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To: TigersEye; js1138
The problem comes from religious belief as espoused by, for example, Answers in Genesis.

They have a Statement of Faith on their website, to which all members must adhere.

Some of the tenets (under "General") are:

  1. Scripture teaches a recent origin for man and the whole creation.

  2. The days in Genesis do not correspond to geologic ages, but are six [6] consecutive twenty-four [24] hour days of Creation.

  3. The Noachian Flood was a significant geological event and much (but not all) fossiliferous sediment originated at that time.

  4. The "gap" theory has no basis in Scripture.

  5. The view, commonly used to evade the implications or the authority of Biblical teaching, that knowledge and/or truth may be divided into "secular" and "religious," is rejected.
  6. No apparent, perceived or claimed evidence in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the Scriptural record.

When someone believes all of these points they cannot take science literally, because science flatly contradicts these points.

They have to either ignore science, or somehow twist science all out of whack to make it coincide with their beliefs. If tens of thousands of scientists, the folks who actually know the field, have discovered a particular thing but that thing is contradicted by these points, the scientists have to be wrong. It doesn't matter if the believers don't know how or why they are wrong, it must must be so.

But the most glaring examples of this are the Answers in Genesis types who go forth to tell the world in general, and scientists in particular, both that they are wrong and how they are wrong.

This is where we get the "second law of thermal documents" and the points covered in the Index to Creationist Claims.

And it doesn't do any good to argue with these folks. They have wrapped themselves in their beliefs and will not hear a word you write.

258 posted on 06/21/2008 5:40:12 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.)
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To: Coyoteman
Your last point is probably your most relevant point to the situation here.

They have wrapped themselves in their beliefs and will not hear a word you write.

When taken out of the heart and stuffed in the ear canal beliefs make excellent ear plugs.

The view, commonly used to evade the implications or the authority of Biblical teaching, that knowledge and/or truth may be divided into "secular" and "religious," is rejected.

That is a real problem right there I think. Religious people who don't have the discriminating wisdom to see the difference between religion, which is a worldly and materialistic thing, and spirituality won't be able to appreciate that religion is about spiritual exploration and science is about material exploration.

Obviously there is an inherent conceptual dichotomy between spiritual and material. But confusion arises in the 'religious' person who thinks that he is standing on spiritual ground when he looks at materiality and separates the religious from it. The distinction is made that the religious person views things from a spiritual POV and everyone else, especially scientists, view things from a material POV.

We live in a material plane and all things, spiritual or material, are viewed and understood from that POV first. That is not a problem for scientists because they're not attempting to find anything outside the material box we all find ourselves in. They know where they are and they're not trying to be anywhere else. They're just looking more closely at the box.

But the religious supplicant is trying to see outside that box and ultimately be outside that box and if they begin to think that trying to see outside it is seeing or being outside it then they have made a grave error in judgment and have lost sight of where they actually stand. They have created a false premise as to where their own thought processes come from.

The result of that is making a false distinction between religious and secular people. There are differences but where we are and what we all have to work with are the same. We are all in this world and we all have a mind. When they decide that they are beyond all that nasty materiality of world and mind arrogance and false pride start to grow like mushrooms after a rain storm.

Ego just loves to tell a person "You're special in every way! (wink wink nudge nudge)"

259 posted on 06/21/2008 7:44:05 PM PDT by TigersEye (Berlin 1936. Olympics for murdering regimes. Beijing 2008.)
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