[BroJoeK]

DiogenesLamp: "*AFTER* Lincoln started a war with them.
That's fair game, *AFTER* someone invaded them first."

But, of course -- endless lies about it notwithstanding -- Lincoln didn't invade first and didn't start the Civil War.
In fact, there was no Union "invasion" of any Confederate state before the Confederate congress formally declared war on the United States on May 6, 1861.

Indeed, the Civil War's very first military invasions were Confederate forces into Union West Virginia and Missouri, in May 1861.
There were no Union military actions into Virginia until after Virginians formally declared secession and war against the United States, on May 23, 1861.

Further, there's a long list of Secessionists' invasions/seizures of Union properties before Fort Sumter on April 12, 1861.
Secessionist illegally seized Union properties in Union states before those states declared secession in:

1. Georgia
2. Alabama
3. Florida
4. North Carolina
5. Louisiana
6. Arkansas
7. Oklahoma

So, clearly, Confederates cared nothing about legalities of the Union's "sovereign territory", even before they declared war on the United States, May 9, 1861.

Union Fort Pulaski, Savanah, Georgia, seized by secessionists two weeks before Georgia declared secession, January 1861.

[DiogenesLamp]

But, of course -- endless lies about it notwithstanding -- Lincoln didn't invade first and didn't start the Civil War.

Disagree. And if we can't agree on basic facts, I don't really see the point of arguing with you.

Lincoln sent a fleet of warships with the intent of provoking the Confederates into attacking either the ships or the fort. He cleverly allowed the public orders to go out that the ships would attack, but secretly issued orders which would absolutely prevent them from attacking.

The Confederates, having seen only his public orders, believed the ships would attack, and as a consequence, acted. This gave Lincoln the excuse he needed to create a larger war and invade the South.

Lincoln started it.