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(Vanity) Why is there no set process for a state to leave the union?
GraceG

Posted on 05/13/2016 1:18:26 PM PDT by GraceG

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To: Starboard

Debt at $19.26 TRILLION and rising fast. This is not going to end well at all.
_______________________

That’s we happens when trillions are handed out to sh*thole countries who hate us.
(and Omuslim has just declared he’s ‘set aside’ $17,000 to care for each ‘immigrant’- that’s more than our poorest of the poor, our seniors, who helped make this country the greatest the world has ever known, make in a year from SS!!!

And don’t even start bashing SS. It is what it is.
Seniors worked hard all their lives and paid into it with the promise by the govmt that their money would be paid back to them to care for them when they grew old.
Maybe if the SS fund hadn’t been looted to pay for ‘immigrants’(criminal invaders) welfare,and doled out to sh*thole countries who hate us, it wouldn’t be in trouble.


61 posted on 05/13/2016 2:20:57 PM PDT by patriot08 (5th generation Texan (girl type) ANGRY? REFUSE TO VOTE? HELLO HILLARY!)
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To: All

Sometimes I think I wouldn’t mind if Texas did secede.
It is one of the few that is truly ‘like a whole other country’, as the slogan goes.
It is one of the few that could survive all on its own.
We have everything we need.
All we need is elect Trump/Newt, run out all the illegal messkins and all the muzzies. (and Libs who have flocked here from Ca and other states to take advantage of our freedoms and assets.


62 posted on 05/13/2016 2:28:56 PM PDT by patriot08 (5th generation Texan (girl type) ANGRY? REFUSE TO VOTE? HELLO HILLARY!)
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To: patriot08

“And don’t even start bashing SS. It is what it is. Seniors worked hard all their lives and paid into it with the promise by the govmt that their money would be paid back to them to care for them when they grew old.”

*******************
I hate to break it to you but the Social Security UNFUNDED LIABILITY is a whopping $15 TRILLION (in addition to the national debt).

All told our unfunded liabilities exceed $100 trillion, out of which your individual share is ‘only’ $853,000. The term “unsustainable” does not even begin to describe the true depths of our debt load.


63 posted on 05/13/2016 2:30:47 PM PDT by Starboard
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To: GraceG

“Why is there no set process for a state to leave the union?”

There is a process for calling a convention of the states and voting to abolish the federal government. That’s really close to states leaving the union.


64 posted on 05/13/2016 2:31:53 PM PDT by sergeantdave ( If not you, who? If not now, when?)
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To: GraceG

Musings should include could a state be financially able to incur the debt that
would be imposed if it tried to leave the union? My guess is most if not all couldn’t
do that on their own.


65 posted on 05/13/2016 2:34:49 PM PDT by deport
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To: deport

I agree. If any could it would be Texas.


66 posted on 05/13/2016 2:37:31 PM PDT by rockrr (Everything is different now...)
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To: GraceG

We do have a process. It is called a Constitutional Amendment Process. How did you miss that?

We call ourselves the UNITED states of america. The word UNITED means something to our founders and to us.


67 posted on 05/13/2016 2:45:08 PM PDT by spintreebob
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To: Starboard
And what's responsible for SS failure to keep their promises? SS raided for handouts to sh*thole countries who hate us, and $1700 to care for Omuslim's immigrants.

The average American hasn’t a CLUE how much of our tax money Obama has sent down Muslim sh*t holes while h slashes the military, CUTS MEDICARE...

TIP OF THE ICEBERG

BILLIONS FOR JIHAD! Obamas 2009 Supplemental Appropriations for Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Pandemic Flu was revised and passed by the full committee. It gives billions of U.S. taxpayer dollars to countries and entities that support Sharia law and/or harbor, hide and support those who want to destroy the U.S. and our allies. http://creepingsharia.wordpress.com/2009/05/1...

Read the summary from David Obeys office that was quietly released last week with nary a word from any media.

$3.6 BILLION matching the request, to expand and improve capabilities of the Afghan security forces

$400 MILLION, as requested, to build the counterinsurgency capabilities of the Pakistani security forces

AFGHANISTAN: $1.52 BILLION, $86 MILLION above the request WEST BANK AND GAZA: $665 MILLION in bilateral economic, humanitarian, and security assistance for the West Bank and Gaza

JORDAN: $250 million,$250 million above the request, including $100 million for economic and $150 million for security assistance

EGYPT $310 million above the request, including $50 million for economic assistance,$50 million for border security, and $260 million for security assistance

PAKISTAN,$591 million above the request

IRAQ:$968 MILLION,$336 million above the request

Oversight: $20 million,$13 million above the request, to expand oversight capacity of the State Department, USAID, and the Special Inspector General for Afghanistan to review programs in Afghanistan, Pakistan and Iraq

Lebanon:$74 million

International Food Assistance:$500 MILLION $ 200 million above the request, for PL 480 international food assistance to alleviate suffering during the global economic crisis

REFUGEE ASSISTANCE:$343 MILLION,$50 million above the request, including humanitarian assistance for Gaza.

Funding for the UN Relief and Works Agency programs in the West Bank and Gaza is limited to $119 million (Note: Gaza = Hamas)

Disaster Assistance: $200 MILLION to avert famines and provide life-saving assistance during natural disasters and for internally displaced people around the world, including Somalia, Zimbabwe, Ethiopia, the Middle East and South Asia

Department of Justice: $17 million, matching the request, for counter-terrorism activities and to provide training and assistance for the Iraqi criminal justice system

OBAMA GIVES YOUR TAX DOLLARS TO REBUILD MUSLIM MOSQUES AROUND THE WORLD! http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/... # Obama Invites 80,000 Muslim Immigrants Into the United States – Promises 100,000/Per Year for Next 5 Years Beginning to get it??

