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Obama's Citizenship
Posted on 03/21/2012 7:30:25 PM PDT by Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
Could someone explain the issue of Obama's birth certificate? I've seen Sheriff Joe present findings that it is a forgery along with the selective service card. Then I recall Ann Coulter claiming "her paper," human events has debunked the "birther" nonsense, but I don't really bother reading her columns any longer preferring not to be insulted by "three cheers for Romneycare." I mean, is there really credible evidence that Obama is not a U.S. citizen because that would be huge..
TOPICS: Chit/Chat
KEYWORDS: birthcertificate; certifigate; ibtz; naturalborncitizen
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To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
21
posted on
03/21/2012 8:25:39 PM PDT
by
Vendome
(Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
Many before Sheriff Joe have spent huge amounts of time trying to resolve the absent history of Obozo.
Sheriff Joe has done a very good job adding to this.
I still dream of seeing him evicted from 1600 Penn. Ave. in handcuffs.
He is without a doubt a Fraud and Traitor.
Out Constitution is being systematically destroyed by the Dems with the help of some of the GOP. This cries for criminal charges and trials.
The Globalist Left and the Globalist Fascists Businessmen wish to destroy the most free nation in the world. That is the plan, we are not even players in their minds.
22
posted on
03/21/2012 8:27:32 PM PDT
by
Texas Fossil
(Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one)
To: Vendome
Frued strikes again....meant NBC ( natural born citizen)
23
posted on
03/21/2012 8:27:32 PM PDT
by
Breto
(The Establishment party is killing our country)
To: Texas Fossil
I would word it differently. There is no credible evidence showing Obozo is a U.S. Citizen or a Natural Born U.S. Citizen. There are 2 obvious forgeries presented to represent his COLB. Neither are credible.Why doesn't Obama show us the proof that he is eligible to be president?
24
posted on
03/21/2012 8:27:43 PM PDT
by
tommix2
(,)
To: null and void
“The definition of Natural Born Citizen is at the core of the issue.”
______________________________________
That is just one of two issues, and there is a lot of confusion over the meaning.
Some claim that the issue is clear on “two citizen parents”,
but I have not seen any clarification of the matter.
Obama’s father was clearly not a US citizen.
The other issue is his place of birth and a LEGITIMATE
birth certificate.
Everything released by the administration seems to be
highly questionable as to authenticity.
On top of that, the purported birth hospital, Kapiolani
seems to be mute on the subject on grounds of confidentiality, but that could be cleared by Obama.
Everything about Obama’s birth and early childhood has been totally cloaked in secrecy. Why is that?
25
posted on
03/21/2012 8:31:15 PM PDT
by
AlexW
To: tommix2
Because he cannot. Revealing his past would destroy him. Not revealing his past will eventually destroy him.
His past will literally devour him at some point.
26
posted on
03/21/2012 8:31:39 PM PDT
by
Texas Fossil
(Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one)
To: PhilosopherStone1000
I watched his debate with Ted Kennedy in 94 and I remember him talking about how he was better on “gay rights,” I read his column he wrote as a private citizen calling the flat tax a “tax break for fatcats,” I recall him saying he didn’t support Reagan as an independent, I have read how his judicical appointments rule that schools must allow boys to wear skirts & nail polish to school, and Romneycare is the model for Obamacare. I’ve seen his questionare for planned parenthood. Please tell me how voting for a liberal is okay or justified..I dare say you’re the troll.
To: Texas Fossil
Amen to that..that would be a day to rejoice.
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
Sorry Noob, no way someone who’s been here a week can “hurt my feelings”.
We try to nominate the most conservative candidate we can, and then vote ABO. Because there really is a difference.
Don’t expect me to come to your rescue when BATFE decides you’re a threat to the Won because you let the best become the enemy of the better and had a nose too pretty to plug when it comes to voting.
Win this one, and then win the next one. This fight has been going on for almost 80 years. It’s not going to end in November.
To: Texas Fossil
We should relentlessly demand that he show us evidence that he is eligible to be president. He can not. So we continue to call him on it, without letup. And that includes all the people trying to get the Republican nomination. Anyone who has a soapbox and remains silent is guilty.
30
posted on
03/21/2012 8:41:16 PM PDT
by
tommix2
(,)
To: AlexW
31
posted on
03/21/2012 8:42:27 PM PDT
by
Godebert
(NO PERSON EXCEPT A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN!)
To: PhilosopherStone1000
Most conservative, you say, but you overlook the glaring fact that Mitt Romney is not conservative..even you acknowledge he’s a RINO. How does voting for a liberal advance conservatism? That’s wrong on so many levels and I hope for a brokered convention.
