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Thread III: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1311311/posts |
Posted on 09/18/2004 6:56:23 AM PDT by HairOfTheDog
Free Republic has a lot of horse people that have found each other on other threads…. And since we all like to talk horses, how about a thread where it is not off-topic, but is THE topic?
A few of us thought it would be interesting and informative to have a chat thread where we can share ideas, ask for input from other horsemen, and talk about our riding and horse-keeping. We have a lot of different kinds of riders and horses, and a lot to share. In the last thread we had a great time and were a great help to each other working through lessons and training, horse lamenesses and illnesses, questions and challenges and always just our stories we like to tell.
I always have a link to this thread on my profile page, so if you have something to say and can't find the thread in latest posts… look for it there and wake the thread up!
I also have a ping list for horse threads that are of interest, and Becky pings everyone most mornings. Let Becky (Paynoattentionmanbehindthecurtain) and/or me know if you would like to be on the ping list. As FreeRepublic is a political site, our politics and other issues will probably blend in…. There are many issues for horsemen that touch politics… land use, animal rights/abuse cases that make the news…. Legislation that might affect horse owners.
So... like the last thread, this is intended as fun place to come and share stories, pictures, questions and chit-chat, unguided and unmoderated and that we come together here as friends. There are lots of ways of doing things and we all have our quirks, tricks and specialties that are neat to learn about.
They're pretty good. BUT guineas are waaay BETTER! They're voracious bug hunters/eaters!!! AND they love ticks.
Well thanks. I really enjoy it. It's like always being on vacation when you live in a log cabin.
My old stud, Tuff, is an Impressive bred horse. He was sired by Impressive's Otoe who was sired by Impressive who was a grandson of Three Bars. Tuff's dam was Red Bars Missy who also had some Three Bars. Because of all the Three Bars influence, he's got too much TB to be considered for Foundation registration. And he is HYPP double negative.
I've got a general question for everybody. I've been working on that three year old I'm calling Cody. I started him out with a snaffle bit using a mecate on slobber straps. And I was having difficulty with his neck reining. Leg cues and then spurs didn't seem to help as he was still turning slow and sometimes only by pulling his head around. So Tuesday, after riding that way for a while, I decided I'd put a low port bit in his mouth and see what happened. Well damned if he didn't start neck reining like a pro. So yesterday I just went straight with the bit and he's neck reining great and turning on a dime.
My question is why didn't he respond to the snaffle? Has anybody else had a similar experience?
I'm originally from Goldsboro, NC. Where's your husband from?
Good morning,
He was born and raised in the Whiteville area. Aside from short stints to Texas, California, Europe and SE Asia, courtesy Uncle Sam, lived outside Fayetteville until ten years ago when I moved him to Nevada.
When you try and neck rein with a snaffle, you are pulling the bit basically through their mouth. The curb put pressure on the poll and chin when you laid the reins across his neck. Most horses I have seen ridden in a snaffle, are done with two hands. He was probably more comfortable in the curb.
I agree with everyone else. You do have a nice place. :)
I think MT's answer is probably enough, but the snaffle is a direct contact bit, and isn't the best for neck reining. When you neck rein with it, it puts pressure on the outside and sends a mixed message. A stiff curb (not hinged or jointed) is designed for neck reining and is not good for direct reining.
Do either of you have a suggestion then for our stud. My DIL rides him in a snaffle or a bosal. In both, if he does not wish to turn, he will go straight ahead - often with his head pulled clear around. I know - he's an appy so who knows. My DIL was thinking a baseball bat (and I think she's joking about that)
Does she want to neck rein him or direct rein him?
She is generally direct reining him - he's only been under saddle since June. Most of the time, he's very cooperative but every once in awhile, he does as he pleases.
Actually.... I'll give my answer because it's the same either way. The answer is leg yielding. Lots of cowboys apply outside leg in a turn, but outside leg alone is actually ~counter~ to good bending. The classic dressage turn would be to apply inside leg at the cinch, asking the horse to bend around the leg with rear feet tracing the arc of the circle to match the front track. Inside leg applied far back behind the cinch on a horse unwilling to bend will push his rear end around in a kind of skidding turn if you can imagine that, but it does accomplish the turn. Later on, the rear end can be prevented from swinging too wide by moving the outside leg back and applying inside leg at the cinch. does that make sense? I would work on his willingness to yield to leg to control his rear end, in addition to the rein to control the front. Then you can always control either. If I said she should work on shoulder-in and shoulder-out excercises would that mean anything to you? Does he do any leg yielding or sidepassing now?
Okay, the leg pressure you're describing I understand - I learned to ride that way years ago. She learned to ride western only so doubt she uses the inside leg much.
He does respond to leg pressure when he wishes to - I haven't seen her work him on sidepasses so that I don't know.
Shoulder in/out - no, that I don't understand. It seems the problem is not in his understanding her signals, it is that every once in awhile, he decides to just ignore her.
She had no problem rating him on the endurance ride, most of the time on trail he's alright, generally well behaved in the ring or exercising around barrels (she's using that to teach him to turn well) but then he just gets muley and decides that even is she insists he go right (or left) and she makes his head go that way, the rest of him is going straight.
Well, if he were pulling that on me, I'd apply hard heel far back on the inside and push his rear end around.
The shoulder in and out are exercises that work on supplenss and leg yielding, following a straight line down the arena wall with the horse canted diagonally to the track. In essence it's a trotting semi-half-pass.
I think all horses try this kind of muley "I'm not going to turn" kind of maneuver at some point. Barn sour horses, or horses being made to leave the group or whatever track they think is the right way to go.
I would do like I said above... Pull his head around and apply hard inside heel as far back as she can to push his hind end around as a corrective measure, then when he has turned, soften and do another circle around right there until he does it with the ease and suppleness you want.
I'll suggest that to her, that may work. She loves him dearly but occassionally, she really gets frustrated with his behavior.
You wonder sometimes what's in their heads - he really enjoys being worked and hitting the road, and you can see him light up when she shows up.
Well, he is a stallion, and Appys aren't know for being particular soft and sensitive ;~D It might be that she'd be a lot happier with a stronger bit than a snaffle or a bosal... one that she doesn't have to use so much muscle with. It is kinder to use a harsher bit mildly than a mild bit harshly.
It is great to bring home something from the tack shop. And they were having a great blanket sale. And they had a 40% off sale on winter riding breeches. I would have bought a pair, but had just enough money for a new helmet. I never liked troxels before, but after using them, they've grown on me.
My daughter wears a Troxel and loves it. Lots of ventilation for the summer heat.
My weakness is brushes and bits. I have a zillion bits and use maybe 3. The rest of them are tack room decoration, mostly. I see something interesting in the tack shop and think, hmmm I might need that... someday...
I can tell I'm a western rider:)
If I have a horse not wanting to turn I move my outside heel forward and bump them in the outside shoulder, usually with a spur.
I've also put them in a stall with their head tied around to the rigging on the saddle. Enough to bring their head and neck around but leave enough slack so that if they flex a little more they get relief from the pressure. About 10 minutes each direction.
They'll learn about the only way they can move comfortabley is in a turn, and to give to pressure.
Becky
Question on your post to cowboy on neck reining.
Is the bit used at all in neck reining. I don't know for sure, but I didn't think it was. I thought neck reining was useing the reins on their neck. That the solid bit was for one handed stops.
Becky
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