Posted on 01/05/2013 6:02:47 AM PST by wintertime
Truant school kids get surprise trip to jail /( School:Training to be prisoners of the state)
This video is 2:37 minutes long.
Questions:
Adult prison? Really? Wow! Imagine the lessons taught there!
Why are communities demanding that 18 year old young men ( whose only crime was to be born) attend prison-like school where they are treated in many ways like a state prisoner?
Why should a community do to this to a 17 year old or to any child of any age? These children have committed no crime but the state treats them like prisoners in their prison-like state schools.
What impact will this imprisonment have on the future lives of these young people in this video? ( Please, remember that they have **rationally** rebelled against being treated like a state prisoner in their prison-like state schools.)
What is the impact of having unwilling inmates in prison-like schools on the education of those who are compliant in their prison-like schools?
With the increasing criminalization of childhood behavior, that in the past would have been treated as a learning opportunity, what will be the consequences for our nation?
What will be the consequences of having a nation of voters who have been trained in the prison-like state schools to be comfortable with being state prisoners?
Please remember that behind every government school teacher stand armed police, courts, handcuffs, and hard-time prison. ( Real bullets in those guns on the hip.) Isn't this video proof enough of that?
By the way, although the judge was quoted as saying that kids who are not in school are committing crimes, there was no mention of these young people committing crime ( except for being born and refusing to being treated like a prisoner of the state.)
(Excerpt) Read more at youtube.com ...
As in other threads, please do not ping or send me private mail.
Please feel completely free to comment on this thread, any of my posts, and feel free to use my name in your post,...but....please no pings or mail for the remainder of this thread.
Respectfully and with the utmost politeness,
Wintertime
How does Wintertime’s freedom of association warrant censoring his/her freedom of speech?
Are you an Obama employee?
I'm not sure I've made myself clear. Apart from any substantive criticisms of American education, there are those who wish to delegitimize the entire concept of government-funded and -run education. That is their starting point.
That's not mine. My starting point is that government-funded and -run education is constitutional, was not unknown to the Founders, and in fact, was already getting into full-swing by the time of the Revolution (to the degree that such a sparsely populated country could sustain a “full-swing” in public education).
It isn't un-American. With regard to Horace Mann, often the conversation about him is used to suggest that perhaps public education was legitimate, American, up through the first half-century of the the 19th century, but then due to the nefarious efforts of this evil-doer, this conspirator against all that is holy and American, that public education in America was driven off course. Folks seem to often throw in the words "Prussian model" to emphasize just how un-American it all is.
I'm not dealing with the actual merits of the educational ideas of which he was perhaps the most articulate spokesman. All I'm saying is that he wasn't some evil conspirator nearly single-handedly ruining public education. Rather, he was typical of the educational reformers of the time. Here in Maryland, the discussions in our legislature about things like state funding of schools through dedicated taxes, state control versus local control of schools and curricula, creation of standards, etc. started in the late 1700s and percolated through the early part of the 19th century. After seeing legislation in the 17th and 18th century, the first attempts in the 19th century at legislating some of this stuff came in something like 1817, and then again in 1825.
The way we got this stuff wasn't through the evil deeds of a small elite of Illuminati or Freemasons or some other secret, anti-American group. The way we got this stuff, at least here in Maryland, was through rough-and-tumble, give-and-take politics, through legislative votes, through little victories for one side or other and little defeats, through two steps forward and one step backward (or perhaps, depending on the point of view, two steps backward and one step forward).
We got it through the playing out of representative democracy.
Thus, the place to start to fix public education isn't through trying to delegitimize it, saying it's fundamentally un-American or unconstitutional.
I think that over time, American public education has accreted a lot of baggage that seems to my non-expert eyes to be unconstitutional (Federal Dept of Education?? National testing standards??). Whether constitutional or not, I think there's a lot of bad stuff to fix in public education.
But the views expressed herein by some are unbalanced, don't accurately represent our history going back to the founding era, and thus aren't especially helpful in talking about education, whether public, private or homeschooling.
sitetest
I don’t know which is worse: being judged a threat or NOT being judged a threat. I guess under my picture is the caption, “Mostly harmless.”
LOL.
sitetest
Horace Mann himself was a Unitarian humanist, and advocate of phrenology. His quixotic effort to transform America and American education through a system of certifying teachers and imposing a uniform curriculum, was only made possible by the contemporary anti-Catholic hysteria and subsequent compulsory attendance laws.
