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What Does the Fossil Record Show?
Creation or Evolution: Does it Really Matter What You Believe? ^ | 1998 | Various

Posted on 07/22/2006 5:35:21 AM PDT by DouglasKC

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To: buffyt

"If there were any such thing as evolution why wouldn't monkeys have evolved, too."

They have. That's why there are many species of monkeys. It's also why old world monkeys differ dramatically from new world monkeys.

Check it out on Google.


61 posted on 07/22/2006 6:56:02 AM PDT by MineralMan (non-evangelical atheist)
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To: McBuff

You mean all women willlook like her in a hundred years?


62 posted on 07/22/2006 6:56:05 AM PDT by Rock N Jones
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To: DouglasKC
You win. Clearly evolutionary science is right up there with flight science. That explains why there are so many people who don't believe that airplanes really fly.

Thanks for your concession.

63 posted on 07/22/2006 6:56:11 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: ohhhh
Mankind has at least a 9000 year "history", and it begins with petroglyphs dating back to 7000 BC (or more) in Finland. There are, of course, even older paintings/drawings in caves, but we're not quite sure what those stories are about.

In the case of the petroglyphs in Finland, many of them are well understood.

64 posted on 07/22/2006 6:58:12 AM PDT by muawiyah (-/sarcasm)
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To: dhuffman@awod.com

As is your nom de 'net. Plumes haven't been used in years.



Not so fast, you can buy them right here:

http://www.libertybellmuseum.com/MuseumShop/quills.htm


65 posted on 07/22/2006 6:58:17 AM PDT by MineralMan (non-evangelical atheist)
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To: Non-Sequitur

You don't know what a theory is, do you?


66 posted on 07/22/2006 6:58:41 AM PDT by ahayes ("If intelligent design evolved from creationism, then why are there still creationists?"--Quark2005)
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To: DouglasKC

When houses and bookshelves begin reproducing themselves, then we can make a comparison. Until then, the comparison makes no sense.


67 posted on 07/22/2006 6:59:47 AM PDT by MineralMan (non-evangelical atheist)
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To: burroak
I am not a middle of the roader. I believe God created everything for a reason. I also believe we do evolve and adapt. Those that don't, die those that do survive. Do not insult people with snide comments. It does not make your case. It is an insult and it brings nothing to the table.
68 posted on 07/22/2006 7:00:19 AM PDT by satchmodog9 (Most people stand on the tracks and never even hear the train coming)
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To: DouglasKC

I am waiting for those arrogantly confident founts of truth on either side of this issue to "ever show us proof" of a majority of what they posit as fact.


69 posted on 07/22/2006 7:02:03 AM PDT by ExpatGator (Extending logic since 1961.)
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To: rockprof

Your response reeks of elitism.

The author didn't use Time and Encarta to prove his case. He cited those works as evidence how the less-advanced texts on evolution oversimplify and draw conclusions based upon our current popular working theories.

Here's his list of actual works cited:

Shattering the Myths of Darwinism, 1997, p. 253

Origin of Species, 1958 Masterpieces of Science edition, pp. 136-137

Science, Vol. 213, p. 289

Reinventing Darwin: The Great Debate at the High Table of Evolutionary Theory, 1995, p. 95

Gould, "Evolution's Erratic Pace," Natural History, May 1977, pp. 13-14

The Neck of the Giraffe: Darwin, Evolution and the New Biology, 1982, pp. 9-10

Niles Eldredge, The Great Debate, p. 131

"Evolution's Erratic Pace," Natural History, May 1977, p. 14


70 posted on 07/22/2006 7:02:56 AM PDT by bw17
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To: Neoliberalnot
BTW, machines don't really "evolve" ~ rather, the idea structure behind a particular machine might "evolve", but all that happens to a machine is that it gets repaired, upgraded, has new parts installed or old ones replaced, or a new design supplants it and it goes into the trash heap of history.

You'd be hard pressed to "evolve" your Honda, for example ~ but you could change the tires.

71 posted on 07/22/2006 7:03:21 AM PDT by muawiyah (-/sarcasm)
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To: Non-Sequitur

The chicken is what God says and I do agree with Him. I apoligize for my mistake.
God created the chicken before there was an egg. Haste makes waste, I wrote in anger.


