Fighter jets scrambled after UFO follows plane over Athens: jets were scrambled to intercept a UFO

Great info on this thread Quix!

THX THX

I want to be on the most frequent list. In fact it's ok if you capture me, insert a chip in me, and buzz it every time there is an update.

OK,

A knight without armor;

Will put you on the most frequent and all the lists below that.

NO CHIP IMPLANTS ON MY WATCH.

Thx.

Blessings.

UFO PING LIST PING

A) ORIGINAL LARGEST LIST LEAST FREQUENT THOUGH with more dramatic things happening more frequently—can still sometimes be almost daily. More often it probably averages weekly to 2-3 times/week.
B) More frequently but moderate amount of pings/week.
C) More frequently. Can be daily or every other day or so.
D) Can be daily—Quix’s BUDDY UFO PING LIST.
When you choose a level, you are included on all the lower levels as well.

PLEASE let Las Vegas Dave, D.C.Patriot and I know, IF you want on or off the lists. Thanks,

from:

http://www.unknowncountry.com/journal/

Posted by standing order permission of Whitley Strieber. His website is a wealth of thoughtful discussion of the field and related topics and issues:

A New World, if We can Take It
26-Apr-2009

It is now clear that a mistaken policy of 'shoot 'em down' by the United States Government, pursued with vigor at least through the 1950s by the US Air Force, ruined any chance of meaningful contact with our visitors during that period, and up to the present.

Last year, the British Ministry of Defence released documentation indicating that a pair of American pilots, one of them Milton Torres, had been ordered to fire upon a UFO over the United Kingdom on May 20, 1957. Dr. Torres, still very much alive, then came forward and told the story that he had been ordered to keep secret by the Air Force.

The UFO, he said, was the size of an aircraft carrier. When he and the other pilot involved armed their rockets, it simply disappeared from their radars and they did not fire.

This was not the only time that the Air Force engaged UFOs. The reason that this must be true is that the pilots were scrambled without warning, and immediately ordered to fire. There was no need to obtain prior permission from the Ministry of Defence. The orders were already in place and the policy behind them decided. Otherwise, there could have been no scramble order over a foreign country, let alone an order to fire armed missiles over the territory of an allied country without prior permission. They had permission. This is why they were able to act immediately.

It still goes on. Despite Air Force denials, FAA radar records showed conclusively that jets rose to meet the objects that appeared over Stephenville, Texas in 2008, so it can be assumed that, at the very least, the Air Force continues to defend its "airspace" with all the intelligence and usefulness of a yapping terrier.

This policy caused contact to fail. As such, it is not simply the greatest mistake in recorded history but the greatest mistake in the biological history of the species. Certainly, the United States wishes to continue to conceal this secret at almost any cost.

This is because the blocking of contact has had such dire effects. It has blocked our evolutionary path and left us trapped on a planet that is becoming unable to support us and could, more or less at any time, start malfunctioning in ways that could induce a massive dieback of our species.

The mistake was not made only because people like Harry S. Truman and Curtis LeMay were foolish, belligerent and ill-prepared. They had just come out of the most horrific war in history, only to discover that, in the Soviet Union, they had a new enemy every bit as insane as the old one. And now, suddenly, a bizarre and entirely unpredictable presence appears. Pro-Soviet? Communists from another world, perhaps? Or, simply, a fearful new unknown?

Who knows what went through their minds? But the outcome in policy is clear: they decided to protect their airspace.

And now we have to live with the consequences. But do we, really? Might not there be another chance?

Of course there is another chance. But it does not involve our existing authorities and institutions. In fact, it has nothing to do with institutional authority except insofar as it must stand aside in order for contact to proceed.

As matters now stand, if there was an admission at the highest levels of the US government similar to that already made by numerous other governments, there will follow an effort to manage information flow by directing the media to NASA, the US Air Force and such quasi-governmental groups as the MUFON leadership.

However, these groups probably have little to nothing of any value to offer. From all appearances, they think of the situation as involving intelligent entities from another planet or planets who function according to policy and, in some way, have institutions like ours that formulate and direct their policies.

In reality, the way the visitors function and what happens to people in their proximity suggests that they perceive the world very, very differently from the way we do. For example, when you are face to face with the small gray beings that form such a large part of the presence we see, and figure so extensively in its folklore, there is no sense that you are with people. Rather, it's like being with animals who are much more intelligent than you are. This is because there is absolutely no cultural familiarity at all. None.

How can officials engage with somebody whose meaning lies beyond a gap far more vast than that between us and, say, dolphins? We haven't the slightest idea what cetaceans may be saying to each other, or even what language means to them, if anything. And our visitors--even those who appear to engage with us verbally--are far, far more different from us than any earthly species.