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
If you're seriously interested in the issue, there's an excellent link at post #15.
If you're a troll, you won't last the night in here.
I'm betting the latter, given your requesting that a FReeper send me the files, I'm on my phone as tho you were ordering a pizza and/or we exist to cater to your professed ignorance.
But I've already been wrong once this year, so will reserve judgement for the moment . . .
33
posted on
03/21/2012 8:45:41 PM PDT
by
tomkat
(FU.baraq)
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
Hello, new member from Mar 4, 2012.
If you are serious in your request, here's some information.
Someone said:
"Hawaii will issue birth certificates for children born outside of Hawaii, as a number of other states will do.
However, those certificates show the birth location as a foreign country"
I responded:
"Not it the parents LIE, and "say" the child was born in Hawaii, but provide no proof, such as a Birth Certificate with a foot print on it."
The ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT IN CHIEF has
forged ...yes, I said FORGED, as in FRAUD, FALSE, ...he has FORGED not one, not two, BUT THREE FAKE BIRTH CERTIFICATES.
Here's
something to ponder.
I think it more likely that the trip from Kenya actually occurred in August 1961, shortly after BHO-II's birth at the Coast Province General Hospital in Mombasa. Ann and her newborn son flew from Nairobi to London, via BOAC Flight BA162 and then took the non-stop BOAC flight from London to Vancouver, Canada. She then traveled the 110 miles or so, across the border, to Seattle in time to start Fall Semester, night-school extension classes at the University of Washington.
The trip would be challenging for a new mother, but she was young, healthy, intelligent, and capable. BOAC was very accomodating to mothers with young children back in the 1960s. No real problem!
From the Airline Timetable Images - List of Complete Timetables, the cost of BOAC from April 24,1960 until October 1, 1962 was:
From Vancouver to Nairobi cost in Canadian Dollars: Single Return
DL 1115.00 2026.80
F 1055.50 1918.80
T 764.00 1396.00
Y 701.00 1282.60
Passanger Fares could be "FLY NOW AND PAY LATER".
Arrangements could be made whereby residents of certain areas may, on payment of a 10% deposit, travel immediately and pay the balance of fare in monthly instalments.
If you're wondering about where the money came from, think about this.
Look at all the financial supporters Barack Hussein Obama, Sr. had."In 1959, Obama Sr. received a scholarship in economics through a program organized by nationalist leader Tom Mboya.
The program offered Western educational opportunities to outstanding Kenyan students.[22][23][24]
Initial financial supporters of the program included Harry Belafonte, Sidney Poitier, Jackie Robinson, and Elizabeth Mooney Kirk,
a literacy advocate who provided most of the financial support for Obama Sr.'s early years in the United States, according to the Tom Mboya archives at Stanford University.
Funds provided the following year by John F. Kennedy's family paid off old debts of the project and subsidized student stipends,
thereby indirectly benefiting Obama Sr. and other members of the 1959 group of scholarship holders.
Yes, it's quite clear that money wasn't a problem for the Marxists Revolutionaries.
Passanger Information for that time frame can be found here.
Connections from Nairobi - Lusaka - Salisbury can be found here.
The BOAC World Routes Map is found here.
Departure arrival times from Britian to Nairobi are found here.
Departure arrival times for London and Vancouver are found here.
Now think about those facts,and statements, then ...
Consider these witnesses:
Let's examine how Hawaii legally can issue bcs for those born out of stateand then hide this factby issuing a certificate stating BORN IN HAWAII OAHU HONOLULU"
I refer you to Birth Certificate Vs. Certification Of Live Birth.
We just did a story bringing to light how
To say that we started a firestorm would be putting it mildly.
We had our fair share of rational responses,
as well as the usual off-topic comments, accusations of being right-wing nuts, etc.
As well as a few that were too obscene to put into print.
It turns out that our theorythat the document presented by Obama appears to be homemade has some support,
Our friend Pamela at Atlas Shrugs also presents a compelling case
And for you Obamanites
Pay close attention to the following Hawaiian legal statute:
“[§338-17.8] Certificates for children born out of State. (a) Upon application of an adult or the legal parents of a minor child,
the director of health shall issue a birth certificate for such adult or minor, provided that proof has been submitted to the director of health
that the legal parents of such individual while living without the Territory or State of Hawaii
had declared the Territory or State of Hawaii as their legal residence for at least one year immediately preceding the birth or adoption of such child.
(b) Proof of legal residency shall be submitted to the director of health
in any manner that the director shall deem appropriate.
The director of health may also adopt any rules pursuant to chapter 91
that he or she may deem necessary or proper to prevent fraudulent applications for birth certificates
and to require any further information or proof of events
necessary for completion of a birth certificate.