This malignant birth of compulsory schooling was followed by the permeation of Darwinism and behavioral psychology in the Prussian-modeled teacher colleges, like Columbia.
From its birth, compulsory schooling in America has been a malignant social force.
I highly recommend any of John Gatto's YouTube videos.
Dang! I feel so slighted - I never got a freepmail so I have no clue if I am judged a threat or not..........
Sorry - couldn’t resist.
It seems freedom and bigotry go together. There are a lot of people who would force their company, ideology, and orientation on others in the name of diversity. Right now the Boy Scouts are bigots for not allowing fags to play pup tents with little boys.
Frankly in these times the less agents of our socialist government that I encounter in my day to day life, the better I like it. If that makes me a bigot, why not just type it on the other side of the obligatory racist card that gets thrown at all conservatives. Save a tree.
I haven't defended Mann.
But it is ahistorical to think that he and a few folks swept onto the scene on or about 1837, when Mann became involved in education in Massachusetts, and of whole cloth changed American public education without the consent of the governed.
sitetest
It’s not coincidental that you throw the race card into the argument, I must say. A person reading my last post might conclude I had a touch of prophecy. But it was the easiest of predictions as it is the first refuge for Obama employees with the weakest of arguments. “You don’t think as I do so let me compare you to a racist and/or a persecutor of people of faith.” You take a person choosing freedom of association, speech and thought and do everything short of painting a bloody swastika on those rights.
Not having it.
Yeah, I’d call that personal. Others might disagree, which is cool I guess.
At least it was good for some chucks huh?
It is a legitimate comparison.
still, the question is a good one Fattigermaster, and I’m curious as to the answer, if there is one...
I’ll change it up a bit, if you like....
If anyone, on a public forum, said that she/he would not associate with _______________ religion, or _____________ race, because everyone in that catagory are evil (idiots, useless, vile,) what would your response be?
There are three reasons why I have recently decided to end all discourse with the generic world government school defenders anywhere and everywhere I find them:
1) Agreeing to a debate confers a veneer of legitimacy on their foundational premises where there is no legitimacy. For example, should we debate the merits of abortion? No, we should not, because the foundational reasoning of those supporting abortion is completely invalid. Their argument supporting abortion should be immediately and completely rejected. End of discussion. The same it true for government schooling.
2) Why bother with people who are not approaching a topic in a spirit of good will?
3) If there is no discourse with these people and no engagement with the generic government school defender, regardless of the Internet forum, it is harder for them to run to the moderator demanding that posts and threads be pulled because of imagined “personal” insults. Just as Obama managed to get rid of opponents though technicalities, it seems to be the Alinsky tactic to shut up their opponents by way crying about imagined personal insults or minor rule infractions. I’ve seen this tactic throughout the Internet on many forums.
4) And I am tired of the genuinely personal insults directed at me, my family, and the occasional threat by way of private mail. Yes, sometimes it has been scary. The generic government school defender, regardless of the message board forum, has closer ties to genuinely pushy union thugs than anyone I know in my life. We saw what they did in Wisconsin, and I bet the all those teachers who voted for these vicious and destructive union reps pretend to be as venerable as Mother Teresa in their communities and churches.
I agree; it is an excellent question.
I return to work tomorrow in a vile, evil, bottom-sucking public school wherein I am going to do everything I can to help all my kids be successful.
Some will walk across the stage with a diploma in May, and some will not. Unfortunately, when you are not destined to enter college at 12, 13, or 12 because you have a functional IQ of 65, there is only so much I or any teacher can do.
Perhaps one of the rabid homeschoolers can shed some light on how to educate students with well-defined, serious learning deficits to help them enter college at an exceptionally young age or now for that matter.
And I think my Freeping will be curtailed exceptionally because I do have to work and not stay at home, scour the Internet for anything I can find to condemn public education.
However, the last time I checked, there are an exceptional number of people who are 1. killed; 2. hurt; 3. left in a permanent vegetative state because of serious medical malpractice. I cannot think of a single student in my career that I have reduced to permanent vegetative state because I tried to get them to learn. (Off topic and spurious I know, but it brings up a valid point against those who swear the education system is creating nothing of value)
"It is a legitimate comparison."
To the Holocaust.
Okay, fine.
Because Wintertime has freedom of association, on your way to doing good works your saintly shadow will probably pass without cooling his fevered prejudiced brow. His misfortune, and his right to choose.
I will not associate with anyone of the Apple religion or of the Orange race, because all such people are fruits.
(As long as we’re comparing Apples and Oranges)
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