No, official control of contact is going to fail just as certainly as the official policy of shoot first has failed. For us to have useful contact, it is going to be necessary to engage directly and personally, and the visitors--thankfully--will regard the end of the final obstacle, which is official denial and belligerent display, as a signal to open themselves to more personal interaction than before.

If, in addition to the end of official denial and the constant scrambling of armed aircraft, there comes a properly constituted and new effort to understand by scientists who work outside of the U.S. government--for example, in the academic community--then there will also be a response. The more accurate the conclusions that enter scientific culture, the richer and more complex the visitors' reaction to them will become. Useful understanding will lead to the appearance of more information.

The release of the much vaunted "secret knowledge" supposedly in possession of the US government probably doesn't much matter. It has most likely been obtained, for the most part, by people who lacked any real ability to interact with our visitors, and not only has little value, it might even be tainted by inaccuracies, incorrect conclusions and falsehoods that are designed to make us feel a need to hide behind the authority of the very institutions that would be releasing the supposed 'bombshells,' in an effort to terrify us into preserving them.

One of the visitors once said that what was on offer for mankind was 'a new world, if you can take it,' meaning both that we must be able to wrest it from their hands, and to bear it when we do.

Certainly, the government and its associated entities have a role to play. It remains up to them to find the courage to disclose the truth, which is that they know that an unknown intelligence is present here. Beyond that, the primary directions contact will take are two. First, and most important, it will be between individuals and the visitors, without any institutional barrier such as some NASA or Air Force officials directing our actions or laws restricting or channeling contact. Second, it will involve scientists working publicly on data that can be readily obtained in dozens of different ways, to make sense of contact in terms that are meaningful to us.

Thus the evolutionary process that was interrupted in the 1940s can resume. The beginning of it is now quite clear: government admits the validity of the phenomenon, then steps aside and lets the people work to forge it into a human reality.

If and when this happens, history will look upon it for what it will prove to be: the end of the first stage of human evolution and the beginning of the second. It is that large a change.

Of course, if they do nothing, then it will proceed anyway, but only when the social order has so broken down that government can no longer offer resistance to the visitors, and the people are sufficiently desperate to turn to them anyway. Under conditions of such chaos and suffering, though, it will be far less effective, and what might take fifty or a hundred years during a period of organized social patterns such as we enjoy now, will take thousands of years, and may even require a whole new cycle of collapse to complete itself.

So, a great deal rides on whether or not a single man has the courage to tell the truth. "Ladies and gentlemen, we have known for some time that a nonhuman intelligence appears to be present here. Beyond that, we have learned little of any value. Our own forces will now stand down, in the hope and expectation that the people and public sector science can learn more, and gain for mankind the value that appears to be available to us."

That would be the first step in what would become, truly, a journey to a new world.

Quix’s commentary . . . on Whitley’s Journal piece above . . .

It could be construed that Whitley is prepping us for just what he outlines . . . either on instructions or because he’s inferred such a scenario . . . or maybe even because the ‘ET’s’ have described such a scenario to him—though I think he’d have told us if that were the case.

However, (sorry, Whitley), that’s just toooo tidy, for me. That is, there is inherent in such a scenario toooo many tidy assumptions about how the critters intend our . . . transition, ‘evolution’ to be constructive, positive or some such.

Normally Whitley is quite careful to avoid characterizing the critters as positive or negative. He has tended to say he didn’t know—for lo these many years.

Is he coming out of the closet, now . . . affirming them as positive change agents? Sad, imho, if so.

He, above most, has been traumatized extensively by their not so kind interactions with him.

I certainly agree with his castigations of the government—and particularly, by inference, of the shadow government actually in control.

Though, in terms of patriotic folks, it is only fair to note, how can any of us at this point in time be overly judgmental of choices made 60 years ago in THAT CONTEXT, THEN?

I would like to see Whitley have an experience . . . and call on Jesus in the midst of the experience and observe what the critters did then.

Of course, they might respond as the demoniac did in the New Testament when some Johnny come lately’s tried to cast the demons out “by Jesus Whom Paul preaches.”

The demons noted: “Jesus I know and Paul I know. But who are you?” . . . and then tore into them, IIRC.

The critters are in cahoots with the oligarchy toward setting up the global government The Bible warns us about in this era in which Israel became a Nation again in a day in 1948 just as predicted in Scripture.

They cannot be supportive of satan’s efforts in such regards and be any sort of nice, trustworthy, beneficial etc. unless such temporary ‘benefits’ are part of an elaborate seduction.

