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To: Sherman Logan
You should read more history. Even the Mitanni worshiped Vedic, not Persian or Sumerian Gods--the names of the Mitanni are clearly Indian Sanskrit. Ancient India included large parts of today's Iran/Persia as well as Afghanistan. It is in these places that Alexander was stopped after defeating the Persians. If you push back the dates before the known Persians you will clearly see that groups of Indians from Today's Iran/Persia migrated to the middle east and Egypt. Much later, people from these areas went onto establishing coastal cities and empires around the Mediterranean sea--the Greeks, Phoenicians, Carthaginians etc etc. Because these people had already been influenced by Vedic religions and language in the middle east, their languages and religions/gods are mirrored on them. You will observe that Northern European languages are not Indo-european. When the English and Germans found the link, the major problem became that European civilizations were established by immigrants. Protestant and Catholic issues also influenced their decision as they did not want to lend more historic authority to the Italians. They went the Tomato route of instead saying that the civilizations of all known ancient metropolises were established by the 'Aryans' a term that in Sanskrit means anyone Noble, a gentleman, a good person. Where did the Aryans come from? they simply picked a middle place between the Europe and India. The problem is that only Indians used the word Arya to describe themselves. Ancient Persians used it, but again ancient Persia was part of India--even their ancient religion Zoroastrianism, is derived from Vedic scriptures and names, hence the use of the term. All of these reasons are sufficient for Indians to be upset at the notion of 'Aryans' coming to India--the real reason is more complex. Indian religions are not like Abrahamic faiths--that is, they don't have prophets sent by God--just Teachers/Gurus/Buddhas/Tīrthaṅkaras. These teachers/gurus/Buddhas/Tīrthaṅkaras are exalted because they speak the truth. The literal truth. It is the truth because in Ancient India it had to be debated in the same fashion as modern scientific proofs in the west are used today. (This is a major reason why many modern physicists read the Vedas because of the descriptions on the nature of the universe) Because there is nothing in the texts, stories or traditions of ever having originated anywhere outside of ancient India--just the opposite infact of clearly stating that Indians are from India--the result is that basically, Europeans are saying their teachers/gurus/Buddhas/Tīrthaṅkaras are lying. It shatters the foundation on which Indian thoughts on human nature and God progresses. The English used it for this very function as they wished to convert Indians into Christians and were having difficulties in the debates on why conversion was beneficial. The same thing had happened to the Muslims in India, a big reason Sufism is so like Dharmic not Abrahamic faiths. So you see, if today people accuse Jesus of lying, Christian people would be upset. Similarly Indians are upset at the idea of their Teachers lying. Throw in the current DNA mapping of modern Indians which show negligent outside genetic material and the show becomes popcorn worthy.
46 posted on 12/14/2011 9:32:13 PM PST by Salt
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To: Salt

Fortunately there has been an upsurge in interest in the real history of India and many archeologists, from what I have read, are doing serious research. British indologists purposely lied about the antiquity of the Vedas and India’s ancient history to try to convince educated Indians that Europe was superior and that India was barbaric. The British needed to fabricate a false history of India. The Aryan invasion is part of that false history.


47 posted on 12/14/2011 10:09:35 PM PST by little jeremiah (We will have to go through hell to get out of hell.)
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To: Salt
You should read more history. Even the Mitanni worshiped Vedic, not Persian or Sumerian Gods--the names of the Mitanni are clearly Indian Sanskrit.

Quite accurate. However, the common point of view is that the Mitanni and Aryans are descended from a common group off the steppes, one group going SW into the Middle East, and the other SE into India.

If you push back the dates before the known Persians you will clearly see that groups of Indians from Today's Iran/Persia migrated to the middle east and Egypt.

I have seen this claim made, but I have never seen anything but speculation to support it.

You will observe that Northern European languages are not Indo-european.

Actually, they are. All European languages are Indo-European, with the minor exceptions of those in the Basque and Uralic families.

Thanks for your attempt to explain why Indians are offended by the commonly accepted (outside India) theories of the populating of India.

I assume you do realize there is a general skin color gradient in India from lightest in the NW to darkest in the SE. The most logical explanation of this is that a different group entered from this direction and its genetic contribution became less with distance from point of entry.

The linguistic evidence parallels this. In particular, there is a linguistic principle whereby the diversity of a given language or language group is greatest near its point of origin. This has been applies to track the movement of many language groups back to their origin, including the Bantu and Austronesian groups. Even for the English language, the UK has many more accents and dialects than the much larger Engligh-speaking population of North America. Using this principle for the Indo-European languages, you wind up with a point of origin somewhere around the Urals.

My understanding is that the genetic evidence is not nearly as one-sided as you claim.

No offense, but to an unprejudiced outside observer, the violent resistance by some in India to the generally accepted scientific evidence looks like compensation for an inferiority complex. The claims I've read look like an attempt to find ammunition for a pre-determined position rather than a search for truth.

Science doesn't take the ancient myths of any people, by themselves, as valid evidence of the origin of peoples, so Indians shouldn't be so upset about it.

48 posted on 12/15/2011 6:54:45 AM PST by Sherman Logan
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