[noinfringers2]

I’ve gone to the internet and found many postings giving references to Ben Franklin’s involvement with Vattel’s writings and especially his noting of such to the Congress.One such writing is to Charles Dumas dated from Philadelphia 9 December, 1775. There are other such references available on the internet. Some where in my files is a reference to Franklin and Jay being connected on this matter.

[Jeff Winston]

I’ve gone to the internet and found many postings giving references to Ben Franklin’s involvement with Vattel’s writings and especially his noting of such to the Congress.One such writing is to Charles Dumas dated from Philadelphia 9 December, 1775. There are other such references available on the internet. Some where in my files is a reference to Franklin and Jay being connected on this matter.

I would be interested in seeing your references to Ben Franklin and Vattel. I think I've seen some stuff in the past, but it was all very general.

There's not the slightest doubt in my mind that some of the Founding Fathers looked favorably on at least some of Vattel's writings and ideas. There is not the slightest doubt in my mind that Vattel was influential in the area of international law.

There is also not the slightest doubt in my mind that when it came to citizenship, they didn't give him a second thought. Just as they didn't give him a second thought when he said that the state should control religion, that the state should control speech (he approved the appointment of government censors, but said that "wise" people should be selected for the job), and that the right to keep and bear arms should be restricted to the elites:

"Since custom has allowed persons of rank and gentlemen of the army to bear arms in times of peace, strict care should be taken that none but these should be allowed to wear swords."

Those who are big fans of Vattel here, let me ask you: Why aren't you supporting Obama's gun control measures and trying to take away guns from all the commoners and the riff-raff? That seems to be what Vattel would have been out in front supporting at this point in time.

The bottom line is: Natural born citizen clearly came from natural born subject. It always included everyone born in the country, whether their parents were citizens or not. And the exceptions to that (children of foreign diplomats and such) were very, very rare.

I understand that some have been deceived by the two-citizen parents birthers. But it is time that we stop indulging people who want to twist the Constitution.