Avoid drinking the Kool Aid, folks.

"Avoid drinking the Kool Aid, folks."

When Strieber said this: "It remains up to them [our government & politicians] to find the courage to disclose the truth..." he had me scratching my head, Quix.

What planet's he from. {g}

Yeah.

I think he can be far far toooooo politically correct at times.

La la land in terms of the ‘gummit’ is not a good survival habit, imho.

Russia: Amazing UFO filmed near Moscow, video Sunday, May 03, 2009

Thanks.

will check it out.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2243903/posts

Here’s an interesting thread re the Los Angeles UFO ‘attack’ and counter attack with anti-aircraft guns in 1942

on ATS:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread329188/pg1

posted on 24/1/2008 @ 17:30

The Smoking (Anti-Aircraft) Guns (of Los Angeles, 1942)

Hello fellow ATS members, thanks for stopping by this thread.

I assure you that your time here will not be wasted.

First and foremost, I have a {THEORY} that the ‘Battle of Los Angeles’, once properly investigated, will provide everyone with at least ONE case of a truly Unidentified Flying Object, where the most likely explanation that fits the given evidence is that it was a vessel from somewhere outside of Earth.

To prove this theory, I’ll first be introducing evidence supporting the reality of the event. This will consist of my (as of now incomplete) report on the event, formatted in the usual style of my Compilation posts, so that everyone can find everything I’ve found so far.

I will then ask for ATS members assistance in several ways:
1) Following up the spots in the report where the text [NEED DATA] occurs. The items of evidence (and sources) I have not yet been able to acquire will need finding. I’m going to keep on this case until I have the data for all of these blanks. It is my hope that some of you will join me in the pursuit of this data.

2) Debunk the crap out of all of it please. That’s right, I’m asking for all of the skeptics here to step up and weigh in on the evidence, once posted, in this thread. I think that every possible explanation needs to be considered, and there is no better team of individuals fit to analyze this data that the collective group of skeptics here at ATS. Perhaps one of us will come up with some rational earthly explanation for this event, to date I haven’t been able to do so on my own, and I’d like help from the pros!

3) There are several questions that have never been properly answered pertaining to the details of this event, and I believe that ATS members can work out the values for these variables. These questions will no doubt surface on their own throughout the thread, but here are a few to start:

A) How big is the UFO?
I believe that we can find out, using math, if we can get values for other variables...
B) Where is the Original LA Times Picture taken?
I believe that we can find out, using math and maps, if we can get values for other variables...
C) What are the specs on the AA guns? The Lights? etc.?
I believe that we can find out, by researching, and through teamwork.

I think you can see where this is going.
To date (January 24th, 2008) this event has not been explained, and in fact, I’ve yet to even see a place where ALL of the data is actually assembled for a thorough investigation. There have been many attempts at analysis by individuals, each only going so far.

I feel that with our collective resources and determination, we at ATS, skeptics and believers alike, can work together to assemble ALL of the data on this event here in this thread. I further feel that once the data is fully assembled, like any puzzle, the picture revealing the true events of February 24th-25th, 1942 will begin to come clear.

Thanks for your time, stay tuned for my report to date. I need to upload all of the images I’ve acquired so far to Imageshack, so please be patient. I plan to have the entire report (it’s lengthy) up at some point today. As always, the links to pertaining ATS threads where this event has already been discussed (I’ve scoured them for data already) will conclude the report.

-WFA

Evidence Description:
The Battle of Los Angeles is one of the most well documented UFO Cases of all time, and one of the first with direct involvement by the United States Armed Forces. The term UFO (as is always the case in my posts) is defined herein as: Unidentified Flying Object.

In researching this case I found seriously heated debate from both ‘believers’ and ‘skeptics’, ranging widely over a series of ATS Threads. I also found extensive external sources, mostly at odds over details of the documented event.

This report seeks to combine all of the data relevant to the case into a single comprehensive report, with an easily navigable source indexing. It is the opinion of this author that the comprehensive report allows for comparative analysis of a more productive sort, utilizing a shared database for the sourcing of evidence.

This article further seeks to expand the scope of the investigation into this case to date, by providing detailed maps of the area in question, with the relevant locations and observations plotted accordingly. Further analysis will be provided in the form of specifications for the equipment used by United States Armed Forces during this event. Finally, this thread will provide confirmation where possible, of eye-witnesses to (and victims of) the event, in the form of official documentation issued by the United States Federal Government.

Any of this evidence found lacking in the initial report will be followed up in this thread by myself (and hopefully others).

The History of the 4th AA Command, Western Defense Command, (Also linked below as an ‘Internet Article’): cufon.org...

