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To: Diego1618
What does it say then....."A Natural"?

Don't be stupid. All I said was that, contrary to your claim, Vattel couldn't have coined the term "natural born citizen" because (1) he wrote in French and (2) he didn't use the French words for "born" or "citizen." You can translate "les naturels" however you like, but your original claim is still simply false.

LOL...........the last sentence kind of sums it up.....no matter what the Frogs called it.

On second thought, maybe you can't help being stupid. Vattel wasn't French, he was Swiss.

170 posted on 08/13/2013 8:05:34 PM PDT by Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical

The Founfers were the naturals.


174 posted on 08/13/2013 8:53:12 PM PDT by ObligedFriend
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical

Alexander Porter Morse wrote the French ‘naturel’ meant natural born in his Treatise on Citizenship:

“The natural born or native is one who is born in the country to citizen parents.”

Morse references a French edition of Droit des Gens.


176 posted on 08/13/2013 9:10:29 PM PDT by ObligedFriend
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To: Ha Ha Thats Very Logical
On second thought, maybe you can't help being stupid. Vattel wasn't French, he was Swiss.

Didn't say he was......but the language was still that of the "Frogs".....and the last sentence still sums it up!

He coined the term......"natural born citizen" because every reference to it during the 18th century said exactly that. It's just silly to deny something so obvious.

Contrary to your negativity regarding this..... that's what folks called it....and wrote when referencing it prior to its inclusion in the Constitution.

It must be difficult not being aware of what most others uncover...... without too much trouble. John Bingham of Ohio (father of the 14th amendment) was still referring to it in the original...... when he stated in the House of Representatives (March 9, 1866) the following:

" ... I find no fault with the introductory clause [S 61 Bill], which is simply declaratory of what is written in the Constitution, that every human being born within the jurisdiction of the United States of parents not owing allegiance to any foreign sovereignty is, in the language of your Constitution itself, a natural born citizen..."

The First Congress...3/4 of a century earlier (1790) had used the term as well:

And the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided that the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States: Provided also, that no person heretofore proscribed by any state, shall be admitted a citizen as aforesaid, except by an act of the legislature of the state in which such person was proscribed.(March 26, 1790)

Now....isn't it amazing that this term, "Natural Born Citizen" seemed to be in use quite frequently for the early years of this country? Do you imagine that it was just grabbed out of the air....or was the concept first developed at an earlier date?

Benjamin Franklin had this to say when writing to Vattel's editor on December 9, 1775:

“ I am much obliged by the kind present you have made us of your edition of Vattel. It came to us in good season, when the circumstances of a rising state make it necessary frequently to consult the Law of Nations has been continually in the hands of the members of our congress, now sitting. Accordingly, that copy which I kept has been continually in the hands of the members of our congress, now sitting, who are much pleased with your notes and preface, and have entertained a high and just esteem for their author.”

Do you suppose Franklin (who was fluent in French) added those words....."Natural Born Citizen"....or did they appear in his French edition? Maybe the editor had translated the publication himself into English.....adding those words.

Shame on him.

I won't call you stupid because I really don't know much about you.......but on the surface....you appear to just be silly.

178 posted on 08/14/2013 5:23:46 PM PDT by Diego1618 (Put "Ron" on the Rock!)
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