(c) The fee for each application for registration shall be established by rule adopted pursuant to chapter 91.
Everybody get that?
As long as an adult can walk into Hawaii’s version of the Department of Records
and provide proof that they (the parents) are a legal resident of Hawaii,
the document is issued.
The child, on the other hand, could have been born in Hawaii, KENYA, or a back-alley in Budapest.
How much more proof do you disciples of the Messiah need before you will admit that there are legitimate reasons to demand answers on this issue?
Of course the fact that Obama may have been elected to our nation’s highest office in direct violation of the United States Constitutionis NOT something that would greatly trouble a dedicated Kool-Aid drinker.
But you STILL WON'T ACCEPT THE TRUTH that Barack Hussein Obama II ...is ... THE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANT IN CHIEF!!!
Here is some more information and links
and all of this without using the link to "the source of the "moderator-offending-video" by a group called The Council of Conservative Citizens.
This is NOT a Conservative group, do not be fooled by the name.
This group is a front group for a neo-Nazi group known as the National Alliance and is associated with Stormfront.
(But I don't see how those groups are MORE OFFENSIVE THAN the Marxists and Fascists in the White House.)
I have several witnesses, that have proven to me that Barack Hussein Obama II was born in Kenya.
First witness, Barack Hussein Obama II himself:
Hmm…An AP story from 2004 entitled Kenyan-born Obama all set for US Senate has been discovered on archive.org by many sites (and twitter where I got this). Does this mean now that the AP is nothing but a bunch of birthers?
Kenyan-born US Senate hopeful, Barrack Obama, appeared set to take over the Illinois Senate seat after his main rival, Jack Ryan, dropped out of the race on Friday night amid a furor over lurid sex club allegations. ...
The above artice is also found at FreedomsPhoenix.com.
They have a great spoof Birth Certificate you just gotta' see.
Also view the video at Proof Obama Admits He Was Born In Kenya.
Second witnesses, his mother and father, indirectly through their divorce papers.Ed Hale, aprivate investigator in Hawaii, has uncovered the divorce decree for Barack Obamas father and mother, which indicates they had one child under the age of eighteen, born in Kenya.
But a later Update 1/1/2009,... "In his 7:45pm Plains Radio broadcast, this last night, Ed Hale backed down from his prior assertion of having gained even uncertain information about the Barack Sr. / Stanley Ann divorce decree containing language referring to Barack Jr. as being born in Kenya. Instead, Hale referred to an apparently tricky recollection... of an ... referring to such a document's generally referring to the place of birth of the children of the divorced parents."
I believe that "indeterminate person" probably SAW the Obama Dunham Divorce Documents BEFORE Page 11 disappeared and viewed the Kenyan Birth Cerfiticate,
thereby telling Ed Hale "the divorce decree for Barack Obamas father and mother, indicates they had 'one child under the age of eighteen, born in Kenya.' ".
The Obama Dunham Divorce Documents are viewable at this location.
There's a great assumption of the time lime at at link.
See the whole Obama 1964 divorce on Scribd.com or as 13 individual images below (in proper order):
I immediately called the clerk in Hawaii and asked where the extra page was. She looked, and counted, and said that there must be some mistake in the records she counted only 13 pages that are available for reprint. I pointed out to her that the page count she sent skipped from page 10 to page 12 page 11 was missing. To that, she suggested that perhaps the pages were simply misnumbered before they where archived into the microfiche.
I accepted her answer, not thinking much about it at the time. Perhaps it was just a clerical error in the 1960s, when hand-filed paper records and IBM punch cards were how court documents were tracked and maintained.
I have since come to learn that Obama and his team of lawyers have been working to sanitize his records since he announced that he’d run for President circa November 2004. Now in the White House, hes still ACTIVELY blocking subpoenas for such documents as his Cambridge and Occidental College records TODAY the same type of documents promised to be made available during his campaign. Obama and his lawyers are exceedingly adept at exploiting loopholes in Hawaiian birth certificate law to keep Obamas past hidden from the American people.
This missing page page 11 very likely is a copy of the original birth certificate, based upon the prima facie timeline of the 1964 divorce. The Kenya birth certificate was likely requested on Jan 23, 1964 by either Judge King (to award custody on the next trial date), or recommended to Ann Dunham by her attorney for the ex parte divorce, where only one parent was expected to be present.