{B-5} “The Army Air Forces in World War II,” was prepared under the editorship of Wesley Frank Craven, and James Lea Cate. v.1, pp. 277-286, Washington, D.C.: Office of Air Force History: For sale by the Supt. of Docs., U.S. G.P.O., 1983.

Next up are the Newspaper Articles detailing the event, I appreciate your patience, as the formatting takes time...

WATCHERS SHIVER

The fire seemed to burst in rings all around the target. But the eager watchers, shivering in the early morning cold, weren’t rewarded by the sight of a falling plane. Nor were there any bombs dropped. “Maybe it’s just a test,” someone remarked. “Test, hell!” was the answer. “You don’t throw that much metal in the air unless you’re fixing on knocking something down.” Still the firing continued, muttering angrily off toward the west like a distant thunderstorm. The targeted object inched along high, flanked by the cherry red explosions. And the householders shivered in their robes, their faces set, watching the awesome scene.

Many of the links also show an alleged memo from Marshal, explaining that the Army doesn’t know the origins of the attacking craft. This document is still in dispute, but last I checked, majesticdocuments.com, a UFO doc research group, had it listed as high confidence it was authentic.

I’ve seen different debunking attempts, with the two primary ones being a weather balloon (which wouldn’t hold up, due to the reported size of the object, nor would it survive AAA fire that even came close to hitting it) or a small group of Japanese planes (which wouldn’t hold up, again due to the size of the object, as well as the slow movement reported, nor standing up to the AAA fire).

There incidentally, was a Japanese sub attack on the US that night (this was shortly after Pearl Harbor), but it was not of the “carrier” sub type, so this is ruled out as a source for the planes hypothesis anyhow, even with the other reasons ruling out planes.

While I don’t believe it’s mentioned thoroughly in the article, there are some other articles from other local papers, citing that multiple objects were sighted in a V formation along with a larger object.

I’m still digging into this one, but as above, it’s fascinating that this story never really got a lot of attention. I’m supposing that this is because it was technically before the modern UFO era truly began (with Arnold’s sighting in ‘47 generally considered to be the start), but there were some interesting things going on in ‘42 with UFO’s....

FROM:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread118193/pg1

VIDEO LINK:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread287069/pg1

ON MSNBC:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread269781/pg1

EYE WITNESS ACCOUNT:

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread326975/pg1

Around 3:15 a.m., I awoke to the sound of what I initially assumed was distant thunder. But as I came fully awake, I realized that the guns were firing again. At first, I thought they were simply doing another drill, though it seemed awfully late. Moreover, there was something about the rate and intensity of the bombardment that just didn’t seem right, especially after I glanced at my clock. Scotty Littleton’s House on The Strand During 1941 My small bedroom, which was directly over our front door, faced south, and thus my view of the ocean was oblique. However, the sky, or what I could see of, it was filled with blinding searchlights and the bright flashes of exploding rounds. I was, of course, thoroughly familiar with both, thanks to all the target practice I’d witnessed. But heretofore, the searchlights and the explosions had always been well out over the ocean and for the most part invisible from my bedroom windows, at least when I was in bed. This time everything seemed much closer.

SOURCE:

http://www.theufochronicles.com/2006/10/exclusivethe-battle-of-los-angeles.html

Around 3:15 a.m., I awoke to the sound of what I initially assumed was distant thunder. But as I came fully awake, I realized that the guns were firing again. At first, I thought they were simply doing another drill, though it seemed awfully late. Moreover, there was something about the rate and intensity of the bombardment that just didn’t seem right, especially after I glanced at my clock. Scotty Littleton’s House on The Strand During 1941 My small bedroom, which was directly over our front door, faced south, and thus my view of the ocean was oblique. However, the sky, or what I could see of, it was filled with blinding searchlights and the bright flashes of exploding rounds. I was, of course, thoroughly familiar with both, thanks to all the target practice I’d witnessed. But heretofore, the searchlights and the explosions had always been well out over the ocean and for the most part invisible from my bedroom windows, at least when I was in bed. This time everything seemed much closer.

I soon heard my parents talking in the hall, and poked my head out. My father, who was an air raid warden, looked worried and said it didn’t make any sense. He tried to get through by phone to Civil Defense headquarters, but there was no answer (we later learned that the alert had been called at 2:25 a.m., although nobody had bothered to get the word out to local air raid wardens). So, he put on his gear, and went outside to see what was happening.

He soon returned, looking even more worried, and told my mother to get me, my paternal grandparents, who lived with us at the time, and my recently widowed maternal grandfather, who’d been staying with us for a couple of weeks, down to the basement bomb shelter my father had begun building in the afternoon of December 7, ASAP.