68 posted on 05/13/2016 2:48:26 PM PDT by patriot08 (5th generation Texan (girl type) ANGRY? REFUSE TO VOTE? HELLO HILLARY!)
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To: GraceG

The lack of an exit plan was deliberate. This was brought up as an issue long BEFORE the Civil War. Should a state be able to secede, then it would be able to use the threat of secession as a means of political coercion; In turn, the state for whom secession would be most plausible would become more politically powerful, and the entire union would pretty much become a joke.

How would a state even secede, without annexing federal property? Not an idle question: this was the problem that so quickly led to the South attacking Northern troops. The North had pulled back its forces from most federal forts in Confederate territory, but it was hardly clear that there was any intent to vacate Ft. Sumter, rather than staking a claim. Should the Union simply have given the confederacy what was created by the states as a union? Would a farmer who held land in both Maryland and Virginia be expected to forfeit his land in one of those states? So long as both parties didn’t desire the split, it seems unimagiable that a fair outcome could result.

HOWEVER, there seems no reason that should CONGRESS want to CREATE an exit plan, it couldn’t. While there would be an unimaginable number of political and legal issues to address, legislation could certainly allow for a legutimate means to address them.


69 posted on 05/13/2016 2:51:40 PM PDT by dangus
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To: GraceG

We had this thing called the civil war and the result was that nobody can leave.


70 posted on 05/13/2016 2:52:47 PM PDT by stellaluna
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To: Yaelle

Just do not pay the bill. You will not have to cancel.


71 posted on 05/13/2016 3:04:51 PM PDT by RoadGumby (This is not where I belong, Take this world and give me Jesus.)
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To: spintreebob

[ We do have a process. It is called a Constitutional Amendment Process. How did you miss that? ]

I think I did mention that in an earlier reply, we could theoretically add an exit process as an amendment...


72 posted on 05/13/2016 3:29:01 PM PDT by GraceG (Only a fool works hard in an environment where hard work is not appreciated...)
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To: PCPOET7

Once it was “the law” for Englishmen to be forcibly kidnapped from job and family,taken to a ship and forced to swear oaths of loyalty to the very bastards who engineered the kidnapping. Then those men were forced to fight,die, and be executed for disobeying or rebelling against the system.

Lincoln was a dictator who crapped on the Constitution which explains why he is obama’s favorite.


73 posted on 05/13/2016 3:29:25 PM PDT by hoosierham (Freedom isn't free)
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To: dangus

[ The lack of an exit plan was deliberate. This was brought up as an issue long BEFORE the Civil War. Should a state be able to secede, then it would be able to use the threat of secession as a means of political coercion; In turn, the state for whom secession would be most plausible would become more politically powerful, and the entire union would pretty much become a joke. ]

I would say the conditions or a state leaving should at least require 1/3 of the OTHER states agree that it is okay in their state legislatures for that state to leave, plus the super majority in the state itself. As well as a very large super majority of the citizens and state legislature vote to leave. That way any thought of an individual state using as blackmail can be vetoed easily by the rest by 2/3 majority veto of other states.

That would be a check on the possibility of “state secession blackmail”


74 posted on 05/13/2016 3:33:18 PM PDT by GraceG (Only a fool works hard in an environment where hard work is not appreciated...)
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To: rockrr

I agree. If any could it would be Texas.

I would love for Texas to leave while taking the high road while leaving, even if Texas had to go into hock while leaving to settle accounts so to speak.


75 posted on 05/13/2016 3:34:52 PM PDT by GraceG (Only a fool works hard in an environment where hard work is not appreciated...)
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To: Arthur McGowan

Nor did the Confederacy have a right to fire on a Federal Fort or issue letters of Marque against United States flagged ships.


76 posted on 05/13/2016 3:38:04 PM PDT by Bull Snipe
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To: Starboard

Instead of pulling a lanyard on an artillery piece, maybe South Carolina should have sued in Federal Court for their secession. I would expect the Taney Supreme Court would have declared their right to secession as Constitutional.


77 posted on 05/13/2016 3:50:12 PM PDT by Bull Snipe
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To: GraceG
You certainly aren't the first person to have these musings about "what it means to be a state vs a country and whatnot". The recent unpleasantness demonstrated the wrong way for a "state" to leave a "Union" of "United States". They tried to leave based upon the fact that they didn't like the man who had just been elected to the office of the presidency. They made a rule for their confederacy, that to be a member state of their confederacy, you had to allow slavery of the black man. I am pretty sure that no "free state" tried to join their confederation.

There was a man who covered the whole subject of a states right to secede. Look up the Innaugural address that was given by the man who was elected president in 1860. The issue of secession has never been so thoroughly explored as in that short read.

Ask yourself this: suppose California upon hearing that Donald Trump had just been elected to the office of POTUS says, "we're out". Would that be ok?

78 posted on 05/13/2016 3:54:51 PM PDT by HandyDandy (Don't make up stuff. It wastes time.)
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To: georgiarat

Am reasonably sure that the average Japanese citizen view of United States actions in WWII were similar to that of those in the South after the Civil War. General Sherman’s view of war was that “War is the solution that our enemies have chosen, I say lets give them all they want.” That was the national view of how we needed to deal with the Japanese. The South started a war, they got all the real war that they could handle.


79 posted on 05/13/2016 3:55:09 PM PDT by Bull Snipe
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To: Repealthe17thAmendment

Because if you win the war, you can do anything you want. The Union was nothing but a bunch of thugs before the war and worse afterwards.


80 posted on 05/13/2016 3:59:08 PM PDT by freedomfiter2 (Lex rex)
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