The missing page, 11, should be chronologically-numbered as all other pages were in the original docket file, by the court clerk at the time. Starting at page 8, Exhibit A is placed where it would have occurred by date in the paperwork (and appeared on microfiche), even denoting an erased, yet barely-readable “8″ on both pages of the returned notification sent to Obama SR. The missing page, numbered as page 11, would likely be a page that would have been admitted to the divorce file sometime in mid- to late-February 1964 almost as if it were an undocumented Exhibit B.
Heres a very plausible timeline merging the 1964 Obama Divorce papers and new Kenya birth certificate:
Jan 20 (Mon) divorce request is filed by Stanley Ann D. Obama
Jan 23 (Thur) divorce orders for trial are given by Judge King at chambers
(note if the judge, or Ann Dunhams attorney, told her to order the Kenya birth certificate, it would have been mailed 10,000 miles away, to the Coast Province Registrars office of the Republic of Kenya, likely arriving around the first week of February 1964 to be processed)
Jan 28 (Tue) Gail A. Watanabe, presumably an assistant of Ann Obama attorney George Kerr, mails the notification for trial to Obama SR (her affidavit is signed Feb 3 and filed)
Jan 30 (Thur) via Air Mail, notification of trial arrives at Obama SRs Cambridge, Mass, address. The 10-day “knock and nail” notification would have expired on Sun, Feb 9. Therefore, the next trial date would have been automatically set, per Judge Kings instructions, for the first Tuesday, 30 days later, on March 3
Feb 10 (Mon) allowing for a 10-day knock and nail notification for trial, Obama SR’s trial notification would have been retrieved by the US Post Office on this date, to be mailed back (as events turned out UNSIGNED by Obama SR) to Hawaii as an exhibit for trial
Feb 17 (Mon) the Obama Kenya birth certificate is signed by the Coast Province Deputy Registrar, to be mailed back to Hawaii for receipt by Ann Obama and/or her attorney (note: mail time would have ranged from a few days (Air Mail) to a couple of weeks (ship), arriving back in Hawaii in the last week of February to first week of March 3 (Tue). Based upon Judge Kings Jan 23 orders for the next trial date, “at 9:30 a.m. on the first Tuesday after thirty (30) days have elapsed from and after the date” that Obama SR would have been served with the notice of trial. That notification came back, unsigned, by Obama SR, so Anns attorneys surely requested, and received Default Judgment for the divorce in her favor for grievous mental suffering
Mar 5 (Thur) trial takes place in favor of divorce in Hawaii, placing custody of Obama JR to his mother by default (note: the trial was likely rescheduled 2 days after the automatically set date of Mar 3, possibly for the convenience of the judge and/or parties)
Mar 20 (Fri) the divorce decree is signed by Judge King
In Hawaii, birth certificates are not Public Record. If the Kenya birth certificate was a part of the divorce decree, it may have been pulled out at the end of the trial, or more recently by a watchful archivist or attorneys wishing to remove unfavorable information about Obama.
To date, despite other honest attempts to refute the Kenya birth certificate, such as dealing with when the Republic of Kenya came into existence as a republic have been un-bunked. Dishonest alterations of the Kenya birth certificate have been maliciously created by sites such as Democratic Underground, designed to discredit the Kenya birth certificate theyve been un-bunked as well.
Having not actually seeing the Kenya birth certificate, and its chain of evidence, no intellectually-honest person can say if its real or not. By the same token, none of us have seen or touched the short-form Certification of Live Birth that has appeared on Obamas Fight the Smears or FactCheck.org websites.
No one can confirm the chain of evidence of Obamas Certification of Live Birth that has appeared online, which is the abbreviated-version of Obamas true, 1961, original long-form(s) Certificate of Live Birth and associated vital statistics records. Even the Hawaii Department of Health directly refuses to verify Obamas online COLBs.
Third witness, is Barack Hussein Obama II's grandmother,Sarah Hussein Obama:
View the video Barack Obama - Born in Kenya II at Youtube.com.
Did Obama's grandmother say he was born in Kenya?The Oct. 16, 2008, telephone interview was conducted by American Christian minister Ron McRae, who describes himself in his affidavit as an overseer of the Anabaptist Churches in North America and a "Presiding Elder on the African Presbytery."
McRae, who called from Detroit, says Sarah Obama was in a public setting with several hundred people listening to the telephone call on a speakerphone. The interpreter was Vitalis Akech Ogombe, the community chairman of Sarah Obama's village of Nyang'oma Kogelo in Western Kenya, 30 miles west of the Lake Victoria-city of Kisumu.
"In the ensuing public conversation, I asked Ms. Obama specifically, 'Were you present when your grandson was born in Kenya?'"
McRae testified in his sworn statement. "This was asked to her in translation twice, and both times she replied, "Yes! Yes she was! She was present when Obama was born."