Normally, my maternal grandfather was slower than the Second Coming of Christ in his personal habits, that is, in dressing, shaving, etc. But when my father said, “Mr. Hotchkiss, I think this may be the real thing,” he was down in the basement in thirty seconds flat!

As you can imagine, I was equal parts scared and excited and desperately wanted to know what was going on. By this time, my father was back on the street and, belatedly, over the continuing gunfire, we heard the air raid siren finally begin to wail. My mother escorted her in-laws and father down to shelter, which consisted of two small dressing rooms protected by cartons of beach sand stacked in the open basement on either side, and I followed along, despite the fact that I was eager to poke my head outside and watch “the real thing.”

My mother felt the same way. As she said later, after about ten minutes in such cramped quarters—the benches upon which we sat also contained survival items such as a first-aid kit, water bottles, and some canned food—and surrounded by the halitosis exuded by the older generation, she was ready to brave a Jap bomb or two. Indeed, our first thought was that an enemy squadron was overhead, as we began to hear the roar of aircraft engines over the din of the barrage. But they later turned out to our own pursuit planes.

When she exited the basement through the door that led to the beach, I followed close behind her. Although my mother was, of course, apprehensive about my safety, at the same time she understood why I was dying to see what was going on and let me stay.

The two of us stood side by side in front of the house, huddling together in the chill night air and staring up into the sky. The planes we’d heard were not in sight, but what captured our rapt attention was a silvery, lozenge-shaped “bug,” as my mother later described it, that was clearly visible in the searchlight beams that pinpointed it. Although it was a clear, moonlit night, no other details could be discerned, despite the fact that, when we first saw it, the object was hanging motionless almost directly overhead. Its altitude is hard to estimate, especially after all these years, but I’d guess that it was somewhere between 4,000 and 8,000 feet. This may explain why we didn’t see the orange glow reported by several eyewitnesses in Santa Monica and Culver City, where the object was apparently much lower. (One witness suggests that this glow may simply have been the reflection of shell bursts against the object’s “silvery” body.)

BOLA (Cropped In Frame)In any case, anti-aircraft shells were bursting all around the mysterious craft. The noise was almost deafening. And each time a bright red flash occurred, the acrid odor of cordite became more pronounced. Shrapnel was also falling on the beach, and my mother and I backed up against the house to avoid being struck. (The next day we kids salvaged boxes of the stuff off the sand and turned them in for scrap.)

However, between shell bursts, the craft emitted no sound whatsoever. Nor was it acting aggressively.

As we watched, open mouthed, the object, apparently none the worse for the plethora of rounds directed at it, began to move slowly to the southeast, descending over Redondo Beach, where we lost sight of it. Indeed, either our gunners were absurdly inept, despite all the practice they’d had in recent weeks, or it was invulnerable to attack. Years later I read that over 1,400 rounds were fired at the object that evening. The official tally, from the Army’s after-action report, is 1430 rounds, but this figure is probably way too low. Could the Japs have come up with some secret weapon that deflected flack? The thought was scary to the max!

The object later appeared over San Pedro and Long Beach before finally disappearing over the ocean somewhere off southern Orange County or northern San Diego County.

Shortly after my mother and I lost sight of it we once again heard the unmistakable sound of aircraft engines. By then the bombardment had almost petered out, and several Army Air Corps interceptors, P-38s that were probably based at Mines field (today the site of Los Angeles International Airport), approached from the northeast and buzzed off to the southeast, apparently chasing the object.

At that point, it was almost 4:00 a.m. Precisely how long we’d stood there is anybody’s guess, though I suspect that the whole episode, that is, from our leaving the shelter to meeting my father as he returned to house after both the object and the chase planes had disappeared, lasted about twenty-five minutes.

As I recall, the firing ceased shortly thereafter (the “all clear” didn’t actually sound until 7:30 a.m.), but nobody went to bed that night. The next morning’s edition of the Los Angeles Examiner, the local Hearst newspaper, which I still have tucked away safely, came out with a screaming, banner headline: “Air Battle Rages over Los Angeles,” followed by “One Plane Reported Downed on Vermont Avenue by Gunfire” in smaller type. This, of course, seemed at the time to be pure fantasy, typical Hearst yellow journalism, as no bombs fell, nor, apparently, was any plane, Japanese or otherwise, shot down anywhere in Southern California that night. However, in retrospect, the Examiner seems to have been right about one thing. As we’ll shortly see, there’s compelling evidence to support the contention that at least one of our planes did in fact crash (or crash-land) on South Vermont Avenue that morning

But what precisely had we witnessed?