[smvoice]

You do realize that His extreme torture has nothing to do with our salvation? It is His DEATH, His BLOOD being taken to the Father as the propiation of our sins, and the Father's acceptance of His blood as payment for our sins that saves us, right? That the PROOF that His blood was poured out for us, and that it satifies a Just and Holy God is the fact that He raised Christ from the dead. If there had been even one sin that Christ did not pay for in our stead, then God the Father could not have raised Him. His own principles and character would not have allowed that.

" Patient endurance"? You believe that in the end, that is what will save us?

"And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him: But for ous also, to whom it shalll be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus Christ our Lord from the dead: Who was delivered for OUR OFFENSES, and was raised again for OUR JUSTIFICATION. THerefore BEING JUSIFIED BY FAITH, we HAVE PEACE WITH GOD THROUGH OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST"..Rom.4:21-Rom. 5:1.

A person can "patiently endure" all they desire. But without accepting the sacrifice of Christ's FINISHED WORK on our behalf for our salvation, we are at enmity with God and enemies of the cross. No matter HOW "patient", "forgiving", or "loving" we strive to be. We can be assured we have peace with God right now. Not because of what we do, or do not do, but because of what Christ did FOR US.

[fabian]

You are partially correct...but it also says through patience possess ye your souls...and those who endure to the end shall be saved. These are not things that we do of our own but rather things like anger and irritation...that we allow to pass. More affirmative action salvation from you!