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New analysis suggests Civil War took bigger toll than previously estimated
Binghamton University ^ | September 21, 2011 | Unknown

Posted on 09/21/2011 12:54:16 PM PDT by decimon

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1 posted on 09/21/2011 12:54:23 PM PDT by decimon
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To: SunkenCiv

Semi-sunken ping.


2 posted on 09/21/2011 12:55:37 PM PDT by decimon
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To: decimon
Hacker realized that civilian deaths were so low relative to soldiers' deaths that he could compare the number of native-born men missing in the 1870 Census relative to the number of native-born women missing and produce an estimate from that.

Something we can be proud of with regard to our civil war.

In most civil wars down through history civilians died in greater numbers than soldiers, often as a significant multiple.

3 posted on 09/21/2011 1:04:47 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: decimon
I would contend the Civil War or War Between the States (whatever one wishes to call that war) never ended. There were brief interruptions known as WWI and WWII. That war continues to this very day and will continue till another interruption ... imho
4 posted on 09/21/2011 1:06:20 PM PDT by no-to-illegals (Please God, Protect and Bless Our Men and Women in Uniform with Victory. Amen.)
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To: decimon

An odd personal story on the Civil War. My GGGrandfather fought for Ohio. He was shot on the right side of his head and survived but was blind and deaf on the right. 60 years later, at the age of 80, he was hit and killed by a car. It was on his right and he never saw nor heard it. So 60 years later, the Civil War was peripherally responsible for his death.


5 posted on 09/21/2011 1:07:01 PM PDT by DJ MacWoW (America! The wolves are here! What will you do?)
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To: decimon

A civil war in modern America would leave millions of non combatants dead. The cities would be pure hell inside of two weeks. No electricity, no food, no sanitation, no medicines.....


6 posted on 09/21/2011 1:07:13 PM PDT by cripplecreek (A vote for Amnesty is a vote for a permanent Democrat majority. ..Choose well.)
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To: Sherman Logan

What about the next one?


7 posted on 09/21/2011 1:07:49 PM PDT by Attention Surplus Disorder (Madoff screwed the rich. Bernanke screwed us all.)
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To: decimon

Not really surprising, with so many thousands of wounded left after the battles.

There are many stories of soldiers going home to die, rather than waiting to die in the disease-ridden death camps called “Field Hospitals” in those days.

These likely would not have been accounted for.


8 posted on 09/21/2011 1:08:52 PM PDT by tcrlaf (Democrats have been OUTFORCING America's jobs for 40 years)
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To: decimon

Interesting.

I wonder if anyone has ever a done a study of wars and resultant impact on public morality?

If families are disrupted, and men are thrown together away from their homes and relatives, does that create some kind of negative social impact later?

I think of WW2 and what happened with the Baby boomers, the kind of society which developed in the west after the Civil War, etc.


9 posted on 09/21/2011 1:10:10 PM PDT by ZULU (DUMP Obama in 2012)
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To: Sherman Logan

Until Sherman and Sheridan, warfare among “civilized” armies was between field armies primarily - where it belongs.

Sherman and Sheridan started the policy of warfare against civilian populations in modern times and the Brits expanded it to horrific new levels in the Boer War.


10 posted on 09/21/2011 1:14:10 PM PDT by ZULU (DUMP Obama in 2012)
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To: decimon

—If the war were fought today, the number of deaths would total 6.2 million.—

Yes, but the American culture had a completely different attitude about the meaning and impact of life and death in that time.

If the attitudes today were prevelant then, Lee would never have goten men to do a Picket’s charge. But it would have been moot because there is no way the north would have mustered the size of army they did. Not enough men would have been willing to sacrifice their lives to keep the southern states from secceeding. We’d be two countries. And we probably would have been on opposite sides during WWI.


11 posted on 09/21/2011 1:16:47 PM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: decimon
It's an interesting exercise in statistics and demographics..but I wonder to what value? And comparisons aren't relevant when made to diffeent times, different eras. In the Civil War..you have a total of 3 million men under arms on both side..let's take as a given the revised number of 750,000 dead..that 25% fatality rate, but OVER 4 years.. and if we use the accepted ratio that 2/3 died AFTER their wounds..due to sickness/disease...then if we were to compare it to WW II casualty rates..., that's 250,000 KIA, out of 3 million under arm, over FOU YEARs..