Watch and LISTEN to the video BARACK OBAMA - BORN IN KENYA - The Documentary - STUNNING!
and prove it to yourself.
Also watch Affidavit and Tape-Proof Obama Born in Kenya.
The fourth witness, Tim Adams,"Barack Obama was definitely not born in Hawaii as the White House maintains, and that a long-form, hospital-generated birth certificate for Obama does not even exist in the Aloha State."
(It is now confirmed by Hawaii that Tim Adams did indeed work as a senior elections clerk in 2008)
Election official: I'd testify Obama not born in Hawaii
"The things I've said, I don't mind testifying in court," Tim Adams, the senior elections clerk for the city and county of Honolulu in the 2008 campaign, told WND in an exclusive interview.
"I was working there, and this is what it was. I'm not a lawyer, just a civil servant. I know what I know. I know what I was told by the hospitals and by my supervisors."
"There is no birth certificate," he said. "It's like an open secret. There isn't one. Everyone in the government there knows this."
"I had direct access to the Social Security database, the national crime computer, state driver's license information, international passport information, basically just about anything you can imagine to get someone's identity," Adams explained. "I could look up what bank your home mortgage was in. I was informed by my boss that we did not have a birth record [for Obama]."
At the time, there were conflicting reports that Obama had been born at the Queen's Medical Center in Honolulu, as well as the Kapi'olani Medical Center for Women and Children across town. So Adams says his office checked with both facilities.
"They told us, 'We don't have a birth certificate for him,'" he said. "They told my supervisor, either by phone or by e-mail, neither one has a document that a doctor signed off on saying they were present at this man's birth."
To date, no Hawaiian hospital has provided documented confirmation Obama was born at its facility.
Adams, 45, stressed, "In my professional opinion, he definitely was not born in Hawaii. I can say without a shadow of a doubt that he was not born in Hawaii because there is no legal record of him being born there. If someone called and asked about it, I could not tell them that person was born in the state."
WND confirmed with Hawaiian officials that Adams was indeed working in their election offices during the last presidential election.
"His title was senior elections clerk in 2008," said Glen Takahashi, elections administrator for the city and county of Honolulu.
Adams oversaw a group of 50 to 60 employees and was responsible for verifying the identity of voters, especially absentee voters.
"If you're working in the civil service and you say this, you're done," Adams said. "Don't expect to have a good career, especially since the governor is on the other side. Embarassing them is not good for your career."
The Fifth witness, Michelle Obama.
The Sixth Witness, Kenyan Ambassador Peter Ogego:
The Seventh Witness, James Orengo (the Kenyan Parliament Minister of Lands): The Eighth Witness, Lucas Daniel Smith, has been banned from Free Republic, so I cut him out, but you can do a search and find what he has.
And finally, an outstanding video to watch,
Case CLOSED!!!
Now ... think about it.
34
posted on
03/21/2012 8:45:49 PM PDT
by
Yosemitest
(It's simple, fight or die!)
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
either way true conservatism loses as the left pushes us further out.I agree.
35
posted on
03/21/2012 8:46:38 PM PDT
by
tommix2
(,)
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
Actually, you sound ok so far .. welcome to FR
36
posted on
03/21/2012 8:51:53 PM PDT
by
tomkat
(FU.baraq)
To: tommix2
"Anyone who has a soapbox and remains silent is guilty."Amen, brother.
If the republicans refuse to uphold their sworn oath to protect and defend the Constitution, why should any Citizen award them their vote?
The only vote they'll get from me is Guilty!
37
posted on
03/21/2012 8:51:53 PM PDT
by
Godebert
(NO PERSON EXCEPT A NATURAL BORN CITIZEN!)
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
Let me tell you something before I really hurt your feelings: I am not voting for a liberal RINO under any circumstance! You can sell your soul and your principles ... You and your "principles" are a threat to my children's future.
If you stay home this election, you are beneath contempt.
38
posted on
03/21/2012 8:52:20 PM PDT
by
tsomer
To: tomkat
I am interested in whether the PRESIDENT of the United States is eligible and I’m not going to be demeaned for asking because you have mixed messages coming from Coulter..Ben Shapiro evenyt knocked the issue. I don’t support Romney and that’s final. I can hold my own.
To: Advocatus Sancti Sepulchri
A brokered convention will go to the Rep Establishment candidate (which, if you haven’t noticed, is Romney). It will only serve to damage the brand and help Dumb0.
Would it be nice to have a strong, conservative candidate who can manage to get through three debates without looking like an idiot? Of course.
But you go to war with the army you’ve got. If Romney is the army I’ve got, I’ll vote for him to staunch the blood while continuing to search for a Grant to win the war.
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