deport Mexico Now)
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