Posted on 05/25/2006 5:04:51 AM PDT by abb
Thanks, that is very helpful.
It was on the search warrant, so I assumed they took fingerprints.
Good point. I've wondered if Nifong's 25 years of operating under a system that allowed the prosecutor to decide what to give the defense as "exculpatory" has made him incapable of following the new law which requires him to hand over everything. Cheshire did a great job describing what that means.
At Seligmann's hearing, Judge Stephens brushed off Osborn's motion to compel Nifong to turn over everything by saying frostily that he expected Nifong would do the right thing. Well, so much for that.
Okay, with all the information we got today, reasonable people would think that surely their won't be talking heads mentioning broomsticks and acting like this woman is still credible.
But, don't look for anything to change. This woman has a loyal following, or are they just anti-privileged, white boys?
What do they mean by that? Eventually, there is only one person whom Nifong can hang out to dry if he wants to save himself and that's Mangum. He's gong to claim that he can't be blamed for having believed her.
Wow! I have to say it again. Holy cow! What the heck is Nifong trying to pull here? Somebody has to stop him.
Remind me to stay well clear of Durham.
They keep saying that he can sacrifice the cops to make his case. They are talking about the cop who was talking to his wife on the cell phone about the 20 guys. They say that they can hang this guy out to dry saying he was lying or talking out of school or something. The more we see though the more cops he will have to discredit. Since Crystal tried to run over a cop, I wonder how long these guys will stick with Nifong and as things get worse for him it might prompt a return of the Police Chief to this world.
After the first five minutes of Seligman's hearing, I knew Stephens was bad news.
Stephens broadcasted it loud and clear - if you think I'm going to be the one to stop this runaway train - you are looking at the wrong guy!
From what I heard on 770 WABC Radio, Stephens eats lunch with Nifong once a month and Stephens knows where his bread is buttered.
Stephens grandstanded in that hearing and made sure his sound bytes would give him the biggest bang for his buck.
To his Durham audience, Stephens proclaims this case is not going ahead of any case; these defendants will be treated just like anyone else.
Stephens can play and act like this players are getting treated like everyone else, but I seriously doubt other defendants have the City Manager interviewing beat cops and characterizing their statements in a public report. Other defendants don't have posters made of them (even players that didn't attend the party) and disseminated at 3 University Protests directed at them. Name another defendant that paid for his own Lie Detector test and had to contend with a DA doing 70 National interviews insisting the evidence against them was irrefutable, yet no charges were pending.
Stepens bad act is transparent to everyone that has ever seen a bad politician.
There is a reason that ID is not in there. Would anyone be surprised if they held up some pictures for minutes on end? Would anyone be surprised (if it wasn't recorded) if the investigator said when we interviewed them, we thought this guy was lying to us?
I say there's a reason it wasn't included in discovery. There's a reason there is no video or audio, if that's the case.
Did the cops pick out the ones with money? Or did they give Crystal/Simeon time to figure it out? Then, once she knew who she was looking for, was given another line up? After she met with her buds she probably had much better recall.
The SBI gave verbal notice to Nifong before verification and
extensive compilation of reports. Nifong said in one of his many interviews, before he drastically changed his tone on the DNA, that he was talking to the SBI every day on the phone.
I think (opinion) very early the AV said she COULD NOT identify any players - or she was not consistent in her descriptions. Nifong even said in a interview that DNA is foolproof and eyewitness testimony is problematic. These statements may be telegraphing the eyewitness problems his AV was experiencing. Later, in the same timeframe the SBI gives Nifong bad news from the preliminary testing, Nifong has no choice but to go back to a photo lineup. Something he wanted to avoid due to the AV early failure.
This is very plausible and if this happened, then there's a third lineup or at least earlier attempts to get the AV to ID or describe her assailants.
I cannot believe how bad this has become. It make sme wonder what happens in less visible cases. Somebody at the State level has to see how this is eroding the legitimacy of law enforcement throughout NC. This case is teaching every criminal attorney in NC how to castrate Nifong. CHeshire would do well to start lining up his grounds for appeal. Either the local court has to come clean or the State Supreme COurt is going to do a numbe ron them. Or at least I hope and pray.
These are very good questions. I think it's safe to say that Evans was selected because of the rather weak link to the DNA on the nail. Perhaps Finnerty because of his prior brush with law.
But why Seligmann?
Why not the 4th man? Why didn't investigators follow up on that ID?
Yeah, I saw it too. Any thoughts on how Stephens might view Nifong's latest cock-up? Normally, I'd think a judge would not be pleased.
I don't know, you make good points.
Asset checks take no time and most real estate and tax information is free on-line.
It wouldn't have taken much time at all for her handlers to come up with some names.
I guess that they are two separate theory trains.
The Cops wouldn't pick guys with money. The cops did know about Finnerty's and Evans previous legal troubles and probably suspected them. It doesn't get much press, but the boys answered questions for days after the incident until Nifong demanded them all, including those not at the party, to provide hair, DNA, etc.
The Cops would definitely have ideas about individual guilt from those questions. So, those suspicions from the Police could easily be communicated during the lineup and the AV picked up on the cues. That is the exact reason for the ID rules they have.
OK. We have the explanation of why Finnerty and Evans. That makes sense. Seligman is still a puzzle. I'm betting the 4th guy wasn't in Durham. Cheshire alluded to that but he could have meant that she said she recognized someone that wasn't there not necessarily fingered him/them (no pun intended).
Does anyone know the racial composition of the grand jury (juries) that indicted the three Duke men?
Something strange about Seligmann's selection is that he was one of the players identified by the captains as not being present at the party, but she picked him anyway. I'm curious if Seligmann perhaps responded to McFadden's email, or something simliar that places him at the party. If the investigators truly believed he wasn't at the party, then I imagine they would have simply ignored his ID like they did the first person she ID'd.
I think that cop was Sgt. John Shelton, whose April 9 supplemental report is an attachment to Cheshire's motion. He was talking to his watch commander and was overheard by Durham officer Christopher Day, who reported the "20 guys raped her" comment.
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