72 posted on 07/22/2006 7:05:15 AM PDT by ohhhh (...every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.)
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To: Puppage
The face of Helen Thomas is proof enough that the genetic
breakdown of all created species continues. Some just choose to believe lies.
73 posted on 07/22/2006 7:08:36 AM PDT by ohhhh (...every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.)
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To: TN4Liberty
Is that a statement of fact or theory? If a statement of fact, what is the creature and when was it found?

There are an awful lot of transitionals to choose from; maybe the best to illustrate here is Hadrocodium.

This is when people claiming science is on there side fall down.

Still standing.

I'm not anti-science

Of course you're not...

74 posted on 07/22/2006 7:09:10 AM PDT by ToryHeartland (English Football -- no discernable planning whatsoever.)
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To: PhilipFreneau
I look at those examples as God using common parts for building. You can build shelves out of 2x6 pieces of wood and you can build a house out of 2x6 pieces of wood,

To reuse good prior design is a sign of a good engineer.

75 posted on 07/22/2006 7:14:28 AM PDT by poindexters brother
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To: satchmodog9

Adaption and evolution are two different things. Variation within a species is provable.....check out the finches.

Evolution, a wholesale jump it genetic material and the resultant new form is unsupportable on its face. I have never read where a mutation was ever anything but fatal for the mutant. That's considering one gene change...imagine a entirely different life form which intails many, many gene mutations and they are all not only non-fatal but beneficial to the mutant. That idea stretches the credulity of even the anti-God types.....maybe not.

So to make adaptaion within a species and evolution equilevant is just an unclear view of the discussion.

Does this add anything?


76 posted on 07/22/2006 7:16:38 AM PDT by burroak
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To: Puppage

I knew there'd be a Helen Thomas pic somewhere on this thread. Helen and "fossil" are one and the same.


77 posted on 07/22/2006 7:20:21 AM PDT by mass55th (Courage is being scared to death - but saddling up anyway~~John Wayne)
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To: burroak
All the references which you dismiss had ideas in them. Why not argue the issues rather than attacking the sources. If the sources are invalid, I would think a rock professor could dismiss the contents without breaking a sweat.

I've spent years arguing with young-Earth creationists. It's a waste of time and effort. They're immune to evidence, too lazy to learn more than superficially about the science they criticize, and invoke the miraculous when you effectively critique their ideas. You are the one seeking to overturn hundreds of years of science (astronomy, geology, physics, chemistry, biology, etc.) supported by millions of research projects done by tens of thousands of scientists. I think it's up to you to to the legwork showing how we're wrong (and not by juvenile semantic arguments quoting encyclopedia articles).

There is nothing narrower than the mind of a learned liberal professor. You must get rave reviews from you student evaluations. It appears that brow-beating passes for teaching in your classes.

Yes, I'm a professor. I am in no way liberal - you're just exhibiting your anti-intellectual bigotry (professor=liberal). I never brow beat students either but I do try to teach them to think and require that they support their arguments with verifiable evidence - not anecdotes or feelings.

I'm also an evangelical Christian and have taught geology classes at two well-respected Christian Colleges where geologists are not young-Earth creationists (YECs). I've extensively read authors like Henry Morris, Ken Ham, Duane Gish, among many other YECs, have publicly debated some, and attended their talks and conferences. Virtually all the YECs I meet in the pews have never even cracked open a basic science text (yet they "know" we're all atheistic liars).

78 posted on 07/22/2006 7:21:08 AM PDT by rockprof
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To: PhilipFreneau
What evidence?

Oh dear.

Judging the quality and gravity of your response here, you're best bet for catching up on the past 150 years (assuming your question here is sincere) is to keep it simple.

Maybe Sparks Notes?

79 posted on 07/22/2006 7:22:08 AM PDT by ToryHeartland (English Football -- no discernable planning whatsoever.)
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To: MineralMan
When houses and bookshelves begin reproducing themselves, then we can make a comparison. Until then, the comparison makes no sense.

You missed my point. The point was that both items may use 2x6 boards but this doesn't mean that they are related in any way, only that the designer used the same components. Humans and chimps may have similar DNA, but that only means that the designer used similar components. Whether or not the final product reproduces itself is irrelevent to the argument...although I am amazed and humbled at the breadth of wisdom and knowledge that is required to make self-reproducing life.

80 posted on 07/22/2006 7:26:19 AM PDT by DouglasKC
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