[Garth Tater]

"It is utterly illusory to believe that your Second Amendment rights will do any more than hopefully deter the government from some tyrannical adventure."

For many of us the 2nd Amendment is not an illusionary defense Nathan, it is the acknowledged line in the sand that will bring blood if crossed and it is that threat of blood, not the line in the sand that slows down the evil coming our way.

Without that willingness to resist we would already be just as far down the path to the new order as our European brethren and without the 2nd Amendment we would be ripe for devisive attacks attempting to pull us apart based on exactly when each of us says no to our friends in high places - but with the 2nd Amendment being such a large part of our common heritage we are protected from that line of attack and stand together. Cross the line, pay the price. It's the American way. A gift from our Founders and not something to be placed on the table at a COS.

I don't know why you are going on about San Franciscans Nathan, but what really confuses me is why you, of all people, would be willing to give people like that a seat at a table where the future layout of our government would be discussed. No worries you say, our Republican friends would protect us... yeah right, as long as their price to switch sides isn't met.

You can put your faith in your Republican friends, but me, I'm going keep mine in free and well armed men. And while I'm at it, I'll be doing my best to keep a Convention of States from ever coming in to session.

[nathanbedford]

Thank you for quoting that portion of my last reply to you which expresses my hope that the Second Amendment will deter a tyrannical government. For the record, I fully support our constitutional right to keep and bear arms.

The problem is that if such a government can be deterred it is likely also to be amenable to the Democratic process. If the government is not amenable to the Democratic will and/or constitutional norms, middle-aged, potbellied men with small arms will do nothing but pitch the country into a dystopian hell because of the reasons which I cited in the reply that I linked in my last reply.

I share your patriotic horror at the notion of surrendering to a to radical left-wing government. We see enough of that today in Venezuela. When our founders acknowledged in the Constitution the "gift" to bear and keep arms, both the government and the people, like my ancestor, were armed with flintlocks. When subsequent generations of my ancestors took up arms against what they regarded to be a tyrannical federal government, they were armed with muzzle loaders but the government had slightly better arms and more of them and, more important, much better artillery. Today, the only chance for the insurrectionists against the world superpower is to wage a guerrilla war or to engage in terrorism. Even so, after much blood of innocents having unnecessarily been shed, they will lose.

All the red-blooded patriotic fervor will not change that. I will rent my rainments and put on sackcloth and ashes with you on the dark day that occurs. But I owe it to my children, and to your children if you have any, to spare them that needless pain and the futility.

That brings us to Article V. You want us to forgo a chance to save our children from tyranny by peaceful means for a chimerical hope that somehow small arms will defeat the superpower turned tyrant. That mindlessness is unfair to my children and to the children of every other patriotic American. To the degree that the NRA propaganda would sell out the rest of the Bill of Rights to protect their special interest, they deserve a special place in hell.

I have long posted on the subject. Years ago, I posted several times that I do not favor an Article V solution because I believe that state politicians are more righteous, or even less venal than federal politicians. I simply believe that their ambitions run along a different line, primarily a desire to enhance their power at the expense of the federal government. That is in keeping with the founders understanding of the nature of man, always to grasp for power. Right now we need to rein in federal power.

So I don't have any "Republican friends" anymore than the Framers had faith in factions, I put my faith where the Framers put their faith, in checks and balances, separation of powers, in constitutional provisions. I do not put my faith in a bunch of middle-aged fools who bear less relationship to modern martial realities than do reenactors, no matter how "free and well armed," no matter much they've been misled by the NRA.