Nothing, absolutely nothing, compares to WW I in terms of the efficiency of killing troops. Technology had taken huge leaps, and it faced the old strategy of fixed, positional ( trench) warfare..with massed troops, where the generals viewed the infantry as expendible from the get go.

Take Passchendale..( because it's a finite battle , the stats are easy to analyze).Over a period of a few DAYS, about 600,000 members of the Canadian Forces were thrown into the battle...66,000 were KILLED.. ( and very few from sickness/disease..probably less than 5%) Because of the incredible bombardment..about 50% of the Canadian KIA..were never recovered..they were just vaporized by the artillery.

The Canadians took a few hundred yards of front lines at Passchendale, stabilized the front, and next spring, witht heir first offensive, the Germans recaptured all the land losat.

12 posted on 09/21/2011 1:17:13 PM PDT by ken5050 (Save the EARTH...it's the ONLY planet with CHOCOLATE!!!)
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To: ZULU

So, to quote Captain Kirk, Sherman and Sheridan showed us “why war is a thing to be avoided.”


13 posted on 09/21/2011 1:18:50 PM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
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To: decimon

He correctly notes that disease, not military action, was by far the biggest killer in America’s biggest war.

Modern medicine really dates from Lister’s germ theory of disease, popularized shortly after the US Civil War.


14 posted on 09/21/2011 1:21:36 PM PDT by iowamark
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To: ZULU
If families are disrupted, and men are thrown together away from their homes and relatives, does that create some kind of negative social impact later?

I cannot recall where I read it, but I have read that there were widespread concerns in society about fathers being forced to serve in the military and being away from their children, up to and including WWII. It was felt very strongly that families needed fathers/husbands present, not just as breadwinners (a military paycheck covers that) but as active leaders and a source of authority within the family.

As a result fathers tended to be exempted or ruled out from service through formal or informal measures. Hopefully others here can comment more knowledgeably on that, if you are interested. I also recall that there were proposals to rush back fathers ahead of non-fathers from serving overseas at the end of WWII.

15 posted on 09/21/2011 1:23:09 PM PDT by Liberty1970 (Proud to be a bitter, clinging barbarian hobbit!)
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To: decimon

In my opinion the next civil war will be race/ethnic based and would probably be more brutal than the last. Now that the good times have ended I wonder how much longer that white guilt will be able to keep the immigration floodgates open and what will happen when attempts are made to close them and force out the illegals?


16 posted on 09/21/2011 1:28:29 PM PDT by WMarshal (Where is the next Sam Adams?)
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To: decimon
Would further contend winners and losers have been chosen based on the perceived outcome of the War where brother was against brother. Today brother against brother continues, as the perceived winners (the central government) picks and chooses to continue pitting one group against another group, as was done prior to the Civil War or War Between the States. Government is in the business of picking winners and losers and which groups are pitted against another. This is why the average man, woman, and child is baffled by government. Government wins when the people are confused. People win when the government is confused ... mho
17 posted on 09/21/2011 1:29:21 PM PDT by no-to-illegals (Please God, Protect and Bless Our Men and Women in Uniform with Victory. Amen.)
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To: ZULU
I wonder if anyone has ever a done a study of wars and resultant impact on public morality?

If families are disrupted, and men are thrown together away from their homes and relatives, does that create some kind of negative social impact later?

I'm not sure if it has been studied in any "official" manner, but the presumption has long been that lengthy military deployments are morally challenging.

To use an example from the era of the Napoleonic Wars, I believe it was Admiral Lord Nelson who once remarked that "every sailor is a bachelor when beyond Gibraltar."

18 posted on 09/21/2011 1:32:14 PM PDT by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: ZULU

You may notice my reference was to “civil wars.” Would you care to point out an example of another large-scale civil war where the military/civilian death ratio was equal to or lower than that of ours?


19 posted on 09/21/2011 1:48:16 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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Ever wondered how often the average man, woman, or child confuses the government? Answer —> normally never.


20 posted on 09/21/2011 1:50:10 PM PDT by no-to-illegals (Please God, Protect and Bless Our Men and Women in Uniform with Victory. Amen.)
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